D/S versus Passive/Aggressive

D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (Full Version)

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OedipusRexIt -> D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/17/2006 10:43:01 AM)
What are anyone's thoughts regarding aspects of passive/aggressive behabvior, petulance, vindictiveness or transference of anger as exhibited by their Dom/Dommes? I have read a number of posts in which something to the effect of "master punished me by not calling" or "master made me jump through these hoops, then left me with nothing..", etc. While we all have a right to our own pursuit of our preferences, it strikes me as odd that pettiness masqueraded as Dominance, and I feel it gives a lot of Us a bad name. Thoughts? Thinkers welcome...

ownedgirlie -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/17/2006 11:04:41 AM)
Personally, i hate passive/aggressiveness. Fortunately, i do not experience this with my Master. If i am being punished, i am told outright, and told what that punishment is. There are times, in day to day life (meaning not in a disciplinary/punishment situation) when he may put me through things without explaining them, as a training mechanism or a way to get me to think about something, but then we discuss it in depth later - what i concluded and why, and whether it was what he hoped i would conclude, etc. i find passive/aggressiveness to be destructive in any relationship.

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/17/2006 11:05:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OedipusRexIt What are anyone's thoughts regarding aspects of passive/aggressive behabvior, petulance, vindictiveness or transference of anger as exhibited by their Dom/Dommes? Other than it's extremely common, not much. quote: Thoughts? Thinkers welcome... The doms who don't learn how to communicate effectively are the ones who don't have the happy lasting healthy relationships.

MasterFireMaam -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/17/2006 11:08:48 AM)
I think it's just a part of human nature and we just happen to notice more in Doms 'cause most think that being a Dom gives them permission to behave that way. Some think that bullying and belligerence equal Dominance. It doesn't. Also, remember that we see plenty of these traits in submissives/slaves as well. Again, it's human nature, I think. Fire

Tikkiee -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/17/2006 11:14:51 AM)
To tell the truth, I don't think much on it at all. I am not here to tell others how they should act in their own relationships. The only one that matters is the one that I have with Chris. Personally, the actions of a single individual do not make up my perception of a group of individuals.

crouchingtigress -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/17/2006 11:27:37 AM)
[image]http://www.collarchat.com/micons/m23.gif[/image] Not too impressed actually, sad that so many fall for these folks, but I guess eventually we all learn that if a person can not control their own selves that they con not hope to control another effectively.

OedipusRexIt -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 1:27:41 PM)
Passive/aggressive is all too common and does seem to be well-esconced in human nature. I'll venture that opinion even at the risk being charged with judging a whole group of people, whoever they may be. I do agree that punishment is best linked clearly and consistently to an unwanted behavior, except for those instances where punishment is it's own reward. I did allow for a caveat in my post to the effect of degustubus non disputandum , so hopefully it is understood that if it floats your boat, go ahead and enjoy. For those of us who don't participate in that behavior, it remains something to be disliked. I'm entitled to not like it as much as anyone is entitled to like it... Thanks for the feedback

thetammyjo -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 2:00:15 PM)
Its people just falling back into old habits of feeling hurt and then lashing out but not wanting to or not knowing how to deal with the results. Last night my family had therapy again (a lot of these is helping my slave through some difficult internal stuff right now) and it was mentioned that I still swallow up feelings (especially anger) but that I don't do a good job of hiding it any more cause the guys can feel it radiating off me like an oven. Holding things inside is a survival technique I learned as a child. That it can radiate off of me now is actually progress our therapist pointed out. Sorry that might be TMI.... But the point I'm trying to make is that dom or not, each of us is just a human being and we have learned things from the day we were born onward. As adults it can be difficult to undo anything we learned but the trick is to try. I think that part of the point of having established punishments or times when we work out issues in our Ds relationships is to not just benefit the sub but also the dom who may need permission from herself to express her feelings.

Proprietrix -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 2:36:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OedipusRexIt What are anyone's thoughts regarding aspects of passive/aggressive behabvior, petulance, vindictiveness or transference of anger as exhibited by their Dom/Dommes? I have read a number of posts in which something to the effect of "master punished me by not calling" or "master made me jump through these hoops, then left me with nothing..", etc. While we all have a right to our own pursuit of our preferences, it strikes me as odd that pettiness masqueraded as Dominance, and I feel it gives a lot of Us a bad name. hmmm, I think some of your examples aren't directly related to the characteristics. As a Domme, I've enforced "no contact" or "ignore" punishments with subs. "You did something that offended me/disrespected me, therefore you do not have the privilege of my attention for 48 hours." I let them email me and leave messages on the answering machine, but I don't respond at all until the 48 hours is over. Or if they live with me, I won't make eye contact or speak to them for X period of time, but they can sit there and talk to me all they want. I wouldn't call that passive-agressive or vindictive. It's simply a no-contact order for a certain period of time so said submissive can reflect on their behavior. Maybe if I had different examples to go on...

NeedToUseYou -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 2:44:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OedipusRexIt What are anyone's thoughts regarding aspects of passive/aggressive behabvior, petulance, vindictiveness or transference of anger as exhibited by their Dom/Dommes? I have read a number of posts in which something to the effect of "master punished me by not calling" or "master made me jump through these hoops, then left me with nothing..", etc. While we all have a right to our own pursuit of our preferences, it strikes me as odd that pettiness masqueraded as Dominance, and I feel it gives a lot of Us a bad name. Thoughts? Thinkers welcome... Oh, I absolutely despise passive aggresive people in general. I won't be around them, it could get bloody. To me it demonstrates cowardice, not being able to openly show your aggression, but still being aggressive with deniablity. Cowards one and all. Be aggressive or don't. Sheesh. I'd never trust a passive aggressive person because to me they are lying about there actions when they do such things, and I don't take to liars well at all. Probably my least favourite group of people on the planet.

NeedToUseYou -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 2:47:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Proprietrix quote: ORIGINAL: OedipusRexIt What are anyone's thoughts regarding aspects of passive/aggressive behabvior, petulance, vindictiveness or transference of anger as exhibited by their Dom/Dommes? I have read a number of posts in which something to the effect of "master punished me by not calling" or "master made me jump through these hoops, then left me with nothing..", etc. While we all have a right to our own pursuit of our preferences, it strikes me as odd that pettiness masqueraded as Dominance, and I feel it gives a lot of Us a bad name. hmmm, I think some of your examples aren't directly related to the characteristics. As a Domme, I've enforced "no contact" or "ignore" punishments with subs. "You did something that offended me/disrespected me, therefore you do not have the privilege of my attention for 48 hours." I let them email me and leave messages on the answering machine, but I don't respond at all until the 48 hours is over. Or if they live with me, I won't make eye contact or speak to them for X period of time, but they can sit there and talk to me all they want. I wouldn't call that passive-agressive or vindictive. It's simply a no-contact order for a certain period of time so said submissive can reflect on their behavior. Maybe if I had different examples to go on... I think the difference is in your situation you are being upfront with them that what your doing is to punish them. A passive aggressive would do the same thing then make up a reason for doing it, that tries to cover the aggression with a psuedo-logical explanation. Such as i didn't answer because it's protocol, but never inform the sub of the protocol. That's very different.

truesub4u -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 5:16:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie Personally, i hate passive/aggressiveness. Fortunately, i do not experience this with my Master. If i am being punished, i am told outright, and told what that punishment is. There are times, in day to day life (meaning not in a disciplinary/punishment situation) when he may put me through things without explaining them, as a training mechanism or a way to get me to think about something, but then we discuss it in depth later - what i concluded and why, and whether it was what he hoped i would conclude, etc. i find passive/aggressiveness to be destructive in any relationship. Ummmm..... Owned... I need to know... does your Master have a brother?... [;)]

starymists -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 5:21:21 PM)
For myself, I don't find passive/aggressive behavior to be something I can deal with in a D/s M/s relationship. That being said, it really depends on how often that behavior occurs and how intense it is when it does occur. As has been pointed out, passive aggressive behavior on an occasional basis might be normal. But if it happens too often, it's just not something that I want to be a part of. Then again, when I was new, the form of passive aggressive I deal with had to do with withholding affection for days because of a minor infraction...didn't work then, won't work now. Just my two cents :)

enthralled -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 6:37:03 PM)
Though to each his own.... In my opinion, when a dominant hands out punishments such as not speaking, withholding affection, etc., he is not only shutting down communication, but pretty much chopping up the lines as well! To me, hes basically saying when things get bad ... dont confront it, dont talk about it, dont acknowledge it and it will get better! I would shut down. Respectfully, enthralled

CERCKL -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 6:49:17 PM)
quote: Though to each his own.... In my opinion, when a dominant hands out punishments such as not speaking, withholding affection, etc., he is not only shutting down communication, but pretty much chopping up the lines as well! To me, hes basically saying when things get bad ... dont confront it, dont talk about it, dont acknowledge it and it will get better! I would shut down. Respectfully, enthralled Granted, I can see this perspective...but then taking it from the passive/aggresive or for that matter, even punishment...can't it potentially be more communicative to place the situation aside, examine it and actually see what the issue, point is before addressing...Not being reactive...and if that involves stating, you must wait until I am prepared to deal with this...it wouldn't be cutting anything off, just refusing to be reactive. This of course, in my opinion, would be in dealing with actual shit...not the brat play etc... C

Proprietrix -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 6:56:42 PM)
I think this could easily turn into the very controversial topic of shunning.

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 7:06:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CERCKL can't it potentially be more communicative to place the situation aside, examine it and actually see what the issue, point is before addressing...Not being reactive...and if that involves stating, you must wait until I am prepared to deal with this...it wouldn't be cutting anything off, just refusing to be reactive. This of course, in my opinion, would be in dealing with actual shit...not the brat play etc... C You're exactly right- taking time outs can be extremely useful tools of communication, taking time to take perspective is an excellent idea. But that's not usually what's going on- it's usually the dom just having a pout-fest, training the sub not to push the buttons he doesn't want to or is incapable of actually dealing with and couching it in a "It's my way so it's the right way and you're the sub so deal and accept" deal. Ultimately, it always crumbles. But it can go for a loooong time before then.

enthralled -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 7:08:01 PM)
quote: Granted, I can see this perspective...but then taking it from the passive/aggresive or for that matter, even punishment...can't it potentially be more communicative to place the situation aside, examine it and actually see what the issue, point is before addressing...Not being reactive...and if that involves stating, you must wait until I am prepared to deal with this...it wouldn't be cutting anything off, just refusing to be reactive. This of course, in my opinion, would be in dealing with actual shit...not the brat play etc... C Oh absolutely as long as the situation was addressed! If I knew that it was the (hypothetical) 'his' style to handle things that way, then yes- I could very well understand. I was only referring to the scenerios where the problem was just scooped under the rug and never dealt with. That is probably one of the only lasting screwed-up things about my childhood that haunts me to this day ... my mother never wanting to deal with crap so she refused to discuss it .... EVER. So, that is why I said I would shut down, but only in the case that it wasnt talked about later. Respectfully, enthralled

theprofitprinces -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 10:17:56 PM)
Exactly what is passive/aggressiveness..I am not totally understanding the definition.

classykindasassy -> RE: D/S versus Passive/Aggressive (4/18/2006 10:25:34 PM)
I think there are pathologies, and then there are legitimate self-expressions, whether a person is vanilla or kink. I think the workability of relationships depends on how straight a person can communicate and accept straight communication, and also the ability to own oneself, one's own behavior, and be totally conscious to and responsible for the effects it creates. here's a pathology: I saw a posting from a guy on here who was dating and in love with some chick, who after 8 months and accepting a collar or a marriage proposal, she springs on him she'd been secretly fucking some other guy. He was destroyed. How can someone be so checked out and so unfeeling as to do that to someone else? (assuming all is as it was portrayed). Some sick bastard dom could perpetrate similar crap under the guise of being a dom. But I had to think there HAD to be some behavior or clue that he stepped over or denied, that had he clued himself in, he'd have saved himself some heartache. But then how stupid is the sub who allows herself to be led down the primrose path of treatment from a dom as the OP describes, and allows it to happen more than once, unless they like being treated like a worthless idiot? again, there are sick people whatever their nomenclature, and those spineless enough to go for them (and maybe they are matches made in heaven). I often say that for every crazy predilection, there is always someone out there who will be a joyful recipient. God has a sense of humor, and has created a perfect world.

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