Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (Full Version)

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pahunkboy -> Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 2:02:01 PM)

Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy? In fact, Ron Paul told MSNBC that he believes that the Federal Reserve is more powerful than Congress…..






mnottertail -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 2:02:48 PM)

ron paul, big fuckin deal, a hasbeen nobody.




pahunkboy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 2:13:24 PM)

Oh really?

Then why is Rand and Peter Schiff a threat?




willbeurdaddy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 2:43:40 PM)

The Fed isnt "privately owned" in the sense that "ownership" is usually used and understood. [/thread]




rulemylife -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 2:53:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy?



Pahunk, it has been pointed out to you and documented for you numerous times by many different posters that this is not true.

Yet you persist in repeating it because some nutcase's website keeps telling you it is fact.

Get off PrisonPlanet and do some research on your own for once, instead of letting whack jobs like Alex tell you what to think. 




jlf1961 -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:04:21 PM)

PaHunkboy, you are once more posting a conspiracy websites false bullshit.  The fact is that the FED is owned by member banks who own a set amount of stock in the Fed, and the majority stock holder is the Fed itself.

Read the information for yourself, or better yet, use the freedom of information act to get the documents proving that these conspiracy idiots are lieing out their ass




pahunkboy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:05:21 PM)

You should hear what Bob Chapman says.   Alex is too easy on the private central bank.




rulemylife -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:09:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

You should hear what Bob Chapman says.   Alex is too easy on the private central bank.


I know.

Alex isn't quite enough of a whack job, old Bob takes insanity to a new level.




pahunkboy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:11:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

PaHunkboy, you are once more posting a conspiracy websites false bullshit.  The fact is that the FED is owned by member banks who own a set amount of stock in the Fed, and the majority stock holder is the Fed itself.

Read the information for yourself, or better yet, use the freedom of information act to get the documents proving that these conspiracy idiots are lieing out their ass



Prove it.   You are WRONG.... again.




jlf1961 -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:13:34 PM)

Why should I read what Chapman has to say, he is the financial equivalent to Glen Beck




pahunkboy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:18:56 PM)

You are funny.  US embasssies around the world do not read Becks stuff.   They do read The International Forecaster.   He

  Mr. Chapman is 72 years old. He was born in Boston, MA and attended Northeastern University majoring in business management. He spent three years in the U. S. Army Counterintelligence, mostly in Europe. He speaks German and French and is conversant in Spanish. He lived in Europe for six years, off and on, three years in Africa, a year in Canada and a year in the Bahamas.    Mr. Chapman became a stockbroker in 1960 and retired in 1988. For 18 of those years he owned his own brokerage firm. He was probably the largest gold and silver stockbroker in the world during that period. When he retired he had over 6,000 clients.    From 1962 through 1976 he specialized in South African gold shares. He and his family lived in Salisbury, Rhodesia (now Harare, Zimbabwe) and Johannesburg, South Africa from 1970 to 1973. During that time he did a great deal of further study into the South African mining industry.    Mr. Chapman belonged to The Traders Association for 25 years. He did all his own trading. During his South African years some was done directly through Johannesburg, but 95% was done through London brokerage firms. Hence, he has extensive contacts, both in London and on the Continent.    Starting in 1967 Mr. Chapman began writing articles on business, finance, economics and politics having been printed and reprinted over the years in over 200 publications. He owned and wrote the Gary Allen Report, which had 30,000 subscribers. He currently is owner and editor of The International Forecaster, a compendium of information on business, finance, economics and social and political issues worldwide, which reaches 10,000 investors and brokers monthly directly, and parts of his publication are picked up by 60 different websites weekly exposing his ideas to over 10 million investors a week.    In 1976, after the Soweto riots, Mr. Chapman began buying North American shares exclusively for his clients. Up to that point only a handful of American and Canadian issues interested him, due to the high dividends the South African shares had paid out over the years. Between 1976 and 1988 his business surged from 1,000 to 6,000 clients, so the bulk of his business ended up being Vancouver Stock Exchange issues. For this reason he is very conversant with the quality of management, geologists, properties and traders on today’s North American scene. He is well known.    From 1976 to present he has spoke and given workshops at over 200 business conferences worldwide, and has been on radio and TV hundreds of times. Until his retirement he was always judged by the attendees to be one of the top three speakers and never once was lower than first in workshops due to his vast knowledge of the mining business and his grasp of worldwide financial markets and political scenes.    In June of 1991, at the request of business associates, and due to retirement boredom, he began writing the International Forecaster.
Home




rulemylife -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:19:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

PaHunkboy, you are once more posting a conspiracy websites false bullshit.  The fact is that the FED is owned by member banks who own a set amount of stock in the Fed, and the majority stock holder is the Fed itself.

Read the information for yourself, or better yet, use the freedom of information act to get the documents proving that these conspiracy idiots are lieing out their ass



Prove it.   You are WRONG.... again.



Prove it to yourself, the information is readily available.

You just prefer to believe in fantasy.




pahunkboy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:20:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

PaHunkboy, you are once more posting a conspiracy websites false bullshit.  The fact is that the FED is owned by member banks who own a set amount of stock in the Fed, and the majority stock holder is the Fed itself.

Read the information for yourself, or better yet, use the freedom of information act to get the documents proving that these conspiracy idiots are lieing out their ass



Prove it.   You are WRONG.... again.



Prove it to yourself, the information is readily available.

You just prefer to believe in fantasy.



I tho am a PAID subscriber.   You aren't.




stef -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:21:48 PM)

Please stop being insane.

~stef




jlf1961 -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:28:26 PM)

quote:

Who owns the Federal Reserve? The Federal Reserve System is not "owned" by anyone and is not a private, profit-making institution. Instead, it is an independent entity within the government, having both public purposes and private aspects. As the nation's central bank, the Federal Reserve derives its authority from the U.S. Congress. It is considered an independent central bank because its decisions do not have to be ratified by the President or anyone else in the executive or legislative branch of government, it does not receive funding appropriated by Congress, and the terms of the members of the Board of Governors span multiple presidential and congressional terms. However, the Federal Reserve is subject to oversight by Congress, which periodically reviews its activities and can alter its responsibilities by statute. Also, the Federal Reserve must work within the framework of the overall objectives of economic and financial policy established by the government. Therefore, the Federal Reserve can be more accurately described as "independent within the government." The twelve regional Federal Reserve Banks, which were established by Congress as the operating arms of the nation's central banking system, are organized much like private corporations--possibly leading to some confusion about "ownership." For example, the Reserve Banks issue shares of stock to member banks. However, owning Reserve Bank stock is quite different from owning stock in a private company. The Reserve Banks are not operated for profit, and ownership of a certain amount of stock is, by law, a condition of membership in the System. The stock may not be sold, traded, or pledged as security for a loan; dividends are, by law, 6 percent per year.


http://www.federalreserve.gov/generalinfo/faq/faqfrs.htm




pahunkboy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:33:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

quote:

Who owns the Federal Reserve? The Federal Reserve System is not "owned" by anyone and is not a private, profit-making institution. Instead, it is an independent entity within the government, having both public purposes and private aspects. As the nation's central bank, the Federal Reserve derives its authority from the U.S. Congress. It is considered an independent central bank because its decisions do not have to be ratified by the President or anyone else in the executive or legislative branch of government, it does not receive funding appropriated by Congress, and the terms of the members of the Board of Governors span multiple presidential and congressional terms. However, the Federal Reserve is subject to oversight by Congress, which periodically reviews its activities and can alter its responsibilities by statute. Also, the Federal Reserve must work within the framework of the overall objectives of economic and financial policy established by the government. Therefore, the Federal Reserve can be more accurately described as "independent within the government." The twelve regional Federal Reserve Banks, which were established by Congress as the operating arms of the nation's central banking system, are organized much like private corporations--possibly leading to some confusion about "ownership." For example, the Reserve Banks issue shares of stock to member banks. However, owning Reserve Bank stock is quite different from owning stock in a private company. The Reserve Banks are not operated for profit, and ownership of a certain amount of stock is, by law, a condition of membership in the System. The stock may not be sold, traded, or pledged as security for a loan; dividends are, by law, 6 percent per year.


http://www.federalreserve.gov/generalinfo/faq/faqfrs.htm




Not true.

If this were true- we would have no national debt.  We make the money up= so we could simply make up money and thus would not "owe" a debt to any bank.

If we are the bank- and we owe the debt to ourself- then we are not actually in debt.

See?




pahunkboy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:35:28 PM)

When you consider administrative costs-  that still does not explain  11 trillion in debt.

The govt makes up the currency- so it is not possible to owe this if we in fact own it.

This was illustrated when I asked you to pay me $20.    No one on the board paid me $20.  




pahunkboy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:39:03 PM)

61,  if you write up the question, I would be more then happy to send it into Chapman where he most likely will send a reply.







jlf1961 -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:51:47 PM)

Hunk, you cant be that stupid, honestly, you cant.  The United States is not in debt to the Fed, in what corner of your fantasy world did you come up with that?

The United States debt is explained as follows:

The national debt is presented by the United States Treasury as two calculations: "Debt Held by the Public", defined as U.S. Treasury securities held by institutions outside the United States Government, and the "Gross Debt," which includes intra-government obligations (e.g., the Social Security Trust fund). As of June 1, 2010, the Total Public Debt Outstanding was approximately 88.9% of GDP, and for the first time exceeded $13 trillion.  Within the remainder of this article the phrase "Public Debt" is employed as a shorthand for "Debt Held by the Public". The annual government deficit or surplus refers to the cash difference between government receipts and spending ignoring intra-governmental transfers. The gross debt increases or decreases as a result of this unified budget deficit or surplus. However, there is certain spending (supplemental appropriations) that add to the gross debt but are excluded from the deficit. The total debt has increased over $500 billion each year since fiscal year (FY) 2003, with increases of $1 trillion in FY2008 and $1.9 trillion in FY2009.

Another point that I should make is from business, a Corporation may own subsidiaries, as I am sure you are aware.  Each company has separate books.  If Company A transfers an amount of money to subsidiary C, then C owes a debt to Company A, on the books, and in fact.  It is simple accounting.

The central bank allows for a means of transferring money from one bank member to another, AND in the government sense, from the Central Bank to a government agency.  There is still a balance sheet to consider so the government agency owes money to the central bank.  Again, basic accounting practice. 

Besides the debt owed publicly there is the following to also consider,:
China = $350 billion
"That’s leaves a little over $4 trillion in public hands. The biggest chunk (about 25 percent of the $8.5 trillion total) is held by foreign governments. Japan tops the list (with $644 billion), followed by China ($350 billion), United Kingdom ($239 billion) and oil exporting countries ($100 billion)."
Source: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17424874/
Read more: How much money does the U.S. owe China? | Answerbag http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/368960#ixzz0sqp8toqL

Hunk, any first year accounting student could tell you how intra company lending is done, how it is shown, and the same is true for intra agency lending within the US government.  There is always a credit and debit, the debit is a debt or liability against the total assets of the parent entity.




willbeurdaddy -> RE: Is America Really Free, If A Privately-Owned Central Bank Controls Our Currency And Runs Our Economy (7/5/2010 3:57:26 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Hunk, you cant be that stupid, honestly, you cant.  The United States is not in debt to the Fed, in what corner of your fantasy world did you come up with that?

The United States debt is explained as follows:

The national debt is presented by the United States Treasury as two calculations: "Debt Held by the Public", defined as U.S. Treasury securities held by institutions outside the United States Government, and the "Gross Debt," which includes intra-government obligations (e.g., the Social Security Trust fund). As of June 1, 2010, the Total Public Debt Outstanding was approximately 88.9% of GDP, and for the first time exceeded $13 trillion.  Within the remainder of this article the phrase "Public Debt" is employed as a shorthand for "Debt Held by the Public". The annual government deficit or surplus refers to the cash difference between government receipts and spending ignoring intra-governmental transfers. The gross debt increases or decreases as a result of this unified budget deficit or surplus. However, there is certain spending (supplemental appropriations) that add to the gross debt but are excluded from the deficit. The total debt has increased over $500 billion each year since fiscal year (FY) 2003, with increases of $1 trillion in FY2008 and $1.9 trillion in FY2009.

Another point that I should make is from business, a Corporation may own subsidiaries, as I am sure you are aware.  Each company has separate books.  If Company A transfers an amount of money to subsidiary C, then C owes a debt to Company A, on the books, and in fact.  It is simple accounting.

The central bank allows for a means of transferring money from one bank member to another, AND in the government sense, from the Central Bank to a government agency.  There is still a balance sheet to consider so the government agency owes money to the central bank.  Again, basic accounting practice. 

Besides the debt owed publicly there is the following to also consider,:
China = $350 billion
"That’s leaves a little over $4 trillion in public hands. The biggest chunk (about 25 percent of the $8.5 trillion total) is held by foreign governments. Japan tops the list (with $644 billion), followed by China ($350 billion), United Kingdom ($239 billion) and oil exporting countries ($100 billion)."
Source: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17424874/
Read more: How much money does the U.S. owe China? | Answerbag http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/368960#ixzz0sqp8toqL

Hunk, any first year accounting student could tell you how intra company lending is done, how it is shown, and the same is true for intra agency lending within the US government.  There is always a credit and debit, the debit is a debt or liability against the total assets of the parent entity.



Good post. Next you can explain to these ___________(fill in your own perjorative) that intra-Government obligations are no less real than any other kind of debt, and when Gross Debt grows it is because of deficit spending.




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