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RE: Hands Off Social Security: There Are Better Ways to... - 6/28/2010 10:17:19 AM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline 		Some of you just DONT get it.

Social Security, was orginally created as a means to help eldarly US Citizens or those by situtation (disease, injury, genetic defect) to get money from the Federal Goverment, when they could not work. This was a huge success for the American worker, and was fight against with a mighty army of ignorant idiots (sort of like Health Care Reform this year). Being a goverment fund, and not privatized, has avoided many problems that have effected the market place. While the program is not fool proof (we do allow Republicans to draw from it too), it does have its own set of 'checks and balances'. Congress has a committe that oversees this and other programs that share, similair qualities.

It should not surprise anyone, that Social Security, is drawing on many more oftens then in previous dacades. Since, the Baby Boomer population is starting to leave the American workforce and retire. Some of those individuals made wise investing decisions, and many others did not. The Social Security program was developed for those who did not make good investments. It has been argued (as it is today), that the Federal Goverment should not be bailing people out, for making foolish mistakes in life. Ironically, many Republicans down in TX, MI, AL, and FL have been making this arguement for years. Why do I single those four states out? Isn't it obvious? They want the Federal Goverment to bail them out, for making foolish mistakes over the decades.

Opponents, in recent years, have claimed, that reducing the Social Security program, either cutting it, or privatizing it, would be, good for America. If you have read this far, you will know, that privatizition, is both illogical and foolish. If the person made bad finacial decisions when they could work, why would you think they make awesome financial decisions AFTER, they stopped working? Likewise, to dismantle the program, to, 'save America money', is usually argued by those, with money to burn. Yes, multi-millionaires hate, having to pay a system, they do not get to access in their retirement.

If they so desperately need to enjoy the Social Security program, they could give their money to charity. Or, just give it to me! I'll be happy, never to have to worry about Social Security in my life!

Removal of the Social Security program, to combat the growing deficit, is a fool's game. By any sane estimate, the good it would do (2-4% off the deficit each year), against the bad (the reason why the program was created) is quickly over shadowed.

(in reply to Archer)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Hands Off Social Security: There Are Better Ways to... - 6/28/2010 10:55:23 AM   
Archer


Posts: 3207
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline 		joether, since when do millionaires not get to access Social Security?

I'm not in this post recommending privatization or reduction or anything other than actually recognizing that the funding for social security is not going to be there.
It's going insolvent because the IOU's come from a group (40 decades of congresses) that have had no spending discipline and continue to increase spending and increase deficits, and it continues to snowball.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Hands Off Social Security: There Are Better Ways to... - 6/28/2010 11:48:47 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

Unfortunately, I have had my time consumed with the American health-care system, which was the worst healthcare system in the world and still is, thanks Barack.


Well maybe that's part of your problem. Oh and it's not Barack's fault that you have to go to Germany. He's not your president.


_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to Brain)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Hands Off Social Security: There Are Better Ways to... - 6/28/2010 12:03:47 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

I disagree change retirement age to 70 and the can is kicked down the road another 10 feet. More of the same crap that got us to this stage.

No solving of the problem happens until you get the US government actually reducing their regular budget items enough to cover the gap and pay back the 3 trillion dollars.
and since we have only GROWING Deficit Spending, the idea that they are capable of actually cutting spending enough that they pay on principle seem remote at best.



Fine, then increase the retirement age to 70 and increase the payroll tax by 3/4% and SS is solvent for 75 years. Want to think longer term than that and you dont believe in global warming catastrophes.

(in reply to Archer)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Hands Off Social Security: There Are Better Ways to... - 6/28/2010 3:50:29 PM   
Brain


Posts: 3792
Joined: 2/14/2007
Status: offline 		I am assuming the information in the article is correct. The article said the fund will become solvent again when the amount of benefits to be paid is reduced.

If not, it's not acceptable that this money has been spent on other programs. This money needs to be returned and any politician that doesn't help or cooperate will feel the people’s wrath at the polls. They had better come up with a way (value added tax) to repay what they took – everyone else has a VAT so get with the program not the Bush tax cuts for the rich garbage.

You said, “that rate has dropped in recent times to 2:1 and will soon be reaching the point of 1:3 or even more according to many estimates.” If this is true you need to loosen up your immigration policy needing more workers, it's inevitable.

Bill


quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

Brain you don't really have the information correct AGAIN.

Social Security money is not in a good safe investment.
All surplus money from Social Security has been "loaned" to the US government and spent to support programs in the regular budget.
The "trust fund" is holding a pocket full of Government IOUs, from a government who can't balance their budget as it is and has been using the surplus from the trust fund to do that so far.

The idea that the system will somehow balance itself again once the baby boomers quit collecting ignores a really basic premise. at the start of SSI there were 10 workers paying the social security for one beneficiary, that rate has dropped in recent times to 2:1 and will soon be reaching the point of 1:3 or even more according to many estimates.

ONE worker having to pay the social security benefits for 3 or 4 beneficiaries. So tell me how that is gong to work?
They will soon have to satart including a budget line item for paying back the loans the Government has taken on Social Security Trust Funds. Which means two things Not only has the additional "Free money" run out but the bill is now coming due meaning some other program is going to have to be cut to pay this, or the taxes will have to be raised.

There is only one thing holding the benefits of SS open for the people. And it's not law, nothing stops the Govenment from simply saying OK folks the system failed you get no benefits cause the trust fund is broke. The one thing they fear that is keeping them from that is votes.




(in reply to Archer)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Hands Off Social Security: There Are Better Ways to... - 6/28/2010 7:44:46 PM   
AnimusRex


Posts: 2165
Joined: 5/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy
Fine, then increase the retirement age to 70 and increase the payroll tax by 3/4% and SS is solvent for 75 years. Want to think longer term than that and you dont believe in global warming catastrophes.


Well, for once we agree-

SS is a purely numbers problem- how do we get a shrinking number of workers to take care of a balooning number of elderly?

Raising the payroll tax slightly helps;
raising the retirement age to 70 helps;
raising the earnings cap from $106K to something higher like $500K helps;
And of course, diverting the hundreds of billions we spend on wars to repayment of the IOUs from previous decades would help tremendously.

There are plenty of ways to close the gap, but we just need the will.

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Hands Off Social Security: There Are Better Ways to... - 6/29/2010 1:43:36 AM   
Brain


Posts: 3792
Joined: 2/14/2007
Status: offline 		Your an idiot saying stupid things all the time wasting my time with you making up stupid shit and me reading your crap. I spent time on US healthcare because I care about my family and friends in the US and we still got a shit bill.

Obama is not my president, what bullshit. Obama has nothing to do with me going to Germany; Harpo does. Dumbass.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

Unfortunately, I have had my time consumed with the American health-care system, which was the worst healthcare system in the world and still is, thanks Barack.


Well maybe that's part of your problem. Oh and it's not Barack's fault that you have to go to Germany. He's not your president.



(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 47
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