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openness - 6/21/2010 5:26:44 AM

lally2

Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
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how do you guage and engage openness in youre sub or slave - are there moments or is it just a feeling - and what is that feeling for you, what does that bring out of you.

thank you x

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

Post #: 1

RE: openness - 6/21/2010 6:13:03 AM

Focus50

Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline

What's "openness" - as opposed to holding back or not being forthcoming about something? If that's all you mean then her eyes and general body language will give her away every time. The "stare" conquers all a sub has to hide.... lol

As to what it brings out in me? Simple, the need to know what's going on. You can't be out of the loop AND in control....

Focus.

_____________________________

Never underestimate the persuasive power of stupid people in large groups. <unknown>

Your food is for eating, not torturing. <my mum> (Errm, when I was a kid)

(in reply to lally2)

Post #: 2

RE: openness - 6/21/2010 8:41:45 AM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: lally2
how do you guage and engage openness in youre sub or slave - are there moments or is it just a feeling - and what is that feeling for you, what does that bring out of you.

To me, Carol's openness to me "How accessible her inner workings are to me." That occurs on both the outbound side, "How willing she is to share her thoughts, feelings, and emotions with me" and on the inbound side, "How willing she is to accept new thoughts, opinions, and emotions" from me.

It makes me feel open to her. In general, humans being a pack species, we tend to reciprocate attitudes. So it makes me feel open to her in return. All of which fosters intimacy between us.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to lally2)

Post #: 3

RE: openness - 6/21/2010 12:26:26 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
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Don't know about what others need, but I need to feel safe. Meaning that he won't seize on part of what I say to attack me. That he isn't so involved with his own agenda that he won't listen, but just talk over me. And so on.

No emotional safety, don't expect me to be vulnerable.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 4

RE: openness - 6/21/2010 3:24:59 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
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for us personally we're open about absolutely everything..nothing is held back and neither of us would have it any other way.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 5

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 6:17:30 AM

Kana

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Joined: 10/24/2006
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Fuck-I'm a pig. I want, and demand, everything. Nothing less will do so of course absolute openness is a demand. Now there are times I will grant her space, when I choose and on my terms, but she has zero areas of her life I don't have access too if I so desire.

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to littlewonder)

Post #: 6

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 7:28:29 AM

Aileen1968

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Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

Fuck-I'm a pig. I want, and demand, everything. Nothing less will do so of course absolute openness is a demand. Now there are times I will grant her space, when I choose and on my terms, but she has zero areas of her life I don't have access too if I so desire.

This is how it is in our relationship. Not only does it work mentally for me, but it's a huge turn on to be so exposed to him like this.

_____________________________

(in reply to Kana)

Post #: 7

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 7:58:25 AM

NuevaVida

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Joined: 8/5/2008
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I need to feel emotionally safe. I need to know he listens and hears me, and that my words count for something. This is the first relationship I've been in, in which I feel this way, and even a year into it, I'm still discovering just how safe I am. For me, it's how he responds to what I share - his words, expressions, body language, attentiveness, etc. He remembers what I've shared, and takes it into account going forward. I feel his love for me, and that's a first for me, too.

It's strange because I've always been something of an open book, but I never felt that what I had to say mattered very much. I think I just liked to hear myself talk, hahaha. In this relationship, it's hard to describe - I can just tell he is interested. I can just tell he is loving and careful with me. Because of some emotional damage that was done from a past relationship, there are areas I still struggle with being completely open about - so many of my core emotions were so exploited before. I trust this man will not do that, but the protective measures are there, regardless, and I believe time, consistency and love will remove them. Since he is so willing to take his time with this, I can relax with him and let those walls disintegrate on their own...and they are. I think because of my history, if he boldly started crashing through them, I'd have bolted.

_____________________________

Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.

(in reply to lally2)

Post #: 8

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 8:13:30 AM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida
I believe time, consistency and love will remove them.

*chuckles* Honestly, with time, consistency, and love as a foundation, pretty much anything can get accomplished.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to NuevaVida)

Post #: 9

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 8:54:32 AM

Kana

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Joined: 10/24/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

Fuck-I'm a pig. I want, and demand, everything. Nothing less will do so of course absolute openness is a demand. Now there are times I will grant her space, when I choose and on my terms, but she has zero areas of her life I don't have access too if I so desire.

This is how it is in our relationship. Not only does it work mentally for me, but it's a huge turn on to be so exposed to him like this.

Oh hell yes it is....and, might I add, it's a turn on for both of us. That vulnerability has exposed some deep root emotions and fears that I love to twist and torment her with. MMMMhhhhuuuuaaaaawwwwwwww

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to Aileen1968)

Post #: 10

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 5:31:53 PM

NuevaVida

Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida
I believe time, consistency and love will remove them.
*chuckles* Honestly, with time, consistency, and love as a foundation, pretty much anything can get accomplished.

And that's the goal. It's also a first for me, to have such a foundation.

_____________________________

Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 11

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 5:36:46 PM

Aileen1968

Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

Fuck-I'm a pig. I want, and demand, everything. Nothing less will do so of course absolute openness is a demand. Now there are times I will grant her space, when I choose and on my terms, but she has zero areas of her life I don't have access too if I so desire.

This is how it is in our relationship. Not only does it work mentally for me, but it's a huge turn on to be so exposed to him like this.

Oh hell yes it is....and, might I add, it's a turn on for both of us. That vulnerability has exposed some deep root emotions and fears that I love to twist and torment her with. MMMMhhhhuuuuaaaaawwwwwwww

Yeah...he kinda gets off on the whole "total exposure of me" thing too.

_____________________________

(in reply to Kana)

Post #: 12

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 6:20:20 PM

laurell3

Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

Fuck-I'm a pig. I want, and demand, everything. Nothing less will do so of course absolute openness is a demand. Now there are times I will grant her space, when I choose and on my terms, but she has zero areas of her life I don't have access too if I so desire.

You're not a pig, you're a cat.

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to Kana)

Post #: 13

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 7:01:24 PM

SirsJewel

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Joined: 3/23/2010
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i agree with many things Nueva said. Master works in a slow methodical way over time, so being lead to that openess and trust really helps, but i do not get the word No,so W/we do debate some things He's asked of me as well,within reason. He usually asks me"what do I need to know or be updated on?" i tell Him of anything of interest of my days activities,ask permission for the following day if there's a need beyond the normal structure,and if He feels there's corection or more in depth info required He asks me.

i would not reccomend a sub/slave give out her passwords and personal info in any short amount of time. Master now has this password and i know He can check but He rarely has a need to. He has my numbers to reach me, my two daughters numbers if i am there,and the openess feels earned as He recalls all the information given when W/we speak. Do what works for You but use common sense, for if anything goes wrong, it is on you as well. ~ jewels

i might add there is much more in depth issues i have yet to fully disclose to Him,but when the time is right i will because it's cleansing and He truly wants to know my past,what makes me tic. He doesn't behave bored,and it helps me be a better slave for Him overall and helps me grow as a person too.

< Message edited by SirsJewel -- 6/22/2010 7:18:07 PM >

_____________________________

God grant me the serenity to accept people for who they are and not whom i wish they could be ~ jewels

(in reply to laurell3)

Post #: 14

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 7:05:18 PM

aldompdx

Posts: 538
Joined: 10/24/2004
Status: offline

It is a dynamic process of either pushing preconceived limitations, or welcoming ever greater surrender. Guaging or measurement is relative, and thus not addressable as an absolute value.

And as you suggest, it is a feeling beyond mere intellectual or conceptual thinking (i.e. mental masturbation).

The feeling is one of sharing mutual fulfillment, a resonance.

(in reply to lally2)

Post #: 15

RE: openness - 6/22/2010 9:43:52 PM

SimplyMichael

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Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline

I am a complete failure in some areas that are typical of dominants but one area I think I really rock in is the ability to see not only when someone is holding something back but often what that something is. Sometimes it is just a lucky guess and other times I just "see" in some way. I don't think it is anything magical, my mother was a bit nutty and I think it comes from being super in tune with emotional states for my safety/sanity and thus I got really good at it.

Over the years I have learned the other side of that which is to provide a safe place for someone to tell you things I don't want to hear. That took me a very long time but the combination of both of those things has served me well.

(in reply to aldompdx)

Post #: 16

RE: openness - 6/23/2010 1:12:23 AM

lally2

Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

I am a complete failure in some areas that are typical of dominants but one area I think I really rock in is the ability to see not only when someone is holding something back but often what that something is.

Over the years I have learned the other side of that which is to provide a safe place for someone to tell you things I don't want to hear. That took me a very long time but the combination of both of those things has served me well.

ive highlighted those parts in blue because i think theyre so relevant or put another way, they are the nurturing element of the Dominant psyche that has bowled me over so much.

there have been relationships where my feelings were of no importance at all in a Ds or Ms relationship and i accepted that in fact i pretty much normalised that, in fact, looking back it pretty much worked in my favour

- so you were right in youre response on the other thread SM, i guess i did seek out people earlier on who were not interested (ive only just realised that) - can be veeerrry sloooowww sometimes. through normalising that i blocked out the men who DID want to know all of me. i suppose though that noone has actually said to me that they want me totally open in all ways - a few years ago that would have completely freaked me out, now i welcome it.

the nurturing safe place is what alot of subs have mentioned regarding this topic - but i realise too, its all about Dominants wanting ALL of you, not just the bits on show. and i dont think its just about knowing us so well that it facilitates theyre dominance - it is about owning all of what we are.

its another eureka moment for me and im finding it really exciting.

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 17

RE: openness - 6/23/2010 1:22:48 AM

lally2

Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: aldompdx

It is a dynamic process of either pushing preconceived limitations, or welcoming ever greater surrender. Guaging or measurement is relative, and thus not addressable as an absolute value.

And as you suggest, it is a feeling beyond mere intellectual or conceptual thinking (i.e. mental masturbation).

The feeling is one of sharing mutual fulfillment, a resonance.

i do see it as that - of actually pushing a person out of their bubble or their conceived bubble and helping them to expand beyond - you cant do that if you cant get inside their bubble - and actually by doing that and it going well, confidence in *you* the Dominant and in themselves the sub leads to greater and deeper surrender. the trust that we the sub put in you the Dominant goes far beyond the physical and it is the trust we put in *you* that makes it all the more rewarding and so many other things endlessly possible.

i think perhaps its this that when youre starting out on youre submissive journey that frightens the hell out of some people. its that whole 'am i going to lose myself and my identity'

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to aldompdx)

Post #: 18

RE: openness - 6/23/2010 1:32:46 AM

lally2

Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

I need to feel emotionally safe. I need to know he listens and hears me, and that my words count for something. This is the first relationship I've been in, in which I feel this way, and even a year into it, I'm still discovering just how safe I am. For me, it's how he responds to what I share - his words, expressions, body language, attentiveness, etc. He remembers what I've shared, and takes it into account going forward. I feel his love for me, and that's a first for me, too.

do you think you had to go through a certain amount of experience being a sub before you were able to accept that safe feeling, or have you always been a trusting person. do you think this is a skill youve picked up through learning about youreself.

i realise that ive had to go the route i have in order to do this now. im damn sure i wasnt ready for this at the start.

do you think the very fact that we talk about trust so much 'here' it becomes the goal in many ways - to submit entirely you need to be able to trust completely.

it wasnt that i didnt meet decent men back then, i did, i just didnt know what i was doing or how to let go, largely because i didnt trust myself to trust them so much.

....... and actually that question extends to anyone else who might have a thought on that.

< Message edited by lally2 -- 6/23/2010 1:33:21 AM >

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to NuevaVida)

Post #: 19

RE: openness - 6/23/2010 1:40:33 AM

lally2

Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline

i keep reading 'i need to feel safe' - ive just seen DesFip say it

not questining that, i completely agree.

that safety we need to feel has to come from within us too though i think - we need to feel that we have the internal elements within us that are strong enough to let go. ive always needed to feel safe but i havent always felt safe enough in myself to open up this fully.

Bear makes me feel safe, cherished, loved - its all there, but its still down to me in the end.

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to lally2)

Post #: 20

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