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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 10:55:24 AM

pahunkboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarlingSavage

Then there's that one about honoring your father and mother. What if your parents were abusive? Are you supposed to hang around even after you can leave and continue to suffer their abuse? That shit takes years and years of therapy to get over!

Lastly, you shouldn't drop a gauntlet and then run, that's a pussy move.

I took custody of my mom a year ago cuz my dad could no longer take care of her.The whole time I was doing that,my dad called me a prick and every other name and insult in the book.

I just took him over last week,taking him off of St Thomas and taking him directly to a hospital here in Jersey.He was incontinent and couldn`t stand or walk and wasn`t getting what he needed care wise and was getting bed sores,etc.He was laying in his own waste.I had to take him home with me.There was no other choice.

The whole time I was doing it,he called me a prick and every other name.

This honoring your parents thing isn`t all it cracked up to be.

I am so sorry.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 10:59:04 AM

tazzygirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarlingSavage

quote:

Ham wasnt's banished because he defiled Noah, his 'son' was. There have been various thoughts what that was, whether ridiculing, sodomy or sleeping with Noahs wife.

It's been a long time since I read the story, so I don't remember all the details ans I'm not gonna go look it up cause I don't keep a bible laying about the house. I've read it and I didn't like or agree with much of anything it had to say. But that's the story as I remember it. I don't know what the guy's name was, but Noah was snot slinging drunk and stripped his clothes off, his son came along and tried to get him cleaned up and dressed and since he saw Noah naked, this was considered dishonoring Noah, his father. Well, if Noah didn't want his son to see him naked, I guess he shouldn't have gotten shitfaced and stripped all his clothes off to the point someone had to come in and take care of him and cover him up and the rest of it. Turns out he really was a crazy old man, after all!

Thats not how its written. Ham didnt come along, he saw the whole thing. Once Noah passed out, Ham went and got his brothers, showing them their father's state. His brothers both averted their eyes, covered their heads, entered Noah's tent backwards and covered Noah's nakedness.

Ham attempted to dishonor his father by pointing out his fall from grace. His other sons refused to sink to the same level.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 12:13:37 PM

heartcream

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

I took custody of my mom a year ago cuz my dad could no longer take care of her.The whole time I was doing that,my dad called me a prick and every other name and insult in the book.

I just took him over last week,taking him off of St Thomas and taking him directly to a hospital here in Jersey.He was incontinent and couldn`t stand or walk and wasn`t getting what he needed care wise and was getting bed sores,etc.He was laying in his own waste.I had to take him home with me.There was no other choice.

The whole time I was doing it,he called me a prick and every other name.

This honoring your parents thing isn`t all it cracked up to be.

Another reason why I like you.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 12:18:39 PM

Icarys

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quote:

This honoring your parents thing isn`t all it cracked up to be.

The bible never said it was going to be easy. Your doing the right thing and I'm sure you know it.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 12:42:23 PM

DarlingSavage

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quote:

Thats not how its written. Ham didnt come along, he saw the whole thing. Once Noah passed out, Ham went and got his brothers, showing them their father's state. His brothers both averted their eyes, covered their heads, entered Noah's tent backwards and covered Noah's nakedness.

Ham attempted to dishonor his father by pointing out his fall from grace. His other sons refused to sink to the same level.

Like I said, I didn't remember the full story in detail. But maybe he went to get his brothers to help him take care of Noah? I mean, how can he get them to help him without showing them the state he's in?

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 12:47:18 PM

Moonhead

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What sort of name is "Ham" for a nice Jewish boy?

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 1:13:47 PM

RCdc

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarlingSavage

quote:

Ham wasnt's banished because he defiled Noah, his 'son' was. There have been various thoughts what that was, whether ridiculing, sodomy or sleeping with Noahs wife.

It's been a long time since I read the story, so I don't remember all the details ans I'm not gonna go look it up cause I don't keep a bible laying about the house. I've read it and I didn't like or agree with much of anything it had to say. But that's the story as I remember it. I don't know what the guy's name was, but Noah was snot slinging drunk and stripped his clothes off, his son came along and tried to get him cleaned up and dressed and since he saw Noah naked, this was considered dishonoring Noah, his father. Well, if Noah didn't want his son to see him naked, I guess he shouldn't have gotten shitfaced and stripped all his clothes off to the point someone had to come in and take care of him and cover him up and the rest of it. Turns out he really was a crazy old man, after all!

That isn't how the story goes at all.
Ham did not behave in the way that he was supposed to as dictated as should be done. His brothers were not around and Ham summond them.
The usual translation is that he dishonoured his father by attempting to show him in disgrace. His other sons did not wish to dishonour their father and did not look, instead covering him. Another translation is that the story might have suggested that he commited a sexual act either with his father or with his fathers wife, which is why Noah cursed his 'decendents'.

the.dark.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 1:23:35 PM

RCdc

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarlingSavage
Like I said, I didn't remember the full story in detail.

Not to sound funny,but how can you relate a story as an example that you do not even know?

quote:

But maybe he went to get his brothers to help him take care of Noah? I mean, how can he get them to help him without showing them the state he's in?

Getting help isn't the issue, it is what he did before and by getting them that is the focus of the tale. The translations are akin to sexual measures, not just viewing nakedness. The tale is more about taking something upon oneself without having the full picture and dealing outside of the law.

the.dark.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 1:57:57 PM

DarlingSavage

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

What sort of name is "Ham" for a nice Jewish boy?

LOL!

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 2:00:54 PM

DarlingSavage

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarlingSavage
Like I said, I didn't remember the full story in detail.

Not to sound funny,but how can you relate a story as an example that you do not even know?

quote:

But maybe he went to get his brothers to help him take care of Noah? I mean, how can he get them to help him without showing them the state he's in?

Getting help isn't the issue, it is what he did before and by getting them that is the focus of the tale. The translations are akin to sexual measures, not just viewing nakedness. The tale is more about taking something upon oneself without having the full picture and dealing outside of the law.

the.dark.

I don't know. I know NUSINK! You can torture me all you vant, but I vill never reveal the secret location of the fallen madonna viz ze big boobies.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 7:46:10 PM

thornhappy

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BTW, you can see atoms, with an atomic force microscope.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyCimarron
Not being able to see something does not prove that it does not exist. Science believes in many things that cannot be seen; first an foremost is the ATOM. Furthermore you can't see me right now, does that mean I don't exist.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 7:48:20 PM

Jeffff

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You can see smaller particles than that.

Ask the folks at Argon.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 7:59:28 PM

Cherylmazana

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Honour and its definition has changed over the centuries, as do translations of ancient stories details change and get lost.

After all killing a daughter who has been raped because of “honour” or gang warfare and killing innocent bystanders in the process are standards of modern “honour” today in some places, so why should we assume that ancient standards of honour are the same as our own when even different societies in our own era have different standards to our own.

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Genesis 9
18 The sons of Noah who came out of the ark were Shem, Ham and Japheth. (Ham was the father of Canaan.) 19 These were the three sons of Noah, and from them came the people who were scattered over the earth.
20 Noah, a man of the soil, proceeded to plant a vineyard. 21 When he drank some of its wine, he became drunk and lay uncovered inside his tent. 22 Ham, the father of Canaan, saw his father's nakedness and told his two brothers outside. 23 But Shem and Japheth took a garment and laid it across their shoulders; then they walked in backward and covered their father's nakedness. Their faces were turned the other way so that they would not see their father's nakedness.

24 When Noah awoke from his wine and found out what his youngest son had done to him, 25 he said,
"Cursed be Canaan!
The lowest of slaves
will he be to his brothers."

26 He also said,
"Blessed be the LORD, the God of Shem!
May Canaan be the slave of Shem.

27 May God extend the territory of Japheth;
may Japheth live in the tents of Shem,
and may Canaan be his slave."

< Message edited by Cherylmazana -- 6/27/2010 8:00:23 PM >

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 8:42:29 PM

DarlingSavage

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thornhappy

BTW, you can see atoms, with an atomic force microscope.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyCimarron
Not being able to see something does not prove that it does not exist. Science believes in many things that cannot be seen; first an foremost is the ATOM. Furthermore you can't see me right now, does that mean I don't exist.

An atomic force microscope reveals individual atoms of tin, lead, and silicon on a surface, highlighted in the image in blue, green, and red, respectively (Image: Oscar Custance)

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 8:44:49 PM

DarlingSavage

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The scanning tunneling microscope (STM) is an instrument with which one can image surfaces so finely that individual atoms are resolved. The STM can even move atoms about. The image on the left depicts the results of such a process. The images were obtained by scanning the surface with the same instrument.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/27/2010 11:21:13 PM

LadyCimarron

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Just because someone says they have a picture of something doesn't mean that's what it IS.

Science has faith that there is an atom and they have a pic of it.

Theolgists believe there is a God and they have a pic of him too.

Personally.... I doubt them both.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/28/2010 12:24:58 AM

DarlingSavage

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You don't believe in atoms?

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/28/2010 12:53:52 AM

LadyCimarron

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarlingSavage

You don't believe in atoms?

I don't believe in much of what science teaches us as"fact" and I am not the only one. Many people don't believe in the basic fundamentals of what science teaches us. I will save listing the christian and evangelical scientists that dispute it and focus on one of my most favorite and little know figures in science.

Ed Leedskalnin believed that most of what science teaches us as fact; is actually incorrect. http://coralcastle.com/ From 1923 to 1951, Ed single-handedly and secretly carved over 1,100 tons of coral rock, and his unknown process has created one of the world's most mysterious accomplishments......Scientists still cannot duplicate it or explain how he did it. So I'm inclined to believe he was correct when he says that science has it all wrong. While he did believe in "atoms." His version of what they are and how they work was completely different from what science believes and teaches us.

Way off topic but the point is whether science or religion it still boils down to what the individual believes. There are theories on both sides and its ok for all of us to believe something different. Trust me, I am not trying to save your soul.

One thing I totally agreed with Lance on, in the other thread was that the sun is going to rise whether one believes or not.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/28/2010 2:08:51 AM

DarlingSavage

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While that's impressive, it doesn't say anything about denying the discoveries of science. The thing with the scientific method is that experiments are done so that they can be replicated. If the same things happen over and over, then conclusions are drawn based on those observations, perhaps original hypotheses are reformed, then the experiment is performed again. It isn't something that just happened over night. It's a collection of knowledge and observations that have been found to be consistent over time. Sometimes, somebody finds out that one theory that's been held true for a while isn't exactly what we thought it was before, because through technology or some other discovery, we were able to look at a thing in a way that we hadn't been able to see it before.

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RE: Christ Wasnt Crucified: Scholar - 6/28/2010 4:19:37 AM

LadyCimarron

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarlingSavage

While that's impressive, it doesn't say anything about denying the discoveries of science.

http://www.leedskalnin.com/LeedskalninsPMH-CommonCoreConcept.html

Here is where he puts forth his own theory regarding the Atom. He basically believes that "magnets" are the basis of everything. He thinks there are no protons and electrons but instead there is a north and south magnetic pole.

Anyway if you are interested in science (which I know I am a little geeky in that area) He has fascinating theories. And some that are way ahead of his time. He described the "Cosmic Force" the force behind all life in the universe but he believed it to be a magnet current he described as as "double helix". His description fit the description of what we now know to be DNA. This was 6 years before Rosalind Franklin theorized that DNA was a double helix structure and 17 years before Crick Watson and Wilkins produced their DNA model which we is still used in science today.

Sorry- like I said I'm kinda geeky.

That's why I wanted to avoid going to deeply into science and theories. Anyway if you are interested http://www.leedskalnin.com/ He has some pretty amazing ideas and used them to build that park.

I know, only a weirdo geek such as myself would sit around reading this kind of crap.

I referenced Coral Castle because it is considered his greatest known accomplishment. A feat almost as great as the ancient pyramids. He did it in modern time; and science (whom he often said was wrong) cannot explain it or duplicate it. Until they can, his theories have a little more credibility than theirs.

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