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News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/17/2010 11:49:08 PM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		Just to clarify


quote:

corbett, who oversees the Times standards on such questions, told The Upshot that he hasn't issued any formal guidelines but has discussed that particular phrasing with editors.
"To call it the Ground Zero Mosque not only would give you the impression that it's on the site of the Trade Center," he continued, "but it might even give you the further impression that it's part of the rebuilding process to that site."
The Times appears to be in the minority, judging by headlines related to Obama's remarks.
Many news organizations ran headlines this past weekend describing a "Ground Zero mosque," including the Associated Press, Huffington Post, Washington Post, Fox News, New York Daily News, Politico, and AOL's Politics Daily site. (Yahoo! News, linking to an AP story on the remarks, similarly went with "Ground Zero mosque.")
Several other news organizations routinely place "Ground Zero" in quotation marks, which is more of shorthand way of describing the debate without pinpointing the location.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_upshot/20100816/pl_yblog_upshot/news-outlets-split-in-describing-mosque

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 6:54:27 AM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		Julia-  how can you defend a group that would oppress you?

Rhetorical question.

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 10:03:41 AM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

how can you defend a group that would oppress you?


Historically, Islam has been a decidedly tolerant religion.

Unlike Christianity, even of other Christian groups.

Or did you mean Christians? (Joke, people, joke).

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 10:43:43 AM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Julia-  how can you defend a group that would oppress you?

Rhetorical question.



With so many of my friends and loved ones being Christian, it is hard not to defend them.



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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 1:01:30 PM   
kdsub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

how can you defend a group that would oppress you?


Historically, Islam has been a decidedly tolerant religion.

Unlike Christianity, even of other Christian groups.

Or did you mean Christians? (Joke, people, joke).



Hmmm what is the penalty in Afghanistan for converting to Christianity.... Now what is the penalty in New York if you convert to Islam?

Not Afghanistan then do the same in Saudi Arabia...could name a few others.

Times change so do religions...I'm sure after all the American dead in Afganistan they will allow conversions...don't ya think.

< Message edited by kdsub -- 8/18/2010 1:03:17 PM >

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 2:44:00 PM   
SL4V3M4YB3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Hmmm what is the penalty in Afghanistan for converting to Christianity.... ?

Depends where in Afghanistan you decide to do your converting.

Anyway I hears there is no such thing as converting to Islam just reverting back apparently, so you are already a Muslim but you've forgotten the way with all that Christianity nonsense. Different milkshake, same flavour; as they say.


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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 3:35:30 PM   
luckydawg


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Status: offline 		Hisotrically, Islam has been tolerant in the same sense that Jim Crow America and South African apartied were tolerant.


As long as the subjugated groups accpeted thier lower legal status, and obeyed all the laws regarding thier legally designated second/3rd class status, they were generally left alone. But if they got uppity, legal state sanctioned violence was swift and sure.

Its called Dhimitude. Read about it some time. Unless it is imperative to your ideology that you ignore it.


And yes, you can point out a few examples of high ranking Jewish or Christian advisors in History. Though that is like using Oprah as an example that there is no racism in America.




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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 3:37:04 PM   
luckydawg


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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 4:03:27 PM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg

Hisotrically, Islam has been tolerant in the same sense that Jim Crow America and South African apartied were tolerant.


As long as the subjugated groups accpeted thier lower legal status, and obeyed all the laws regarding thier legally designated second/3rd class status, they were generally left alone. But if they got uppity, legal state sanctioned violence was swift and sure.

Its called Dhimitude. Read about it some time. Unless it is imperative to your ideology that you ignore it.


And yes, you can point out a few examples of high ranking Jewish or Christian advisors in History. Though that is like using Oprah as an example that there is no racism in America.



Selective nonsense from you Lucky. Your comments suggest you dont even know how Dhimitude was applied or what Muslims laws protected the Dhimis. For example, in one Muslim sect the penalty for a Muslim killing a Dhimi was death. In many instances they had equal legal status. This was certainly the case pre the Crusades.

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 5:17:12 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

Hmmm what is the penalty in Afghanistan for converting to Christianity


You are confusing regional messes with Islam globally.

We could start an atrocious list for Christianity too if we cherry picked the conflicts.

I quite clearly pointed out I was speaking about historically.

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 5:58:53 PM   
luckydawg


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Status: offline 		Nope polite sub, that is absolute nonsense.

Anyone who cares can read about it.


Though I do see you buy into the protection of the Dhimi nonsense.


Blacks in Jim Crow america were also required to obey the laws "for thier own Protection", that means it was ok. Absolute bullshit.

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 6:02:31 PM   
luckydawg


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Status: offline 		MM, actually the Koran specifically states that death is the Penalty for Apostasy. Nothing to do with Sects or Culture.


Mohamed's direct command.



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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 7:33:44 PM   
kdsub


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Status: offline 		Lets not speak historically...lets speak today... Christians are persecuted all over the Muslim world and it is getting worse every day.

Go ahead and nit pick cherry pick any pick and I believe you will find there is a lot more violence by Muslims against Christians then the other way around.

The tolerance or lack of it in the past may be a root of today’s problems but does not describe reality in the world today.

Butch

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 7:35:43 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

Lets not speak historically...lets speak today.


Yo, Butch...

Change the topic and of course the material changes too.

It's a bullshit way to critique a point though. Make the separate point, fine.

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 7:43:28 PM   
Musicmystery


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Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

actually the Koran specifically states that death is the Penalty for Apostasy.


Read Leviticus. Make a list of Christians who follow it to the letter. All of it. Get back to me.

For that matter, what about "Thou Shalt Not Kill"? What happened there?

It's the Word of God!

< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 8/18/2010 7:44:39 PM >

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 8:14:19 PM   
kdsub


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Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		I think all buildings of prayer in the Muslim religion are a mosque... It is exclusive to those of the Muslim faith. I also believe there is a difference in places of worship depending on whether a sermon is given. In the centers case they say sermons will not be given on a regular basis.

I don’t believe anyone as spoken of some of the comments in the Muslim community in the US critical of the center. ...HERE...

These people make sense and I wonder if they will be considered religious intolerant as I was accused of being.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 8/18/2010 8:23:22 PM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 9:04:15 PM   
HoleMonger


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quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg

MM, actually the Koran specifically states that death is the Penalty for Apostasy. Nothing to do with Sects or Culture.


Mohamed's direct command.




Deuteronomy 17
If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant; 17:3 And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; 17:4 And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and enquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel; 17:5 Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.


...that part's still in the Bible, isn't it?

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Lets not speak historically...lets speak today... Christians are persecuted all over the Muslim world and it is getting worse every day.



Christianity is, at its core, a martyr faith. It's at its purest and has historically thrived on persecution, repression and victimhood, be it in Rome or Japan. Without it professed Christians have a sad tendency to degenerate into theocratic power struggles, splintering, bigotry, persecution, and hate-mongering againt both other Christian sects, those of other faiths, and those who live lives contrary to what their holy book dictates. Just like pretty much every other religion.

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 9:49:45 PM   
pogo4pres


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Joined: 1/14/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Just to clarify


quote:

corbett, who oversees the Times standards on such questions, told The Upshot that he hasn't issued any formal guidelines but has discussed that particular phrasing with editors.
"To call it the Ground Zero Mosque not only would give you the impression that it's on the site of the Trade Center," he continued, "but it might even give you the further impression that it's part of the rebuilding process to that site."
The Times appears to be in the minority, judging by headlines related to Obama's remarks.
Many news organizations ran headlines this past weekend describing a "Ground Zero mosque," including the Associated Press, Huffington Post, Washington Post, Fox News, New York Daily News, Politico, and AOL's Politics Daily site. (Yahoo! News, linking to an AP story on the remarks, similarly went with "Ground Zero mosque.")
Several other news organizations routinely place "Ground Zero" in quotation marks, which is more of shorthand way of describing the debate without pinpointing the location.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_upshot/20100816/pl_yblog_upshot/news-outlets-split-in-describing-mosque


“The biases the media has are much bigger than conservative or liberal. They're about getting ratings, about making money, about doing stories that are easy to cover.”   Al Franken

Al is 100% correct, news is no longer news, hasn't been since Cronkite retired.  Network presidents expect news divisions to make MONEY, how fucking well you gonna do news when there is a profit motive??

Journalistically,
Some Knucklehead in NJ



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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 9:57:49 PM   
thornhappy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I think all buildings of prayer in the Muslim religion are a mosque... It is exclusive to those of the Muslim faith. I also believe there is a difference in places of worship depending on whether a sermon is given. In the centers case they say sermons will not be given on a regular basis.

Non-Muslims can enter some mosques, at least.  I saw Tony Bourdain in one.

Getting to Mecca is a whole 'nother matter.

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RE: News outlets split in describing mosque - 8/18/2010 11:04:08 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		No expert but i think I read you have to be invited by a Muslim before you enter

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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Profile   Post #: 20
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