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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/16/2010 6:04:20 AM

texangael

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quote:

The question is simply how other Doms/Masters see and/or handle this type of thing.

That is not even a question. "other" dominants are not Sir. Sir is Sir, and none other. What others do is irrelevant.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/16/2010 6:29:52 AM

NuevaVida

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quote:

ORIGINAL: subforherMaster

Once again i am not asking "what should i do?" There relationship between Sir and myself is wonderful. He and i both have moved forward from this and will continue to do so in the future. My question is only: Would this be viewed by You as un-sub-like? Or are You as understanding when trying to push the limits of Your sub? If so, how do You show that You are not disappointed, or angered?

I guess I'm having a hard time figuring out what is "sub-like" and what is "un-sub-like." There is no universal "submissive means X behavior." What works for those in the relationship is what works for them.

For me personally, there is submitting to my owner and not submitting to my owner. And what lies within each category is completely between us and unique to us. I say let go of whatever notions you have of "subs behave this way and if they don't it's "unsublike." People should be who they are, rather than conform to a label or definition. In other words, the labels define what's already in place. Too many people try to do it the other way around, and adapt to a label instead. That's when you start getting the "you're being un-sub-like" conversations, which really have no meaning in my world.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/16/2010 9:01:05 AM

nephandi

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Joined: 9/23/2005
From: Cold and magickal Norway in a town near Bergen!
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Greetings

quote:

Sir and I have spoken at length about limits. He has none, i have a few. Sir is well aware that scat is a limit for His girl. To me this includes ass to mouth, He sees it differently. Sir recently tried to have me follow through on some "ass to mouth" activity and i politely refused. Afterward i was quite worried but He said repeatedly that He was not disappointed and that He was not angered by my refusal.

If your Sir says he is not disappointed, all is fine, he wanted to do it, you said it was included in your limits, he respected it, what is the problem here? Why are you asking random strangers on a forum when the only one who's opinion on the topic should matter have said, everything is okey?

There are no sub user manual, for some relationships, sure refusing to do anything the Dom wanted which was not strictly mentioned in the limits list would be unacceptable, to others a Dom moving close to a limit would be seen as unacceptable. The only one that can say what is expected behavior for you in your relationship unless you are a member of a lifestyle that put certain expectations on you are you and the one you serve. If your Sir say all is well, then all is well.

I wish you well.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/16/2010 10:04:06 AM

leadership527

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I don't think there is any such thing as "un-sub-like" since that'd presume I know what "subs are like" to start with. What I do think is that for any command one either submits or not. So I'd say you didn't submit to the command. But one data point isn't enough to construct generalities.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/16/2010 10:06:40 AM

Jeffff

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I carried a purse through the liquor dept. of a large grocery store.

It was very un-sub like.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/16/2010 10:41:43 AM

Chrisincuffs

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quote:

I carried a purse through the liquor dept. of a large grocery store.

It was very un-sub like.

That is WAAAAY worse than ass to mouth! lol

I don't blame your Sir for trying, while scat is a HARD limit for me, I didn't see ass to mouth as scat evidently during the heat of ONE and only ONE moment. However in my situation my D knows my limits and does a very good job of making me feel safe, and limits were set at the beginning. Some have changed over time but the serious ones haven't changed and He would never push those with me. I don't consider any of it unsub-like.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/17/2010 1:28:57 AM

crazyml

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quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

Honestly from my standpoint if he tried to push a limit that I hadn't already verbally acquiesed on repeatedly I would tell him to knock it the fuck off and he was being an idiot without much regard for whether he viewed that as submissive or not. Role doesn't extend to me saying I need to be safe and you need to adhere to what I believe is safe for me. That is what limits are. UNLESS you really aren't holding on to this as a limit and it's just an activity that you have difficulty with and I've done that too and can certainly identify with that. (as an aside I totally blame Aileen for this too! the cunt!)

Wonderful! (as usual).

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/17/2010 1:39:02 AM

crazyml

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Hello!

Is it un-sub-like to refuse an activity that is on the fringe of a limit?

Not at all. It's perfectly reasonable. I'd go further and say that I'd have very little time for a sub who didn't feel able to communicate her feelings on a matter like this - so (to echo what Zevar said) the fact that you did is very positive.

So, no, as a dom I wouldn't view this as un-sub-like at all.

Yep, I'll occasionally push limits, but when doing so I'm very careful to watch my partner's reaction. If she calls me on it, I'll always stop, and usually give her a cheeky grin.

As for how I show that I'm not disappointed... I'd have to be honest and say that a sub who needed a ton of reassurance in this kind of case is probably not ideal for me... firstly, if I've pushed a limit too far then I'm not the one who is entitled to be "disappointed" - If I've gone too far (and it has happened once or twice) then she's the one entitled to be disappointed - I should be the one apologising for not reading her reaction properly and for not respecting a limit. In the example you describe - I'm with Darksteven, if my sub needed repeated reassurance I'd find it a tad irritating.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/17/2010 3:32:50 AM

DarkSteven

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

I carried a purse through the liquor dept. of a large grocery store.

It was very un-sub like.

/Points and laffs/

A least it was a liquor store, and not some floofy place.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/17/2010 3:37:53 AM

wittynamehere

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quote:

ORIGINAL: subforherMaster

to refuse an activity that is on the fringe of a limit? Sir and I have spoken at length about limits. He has none, i have a few. Sir is well aware that scat is a limit for His girl. To me this includes ass to mouth, He sees it differently. Sir recently tried to have me follow through on some "ass to mouth" activity and i politely refused. Afterward i was quite worried but He said repeatedly that He was not disappointed and that He was not angered by my refusal. Sir knows i am very hard on myself if i disappoint Him. I could see that He was frustrated sexually but not beyond that. My question to any Dom/Master is: Would this be viewed by You as un-sub-like? Or are You as understanding when trying to push the limits of Your sub? If so, how do You show that You are not disappointed, or angered?

I think it's one of those "only you know the answer to that one" ones.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/19/2010 3:44:31 AM

phoenixmoonn13

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it isnt unsublike to stop when you reach your hard limit . my masters hardlimits are mine he doesnt really have soft ones where i do he will push them but if i say enough he knows my difference with no more when i love it jsut find it hard and no more when its too much. i too beat myself up if i say no but it is ok to

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/20/2010 10:55:05 PM

sunshinemiss

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SpiritedRadiance

Its not unsublike to have limitations, its not unsublike to not wish to have things that can cause you harm. I understand your feeling of disappointment for not being able to do what was asked of you. but its never un -term- like, because you cant or you wont morally go somewhere.

I like to think that men actually respect women who have backbone and who mean what they say. I also like to think that men are not little boys that will stomp off because they didn't get their way.

But, that's me.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/21/2010 5:47:33 AM

Kana

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Sigh.
Slaves are so much easier. No blurred lines, no negotiations, all "Suck it now, cunt or suffer the consequences."
Good times.

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/21/2010 5:58:48 AM

Jeffff

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I'd carry your purse through a liquor store!

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RE: Is it un-sub-like... - 8/21/2010 1:15:48 PM

LafayetteLady

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From: Northern New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: subforherMaster

to refuse an activity that is on the fringe of a limit? Sir and I have spoken at length about limits. He has none, i have a few. Sir is well aware that scat is a limit for His girl. To me this includes ass to mouth, He sees it differently. Sir recently tried to have me follow through on some "ass to mouth" activity and i politely refused. Afterward i was quite worried but He said repeatedly that He was not disappointed and that He was not angered by my refusal. Sir knows i am very hard on myself if i disappoint Him. I could see that He was frustrated sexually but not beyond that. My question to any Dom/Master is: Would this be viewed by You as un-sub-like? Or are You as understanding when trying to push the limits of Your sub? If so, how do You show that You are not disappointed, or angered?

Honestly I think the bigger problem is your obvious issue with yourself. You both agreed it is a limit, you say he isn't angered, or disappointed. What is up with your apparent need to make sure others don't view you as "un-sub like?"

The only thing you should be concerned about is how your relationship is going. If you continue to be concerned about how people outside your relationship view your behavior, your relationship is doomed to failure.

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