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ORIGINAL: vincentML

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First of all, the Divine does not intervene in our universe on its own volition.

How do you know?

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Why not just look around…feel the earth beneath you…then let your mind drift…do you think all around you is random chance… something from nothing with time neither beginning nor ending… or…do you feel the touch of intelligence, power, and a purpose for creation even if you don‘t understand it?

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ORIGINAL: Rule

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ORIGINAL: vincentML

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First of all, the Divine does not intervene in our universe on its own volition.

How do you know?

Logic requires it. Intervening on its own volition would interfere with free will and with the purpose of creation.

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ORIGINAL: DemandingOwner1

Descartes thought of it as a simple risk/benefit analysis:

If you believe in God, and there is no God, then you end up simply disappearing when you die

If you do NOT believe in God, and there is a God, then you end up burning in hell for eternity

His conclusion was 'believe in God, there is no downside and plenty of upside' though stated much more elegantly.

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ORIGINAL: vincentML
What makes you think there is a purpose to creation?

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ORIGINAL: vincentML
What makes you believe Will is free?

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ORIGINAL: Rule

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ORIGINAL: DemandingOwner1
Descartes thought of it as a simple risk/benefit analysis:

If you believe in God, and there is no God, then you end up simply disappearing when you die

If you do NOT believe in God, and there is a God, then you end up burning in hell for eternity

His conclusion was 'believe in God, there is no downside and plenty of upside' though stated much more elegantly.

Descartes had a simple mind.

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ORIGINAL: vincentML
What makes you think there is a purpose to creation?

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Egyptian mythology asserts there is.

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ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

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ORIGINAL: popeye1250

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ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

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So, you don't "have" to go to church then?

Your point?

Julia, I don't know anything about the Taoist faith. I was just wondering which day of the week you guys go to church.

Taoists do not go to church...Some Taoists are Atheists.

http://www.google.com/search?source=ig&hl=en&rlz=1G1GGLQ_ENUS366&q=taoism&aq=f&aqi=g-p1g4g-s1g2g-s2&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=CbOiFJlBDTJfwMY7IigOr_NWbAQAAAKoEBU_QPBzU

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ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Julia, hey,......I think I like this religion; "action through inaction". ( "Taoism, the Lazy Man's Religion!")No need to go to church every week, do you guys at least have any type of meetings or conventions or anything like that? You know, a bunch of Taoists rent hotels in differant cities for a "convention", wear funny hats and chase whores up and down the hallways,... things like that?
I'd be a great Taoist! "Hey! You can't chase whores up and down the hallways!"
"Sure I can, I'm a Taoist! It's part of our "Religion" "You know, the "Mother Earth thing!"
"Oh, OK,  sorry, just try not to disturb the other guests."
Yup, Julia and Popeye,...Taoists!

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ORIGINAL: BKSir

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ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Julia, hey,......I think I like this religion; "action through inaction". ( "Taoism, the Lazy Man's Religion!")No need to go to church every week, do you guys at least have any type of meetings or conventions or anything like that? You know, a bunch of Taoists rent hotels in differant cities for a "convention", wear funny hats and chase whores up and down the hallways,... things like that?
I'd be a great Taoist! "Hey! You can't chase whores up and down the hallways!"
"Sure I can, I'm a Taoist! It's part of our "Religion" "You know, the "Mother Earth thing!"
"Oh, OK,  sorry, just try not to disturb the other guests."
Yup, Julia and Popeye,...Taoists!

Well, there's nothing saying you CAN'T chase whores, but, we don't really have any silly hats. The whole mother earth thing, yeah, that's someone else.

Here, THIS ARTICLE, or rather, set thereof, about Taoism may help you. Judging by your last post, you may be a bit scared of the title of the site, being 'religioustolerance.org', but don't worry. You can still go ahead and be as offensive as always if you like.

That's the beautiful thing about choices. You can choose to be an uneducated jerk about other peoples religions, and I can choose to try and at least change the 'uneducated' part.

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ORIGINAL: Kirata

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ORIGINAL: Owner59

There is no free will if there`s an implied threat of violence if you don`t or if you do,you get tons of good stuff.

A threat of violence if you do or don't do something is certainly coercive, but it doesn't invalidate your free will. You are still perfectly free to choose to do it anyway. Take the example of a gun to your head and a demand for your money. You might say you "had no choice" in the situation, but the reason you "had no choice" was because your values (the value you place on your life) did not allow you one. Or to put it another way, you evaluated the situation and chose the outcome with the highest value to you. In other circumstances, a threat to your life might result in you making a different choice.

K.

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Julia, hey,......I think I like this religion; "action through inaction". ( "Taoism, the Lazy Man's Religion!")No need to go to church every week, do you guys at least have any type of meetings or conventions or anything like that? You know, a bunch of Taoists rent hotels in differant cities for a "convention", wear funny hats and chase whores up and down the hallways,... things like that?
I'd be a great Taoist! "Hey! You can't chase whores up and down the hallways!"
"Sure I can, I'm a Taoist! It's part of our "Religion" "You know, the "Mother Earth thing!"
"Oh, OK,  sorry, just try not to disturb the other guests."
Yup, Julia and Popeye,...Taoists!

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ORIGINAL: Kirata

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ORIGINAL: Owner59

What if the choice was a gun to the head if you don`t or suitcase full of cash if you do.An offer you can`t refuse,to put it another way.

Yes,technically there are two choices.But given the ramifications of either choice,can one say the they are choosing without undue influence?

Let's see, a gun to my head if I don't kill my family, or a suitcase full of cash if I do... I think that's an offer I can refuse. "Undue influence" doesn't negate free will, it just all too often negates character.

K.

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ORIGINAL: CruelNUnsual

The OP is so garbled I dont know what its asking. If its a free will question the answer is that it doesnt matter. Either you have free will and your choices make a difference, or you have the illusion of free will and you make a choice that was pre-ordained. Either way the result is the same....what you choose is the path you take.

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ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

I believe in a G-d.  It is obvious that something greater than man created the world - the only question is whether that something has intelligence or was random chance.  I believe that it was not random chance.

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G-d has given me life, a very nice existence, and people who care for me.  I figure that He's due thanks from me just for that, without making further demands upon Him.