RE: I am not a racist. (Full Version)

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BoiJen -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 11:13:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: flcouple2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen
White folk are happy being called white folk. Now get with the damned program.


There are no groups that still like to call themselves Italian-American, Irish-American, and such?  I remember it being pointed out the Jindal was Indian-American during the Louisiana Governor's election



I didn't pay much attention to the Governor's race. I did notice his presence during this oil spill mess and the news media mentioning his race...not him. That would be on the news, not the Governor.

I've been to Greek festivals, Italian food tastings, China towns in multiple cities, etc. I haven't yet seen a an angry individual at any of those events or locations demanding that they get addressed as "Italian-Americans", "Irish-Americans", "Chinese-Americans"...nor have I read national news of such ethnic groups kicking up a fuss about not being recognized as different enough. The only time I've seen these referenced differences in real life application is through school text (the melting pot stuff) and in the news with the news being the source of the need to differentiate.

boi




AsmodaisSin -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 11:18:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin

I would like to agree with Jen on the whole African American terminology.  My mother was born in Africa.  Northern Rhodesia which is now Zambia.  I have more right to label myself as African American, but frankly, that's just too damned much assumption on my part.  I'll stick with being called American.  How 'bout them apples?

That explains a lot.


Meaning? 

quote:

It is their fault that they have a militant group of black men running around terrorizing voters, acting like fools, and overall giving themselves a bad name.  THAT is why racism is still alive boys and girls.  Because people see those guys from the black panthers and freak out.  Whatever was ingrained in our white little brains decades ago to see that and be fearful, I don't know what it is, but it's still prevalent today. When a group of people have massive deviance from where they want to go and be, they reprimand them. Instead, a large group, or at least, that's what I see, of the black community, just stand there and go, "Well, I don't know if I agree with them or not, but the white man ain't gonna stop 'em 'cause that would be racist!" The American government is scared shitless it seems, including Bush, Holder, and the entire DOJ, to do anything about that organization or any other. They were bullying voters. If the KKK did that, they'd be arrested and sentenced to hate crimes.

quote:

This has to be one of the most profoundly wrong things ever written on this board. Racism is not the fault of all of any "racial" group no matter whether some members of those groups are racist.

As to terrorizing voters you need to look at that video again. No one except the instigators are paying any attention to the Black Panthers. If you think people are terrorized by a guy standing around holding a nightstick then you might want to go to Israel and see what being terrorized actually looks like.


I did watch the video.  I also did some more research.  This what the man standing outside had to say.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLWmo2kCa8o&feature=related
http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/series/inside/3952/Overview#tab-Videos/06254_00 


quote:

I'm just sick and tired of the double standard.  Either you want to be treated equally or you want preferential treatment.  Either you get treated equally or you continue to breed racism, discrimination, resentment.  Most white people look at institutions like affirmative action and spit in disgust at being passed over by someone because of color of skin.  What was once supposed to ease the wounds of discrimination only bred more.

When the oppressors become the oppressed, they begin to resent, hate, and seethe.  Eventually, I think they'll get tired enough to fight back.  I don't think that that's a good idea. 

Double standard?

"white" names more likely to be interviewed than "black" names.
http://www.nber.org/papers/w9873

After routine traffic stops blacks are more likely to have their car searched than whites.
http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/cpp02.pdf

Any white person who claims to be oppressed on account of their racial identity in this country has no idea what oppression really is.


That's kind of a disrespectful statement.  White people can't be oppressed?  Discriminated against?  Treated badly?  It's only minorities?

Edit:  Damn.  It butchered the quotes.  Oops.




Owner59 -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 11:44:18 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

Jen,it goes deeper than any dictionary can teach.

It has to be lived.How names are defined now will change.

How you see them will change over time.



See? This is where the assumption is. The assumption is that the OP (me in this case) hasn't experienced prejudice to the point of pain because of the stance they (I) have taken on the subject.

I was one of two white kids in an entire neighborhood as a child...the other was my younger brother. Guess who got "oppressed" and got their asses kicked? It wasn't the black kids swinging their fists. So if you think I don't turn around ready to fight when I hear "yo, cracker!"...you made an assumption. If you don't think this an example of racism, then you haven't been paying attention.

My father is a homophobe. No joke, it freaks his shit out enough to become violent. Broke my nose...more than once. There's a reason I haven't spoken to the man since I left home...and hit a children's shelter, refusing to go back. If you don't think that my initial reaction to hearing "dyke!" down the street is to turn around ready to fight, then you're wrong.  I've already lived it.

What I got from those experiences and the experiences of hearing words like "breeder", used negatively, is that some people are duchebags and use words as a warning for future intent. What I got from spending time making friends with individuals of all races, backgrounds, sexual orientations is that those hate filled mother fuckers are the minority these days and that words are words. It's not the words that hurt, it's the people using them with the intent to hurt.

boi

BTW for those who aren't familiar with Florida history or culture. In Florida, "Cracker" is a historical term and is used frequently. The reason is because of the historical introduction of horses to the North American continent through the area now know as Florida. Because of materials made available the last known whip variation was developed here, in Florida, and horse ranchers were known for being heard for miles around, practicing their whip cracking at night. Hence, "Florida crackers".


Sorry if it came off that way.Not my intention.

But experiencing racism and sexism isn`t very far apart in terms of the damage done,harm felt and bad feelings.

In fact,woman are worked against and harmed as much as any racial group in terms of numbers.

That would put black woman at the bottom.It theory,gay black woman are lower on the totem poll.

These are two groups that should be working sholder to sholder in this effort.





rulemylife -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 11:45:06 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin

It is their fault that they have a militant group of black men running around terrorizing voters, acting like fools, and overall giving themselves a bad name.  THAT is why racism is still alive boys and girls.  Because people see those guys from the black panthers and freak out.  Whatever was ingrained in our white little brains decades ago to see that and be fearful, I don't know what it is, but it's still prevalent today.  When a group of people have massive deviance from where they want to go and be, they reprimand them.  Instead, a large group, or at least, that's what I see, of the black community, just stand there and go, "Well, I don't know if I agree with them or not, but the white man ain't gonna stop 'em 'cause that would be racist!"  The American government is scared shitless it seems, including Bush, Holder, and the entire DOJ, to do anything about that organization or any other.  They were bullying voters.  If the KKK did that, they'd be arrested and sentenced to hate crimes. 

I'm just sick and tired of the double standard.  Either you want to be treated equally or you want preferential treatment.




There is no double standard.

Instead of listening to the idiots on television may I suggest you read the actual facts of the case?

I know it's a lot of reading but it might help to inform yourself before jumping to hasty conclusions.

Transcript of 5-14-10 NBPP Hearing




BoiJen -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 11:47:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

Sorry if it came off that way.Not my intention.

But experiencing racism and sexism isn`t very far apart in terms of the damage done,harm felt and bad feelings.

In fact,woman are worked against and harmed as much as any racial group in terms of numbers.

That would put black woman at the bottom.It theory,gay black woman are lower on the totem poll.

These are two groups that should be working sholder to sholder in this effort.




Well socially speaking, Latino women and Latino gay men, in America, face the highest rate of discrimination and random violence. I'll find my link....I know you want it.




LaTigresse -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 11:50:37 AM)

Using fast reply.......

It has been my experience that a person that has felt repressed or discriminated against will quite often feel that their discrimination and repression was the worst, or nearly so. That others that have suffered have somehow not suffered as much as they, and those like them, have.

Personally, I think we would ALL be better off if we focused our energy less on the negative but moreso on the positive of change. Regardless of the differences of our negatives. If we all are focused on treating one another as human beings rather than black, white, purple, male, female, handicapped, whatever......we can find a common ground. Until then, we are only feeding the negative and keeping it alive.




AsmodaisSin -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 12:02:15 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Using fast reply.......

It has been my experience that a person that has felt repressed or discriminated against will quite often feel that their discrimination and repression was the worst, or nearly so. That others that have suffered have somehow not suffered as much as they, and those like them, have.

Personally, I think we would ALL be better off if we focused our energy less on the negative but moreso on the positive of change. Regardless of the differences of our negatives. If we all are focused on treating one another as human beings rather than black, white, purple, male, female, handicapped, whatever......we can find a common ground. Until then, we are only feeding the negative and keeping it alive.



This I can agree with.  You redeemed yourself after that comment about Texans.  ^_^ 




DomKen -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 12:03:12 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin
I did watch the video. 

You did?
Here it is.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGbKHyGuHU

Where is the terror? No one is running. No one is cowering or other wise indicating fear. As a matter of fact someone clearly states "everything's fine" to the cameraman's breathless inquiry.

The entire incident has been completely blown out of proprtion up by FauxNews.

No matter what nothing the NPP does or says is justification for continued anti black bigotry.




flcouple2009 -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 12:04:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

quote:

ORIGINAL: flcouple2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen
White folk are happy being called white folk. Now get with the damned program.


There are no groups that still like to call themselves Italian-American, Irish-American, and such?  I remember it being pointed out the Jindal was Indian-American during the Louisiana Governor's election



I didn't pay much attention to the Governor's race. I did notice his presence during this oil spill mess and the news media mentioning his race...not him. That would be on the news, not the Governor.

I've been to Greek festivals, Italian food tastings, China towns in multiple cities, etc. I haven't yet seen a an angry individual at any of those events or locations demanding that they get addressed as "Italian-Americans", "Irish-Americans", "Chinese-Americans"...nor have I read national news of such ethnic groups kicking up a fuss about not being recognized as different enough. The only time I've seen these referenced differences in real life application is through school text (the melting pot stuff) and in the news with the news being the source of the need to differentiate.

boi



"I didn't pay much attention",  that means you have no idea, correct?  You just want things to fit your box.

I know too many people from Boston and New York who will still tell you they are Italian or Irish.  have any of them actually been to either?  No, but that doesn't change their view.  Also highly racist, but that's a different discussion.




Arpig -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 12:06:23 PM)

You guys have it so easy in the States...up here you have to get a person to talk before you know if they are to be downtrodden or not.




AsmodaisSin -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 12:10:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin
I did watch the video. 

You did?
Here it is.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGbKHyGuHU

Where is the terror? No one is running. No one is cowering or other wise indicating fear. As a matter of fact someone clearly states "everything's fine" to the cameraman's breathless inquiry.

The entire incident has been completely blown out of proprtion up by FauxNews.

No matter what nothing the NPP does or says is justification for continued anti black bigotry.


There aren't many people out there, actually, but I would feel very uncomfortable if I was walking up there.  Anyone who says they're just there on an afternoon stroll is either an idiot or completely and totally blind.  He is carrying a weapon.  They both look very intimidating, and after watching the other videos with him as the lead, he's not someone I'd want to go near in any capacity. 

A girlfriend of mine works the polls, and she would have called the cops on them. Just sayin'. 




BoiJen -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 12:12:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: flcouple2009
"I didn't pay much attention",  that means you have no idea, correct?  You just want things to fit your box.

I know too many people from Boston and New York who will still tell you they are Italian or Irish.  have any of them actually been to either?  No, but that doesn't change their view.  Also highly racist, but that's a different discussion.


Never once in visiting New York did I have someone exclaim to me that they are "Italian-American". I am the third generation of American from an Irish family (the Keeleys, formerly O'Keeleys, but getting a job was easier without the "O'", cousins to the Kellys-so I'm told). And not a damn one of us, blond or red headed, drunk or sober, in Georgia or New Jersey, have an inkling to call ourself "Irish-Americans" because, damnit we're Americans.

No, it's not about fitting into my neat little box. It's about my experience. My experience tells me that groups from other ethnic backgrounds like their food the way they like their food but treasure being 100% American and don't have a need to call out being "discriminated" against or finding another damned thing wrong with their now politically correct term of identification.

Neat how it works out to dismiss a person's conclusions from actual experience as racism.

boi

edited...Irish-mother's side




DomKen -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 12:25:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin
I did watch the video. 

You did?
Here it is.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGbKHyGuHU

Where is the terror? No one is running. No one is cowering or other wise indicating fear. As a matter of fact someone clearly states "everything's fine" to the cameraman's breathless inquiry.

The entire incident has been completely blown out of proprtion up by FauxNews.

No matter what nothing the NPP does or says is justification for continued anti black bigotry.


There aren't many people out there, actually, but I would feel very uncomfortable if I was walking up there.  Anyone who says they're just there on an afternoon stroll is either an idiot or completely and totally blind.  He is carrying a weapon.  They both look very intimidating, and after watching the other videos with him as the lead, he's not someone I'd want to go near in any capacity. 

A girlfriend of mine works the polls, and she would have called the cops on them. Just sayin'. 


I've served as a poll worker in the past and your gf would be wrong. False police statement felony wrong.

They weren't electioneering. Until and unless they actually threatened someone overtly they had as much legal right to be present as anyone else.





rulemylife -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 12:38:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin

A girlfriend of mine works the polls, and she would have called the cops on them. Just sayin'. 



What would the cops have charged them with?




DomYngBlk -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 1:03:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
Great another fucking story from someone saying they are white and oppressed by being a "minority" . Will the comedy ever end?

You don't think that being a member of the LGBT community makes a person a minority?



Not saying that at all. She was coming at me as a "white" person not a person of the LGBT community




DomYngBlk -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 1:05:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

Then all words are fine then? So I assume you'd tell Phoebe Prince , kids like her and her parents to just grow some and get over it. Day after day those 9 throwing just words at her. What was her problem.?....I mean it isn't your place to make an assumption about how and why someone is using a certain word in any given situation .....In your mind she should have just gotten over it? No big deal, they are just words.


A child killing themselves is on the adults involved...or in some cases not involved. Not words.

boi



And if you actually believe that you are one fucked up individual. Please stay where the fuck you are.


Honey,
I didn't come to you, you came to me.

boi



So help me out. Those 9 kids that were after Pheobe Prince should just walk on home? No problems?




BoiJen -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 1:08:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
Great another fucking story from someone saying they are white and oppressed by being a "minority" . Will the comedy ever end?

You don't think that being a member of the LGBT community makes a person a minority?



Not saying that at all. She was coming at me as a "white" person not a person of the LGBT community


Seriously?




DomYngBlk -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 1:22:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

quote:

ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin

I would like to agree with Jen on the whole African American terminology.  My mother was born in Africa.  Northern Rhodesia which is now Zambia.  I have more right to label myself as African American, but frankly, that's just too damned much assumption on my part.  I'll stick with being called American.  How 'bout them apples?

Now, it isn't blacks' fault that their own people sold them to the Americans.  It isn't their fault that they were brought here and brutalized for many many many years.  It isn't their fault that they were treated like shit.  It isn't their fault that they were made to be less than human for a long, long time.  It is their fault that they have a militant group of black men running around terrorizing voters, acting like fools, and overall giving themselves a bad name.  THAT is why racism is still alive boys and girls.  Because people see those guys from the black panthers and freak out.  Whatever was ingrained in our white little brains decades ago to see that and be fearful, I don't know what it is, but it's still prevalent today.  When a group of people have massive deviance from where they want to go and be, they reprimand them.  Instead, a large group, or at least, that's what I see, of the black community, just stand there and go, "Well, I don't know if I agree with them or not, but the white man ain't gonna stop 'em 'cause that would be racist!"  The American government is scared shitless it seems, including Bush, Holder, and the entire DOJ, to do anything about that organization or any other.  They were bullying voters.  If the KKK did that, they'd be arrested and sentenced to hate crimes. 

I'm just sick and tired of the double standard.  Either you want to be treated equally or you want preferential treatment.  Either you get treated equally or you continue to breed racism, discrimination, resentment.  Most white people look at institutions like affirmative action and spit in disgust at being passed over by someone because of color of skin.  What was once supposed to ease the wounds of discrimination only bred more.

When the oppressors become the oppressed, they begin to resent, hate, and seethe.  Eventually, I think they'll get tired enough to fight back.  I don't think that that's a good idea. 




And just like dear ole mom you probably think Apartheid is something that should be imported here. I've read a lot of fucked up things here...but that one I think gets first prize. Fucked up enough to believe any of your own bullshit?


No, I don't believe that at all.  All I'm saying is that maybe people should stop pointing fingers at the "white man" and start looking at themselves to blame.  Or rather, not so much blame, but responsibility.  The history of this country is gruesome and awful.  Between the massive abuses to the then African Americans and to the American Indians, our history is a dark one.  I won't deny that.  I won't even try because I'd be a fool if I did. 

When my father was in high school, he would call one of his best friends nego or nigga.  It was acceptable, at least in high school, for white men to call blacks nigga, negro, brother, etc.  Nowadays, the term nigger, nigga, negro, etc. is used in a very different way by blacks, but when a white person says it, it's racist.  The lines of acceptance are skewed.  People/persons of color is taken as offensive by others, and to others, it's racist to call blacks anything other than person/people of color.  As a white person, I am constantly in fear of offending someone of a minority group because the terms I use are incorrect or construed as racist when I know in my heart that I am very much NOT racist. 

Maybe you think I am because I don't cowtow to what you feel is acceptable.  Maybe you think I am because I expect that the rude, disrespectful behavior or an organization that should stand for black empowerment and NOT racism, should be held responsible.  I'll have to hunt down those links I posted on the other thread if need be.  Maybe you think I am simply because I am white and I have to be racist because I am white.  I don't know what to tell you. 



I dont think anything about you. I don't care one way or another you have to live with who you are and what your think. If you don't believe all of it why did you say any of it? What are you really saying?

All I am trying to point out to you is words matter. You know they matter, boijen knows they matter. You can holler all you want to that they are just words. Bullshit. Words cut just as much as knives do. There are plenty of women who are abused simply with the use of words by a man. If they matter that much don't you think we should watch how we use them?

You can tell me that things are equal all you want. Two facts. The Unemployment rate for Black/Lation men are 3x what it is for White men. There are a hell of a lot more men in incarceration with brown and black skin than white.......If you can prove to me that there is no preference or racial choice in those numbers then I will listen. But, we both know there is racial preference to those numbers...




DomYngBlk -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 1:23:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
Great another fucking story from someone saying they are white and oppressed by being a "minority" . Will the comedy ever end?

You don't think that being a member of the LGBT community makes a person a minority?



Not saying that at all. She was coming at me as a "white" person not a person of the LGBT community


Seriously?



Do you need me to repost your OP?




BoiJen -> RE: I am not a racist. (7/13/2010 1:27:43 PM)

No, actually what you can do is go back and read posts numbered 44 and 51. Mine and yours. You'll find that I did refer to my own experiences as a member of the LGBT community and the resulting broken nose.

What I find interesting is that you refuse to acknowledge that a white kid got their ass kicked because they were white by a bunch of black kids. If that's not racism, what the fuck would you call it?

boi




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