The case that froze the banks. (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 3:30:40 AM)

Gotta hand it to the lady... and her volunteer attorney.


DENMARK, Me. — The house that set off the national furor over faulty foreclosures is blue-gray and weathered. The porch is piled with furniture and knickknacks awaiting the next yard sale. In the driveway is a busted pickup truck. No one who lives there is going anywhere anytime soon.

...........

By the time Mr. Cox saw Mrs. Bradbury's case, it was just about over. Last January, Judge Keith A. Powers of the Ninth District Court of Maine approved the foreclosure, leaving the case alive only to establish exactly how much Mrs. Bradbury owed.

Mr. Cox vowed to a colleague that he would expose GMAC's process and its limited signing officer, Jeffrey Stephan. A lawyer in another foreclosure case had already deposed Mr. Stephan, but Mr. Cox wanted to take the questioning much further. In June, he got his chance. A few weeks later, he spelled out in a court filing what he had learned from the robo-signer:

"When Stephan says in an affidavit that he has personal knowledge of the facts stated in his affidavits, he doesn't. When he says that he has custody and control of the loan documents, he doesn't. When he says that he is attaching 'a true and accurate' copy of a note or a mortgage, he has no idea if that is so, because he does not look at the exhibits. When he makes any other statement of fact, he has no idea if it is true. When the notary says that Stephan appeared before him or her, he didn't."

..........

In a ruling late last month, Judge Powers said that GMAC, despite its expensive legal talent and the fact that it got "a second bite of the apple" by filing amended foreclosure papers, still could not get this eviction right.

Even the amended documents did not bother to include the actual street address of the property it was trying to seize, reason enough, the judge wrote, to reject the request for immediate foreclosure without a trial.

But Judge Powers went further than that, saying that GMAC had been admonished in a Florida court for using robo-signers four years ago but had persisted. "It is well past the time for such practices to end," he wrote, adding that GMAC had acted "in bad faith" by submitting Mr. Stephan's material:

"Filing such a document without significant regard for its accuracy, which the court in ordinary circumstances may never be able to investigate or otherwise verify, is a serious and troubling matter."

It was not a complete loss for GMAC — Judge Powers declined to find the lender in contempt — but nearly so. GMAC was ordered, as a penalty, to pay Mr. Cox personally what he would have been paid for his work on the deposition and related matters had he been charging Mrs. Bradbury. That, he says, is $27,000.

The court's ruling on GMAC's "bad faith" is already being taken up by foreclosure defense lawyers around the country. Mr. Cox "did a remarkable job of proving the lenders not only rubber-stamped these loans on the front end, but they rubber-stamped them on the back end," said Mr. Saunders of the legal aid group.

GMAC, which this week expanded its foreclosure freeze to the entire country, is not giving up on Mrs. Bradbury. It will try for the third time to evict her when the case goes to trial this winter.

If Mrs. Bradbury is not quite victorious, she is still in her house, and for her that is the only thing that counts. If she can get her pickup fixed, she will go back to looking for a job.

"I am not leaving," she said this week, standing out on her front lawn, the autumn splendor spread all around her. "We have nowhere to go."


http://finance.yahoo.com/real-estate/article/111040/from-a-maine-house-a-national-foreclosure-freeze?mod=realestate-buy

An interesting piece. She should have been evicted, granted. This is a case of the big guys finally being held to the same standards as the little guys.




pahunkboy -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 7:23:51 AM)

The bank would say- it only delays the inevitable.

How do you respond to that?




TheHeretic -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 8:03:12 AM)

What are we supposed to hand her, Tazzy? The title to the house? I'm sure her neighbors, who already get to look at the dead pick-up in her driveway, the shit piled up on the front porch, the peeling paint, and their own 'stuck in a hole' property values, while still making that payment every month, are really going to appreciate that.

Yes. The process needs to be done right. Kudos to the lawyer who took a pro bono case.




tazzygirl -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 8:05:15 AM)

I do believe i said she should have been evicted, Rich. But, allow me to check...

quote:

She should have been evicted, granted.


... yep, there it is in my post.

I never said she should have not been. Even her own attorneys are amazed. In fact, the article mentions she was foreclosed upon, they were simply waiting on the amount she owed to finalize when this all came up.




slvemike4u -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 8:46:25 AM)

A
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

What are we supposed to hand her, Tazzy? The title to the house? I'm sure her neighbors, who already get to look at the dead pick-up in her driveway, the shit piled up on the front porch, the peeling paint, and their own 'stuck in a hole' property values, while still making that payment every month, are really going to appreciate that.

Yes. The process needs to be done right. Kudos to the lawyer who took a pro bono case.
In reality Rich the lawyer received a good deal more than "kudos"...as a matter of fact the fee that the bank was ordered to pay this lawyer turned out to be a good deal more than the value of the house the bank sought to foreclose on.
Yes borrowers have an obligation to live up to the obligations they entered into....but lenders need to actually live up toi their legal obligations,rather than rubber stamp them,when trying to take someone's house.




Real0ne -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 10:05:39 AM)

fr

you mean like returning that note to you when the property is paid for?

Banks lend you NOTHING.

YOU are the ONLY signor on the promissory note!

They float that note on the market and MAKE INTEREST off it as a security and YOU GET NOTHING, well you get the payments.  The bank simply for being a MONEY CONVERTOR and using one hour of their time collect on that note with no benefit to you.

They did the same thing in the 20's, cheap loans then inflate the money so your WELL PLANNED budget falls on its butt and you pay twice as much for cost of living hence you can no longer afford to pay for the home.

Not to mention being underwater and lucky to have a job during this period!

Great racket!

Yours truly,
Mr Inflation







rulemylife -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 12:45:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

fr

you mean like returning that note to you when the property is paid for?

Banks lend you NOTHING.

YOU are the ONLY signor on the promissory note!

They float that note on the market and MAKE INTEREST off it as a security and YOU GET NOTHING, well you get the payments.



Imagine that!

Banks make money from loans.

And here I thought they did it just out the goodness of their hearts.

Keep spreading the truth RealOne.




Louve00 -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 2:18:04 PM)

I would imagine that, while of course, just approving people something they had no business trying to own, pay for, get, in the first place doesn't give them carte blanche to that property when it's been foreclosed on or being repossessed.  Who was the bright soul?  Who was in charge of approving and assuring they were making a sound decision to loan that person the money and why aren't they being questioned for allowing it?  Was a time just about any fool could apply for just about anything he wanted to.  And....be turned down for it.  That is doing business wisely.  Making sure you're loaning to someone capable of making good on that loan.  There is so much more to this mortgage mess than just people applying for loans they couldn't afford.  There were also the people who said they could, indeed, afford them.

When an eleven year old asks for the keys to your car, do you give them to him just because he asked?  If not, why?  I would imagine the same logical practice should apply.  No?  Only problem there is, if you gave your keys to your eleven year old and he wrecks the car, you, as the giver of those keys, pays for the decision.  Not saying she should, or shouldn't get the house just because she isn't paying her mortgage.  I know nothing about her case.  But I wouldn't be so quick to judge anything when it comes to a mortgage loan gone sour.




brokedickdog -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 4:35:51 PM)

Thanks for posting Tazzy. That is the case that started this snowball effect in foreclosureland. It continues to grow, and we're still just at the beginning.

Here is a page of other similar depositions: http://4closurefraud.org/depositions/

For more detailed coverage of "foreclosure-gate" I suggest Yves Smith at nakedcapitalism and Karl Denninger at market-ticker.




pahunkboy -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 5:07:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

fr

you mean like returning that note to you when the property is paid for?

Banks lend you NOTHING.

YOU are the ONLY signor on the promissory note!

They float that note on the market and MAKE INTEREST off it as a security and YOU GET NOTHING, well you get the payments.



Imagine that!

Banks make money from loans.

And here I thought they did it just out the goodness of their hearts.

Keep spreading the truth RealOne.




What you must consider is that 224 years of established private property law- is now in question.   Since the banks will get a blanket pardon via congress- the precedent is set for crazy -- claims against private property.

The whole system is suspect now- even if your house has no mortgage on it.




rulemylife -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 9:03:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

fr

you mean like returning that note to you when the property is paid for?

Banks lend you NOTHING.

YOU are the ONLY signor on the promissory note!

They float that note on the market and MAKE INTEREST off it as a security and YOU GET NOTHING, well you get the payments.



Imagine that!

Banks make money from loans.

And here I thought they did it just out the goodness of their hearts.

Keep spreading the truth RealOne.




What you must consider is that 224 years of established private property law- is now in question.   Since the banks will get a blanket pardon via congress- the precedent is set for crazy -- claims against private property.

The whole system is suspect now- even if your house has no mortgage on it.



No Pahunk, the whole system is not suspect but there are problems within the system.

If your house is free and clear then you have nothing to worry about, despite what the conspiracy sites you and RealOne like to believe.




tazzygirl -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 9:13:45 PM)

What this period is doing is forcing banks to actually read the paperwork, ensure all the "i's" and dotted and all the "t's" are crossed... and that someone actually has some knowledge of what is happening. homes have been forclosed upon that had no mortage at all.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-08/man-who-had-no-mortgage-faced-foreclosure-anyway-ann-woolner.html





rulemylife -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/17/2010 9:46:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

What this period is doing is forcing banks to actually read the paperwork, ensure all the "i's" and dotted and all the "t's" are crossed... and that someone actually has some knowledge of what is happening. homes have been forclosed upon that had no mortage at all.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-08/man-who-had-no-mortgage-faced-foreclosure-anyway-ann-woolner.html




Sorry Tazzy, but this is nonsense.

If it is true it is just a paperwork error easily corrected.

This is National Enquirer stuff and I'm surprised the Sentinel ran it.





Real0ne -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/18/2010 2:29:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

fr

you mean like returning that note to you when the property is paid for?

Banks lend you NOTHING.

YOU are the ONLY signor on the promissory note!

They float that note on the market and MAKE INTEREST off it as a security and YOU GET NOTHING, well you get the payments.



Imagine that!

Banks make money from loans.

And here I thought they did it just out the goodness of their hearts.

Keep spreading the truth RealOne.




What you must consider is that 224 years of established private property law- is now in question.   Since the banks will get a blanket pardon via congress- the precedent is set for crazy -- claims against private property.

The whole system is suspect now- even if your house has no mortgage on it.



No Pahunk, the whole system is not suspect but there are problems within the system.

If your house is free and clear then you have nothing to worry about, despite what the conspiracy sites you and RealOne like to believe.



Yeh you might have something there!


[image]http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o296/nine_one_one/blacks/mortgagedfornationaldebtcongress-1.jpg[/image]



the problem with having your head in the sand is your ass tends to be in the air for anything that comes along.









tazzygirl -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/18/2010 3:31:42 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

What this period is doing is forcing banks to actually read the paperwork, ensure all the "i's" and dotted and all the "t's" are crossed... and that someone actually has some knowledge of what is happening. homes have been forclosed upon that had no mortage at all.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-08/man-who-had-no-mortgage-faced-foreclosure-anyway-ann-woolner.html




Sorry Tazzy, but this is nonsense.

If it is true it is just a paperwork error easily corrected.

This is National Enquirer stuff and I'm surprised the Sentinel ran it.




http://news.yahoo.com/s/theweek/20100924/cm_theweek/200795_1

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/state/florida-mans-home-mistakenly-foreclosed-on-933859.html

http://southflorida.sun-sentinel.com/news/fl-wrongful-foreclosure-0922-20100921,0,2799537.story

While you may not want to admit this happened, it did. The yahoo link above lists a few other stories.




rulemylife -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/18/2010 6:50:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Sorry Tazzy, but this is nonsense.

If it is true it is just a paperwork error easily corrected.

This is National Enquirer stuff and I'm surprised the Sentinel ran it.




http://news.yahoo.com/s/theweek/20100924/cm_theweek/200795_1

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/state/florida-mans-home-mistakenly-foreclosed-on-933859.html

http://southflorida.sun-sentinel.com/news/fl-wrongful-foreclosure-0922-20100921,0,2799537.story

While you may not want to admit this happened, it did. The yahoo link above lists a few other stories.


I'm not disputing that it happened.

What I am disputing is that it is any real problem.

It was a mistake. 

This is from your third link:

Bank of America has acknowledged the error and will correct it at its own expense, said spokeswoman Jumana Bauwens.





flcouple2009 -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/18/2010 8:13:40 AM)

There have been multiple cases of filings on the wrong house in just central and south Florida.  Once you start looking you can find where this has been happening all around the country.

Someone writes down the wrong numbers, everyone else is just rubber stamping documents and making up missing papers and the next thing you know some poor family is thrown out of their house for no reason.

If you come home one day and find your locks changed and everything you own gone will you then consider it a "real" problem?

If the banks and mortgage companies can't be bothered to properly complete and file the paperwork (that also includes having the original paperwork they are supposed to possess) then they deserve to learn a few hard lessons.




slvemike4u -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/18/2010 8:28:40 AM)

My bad...




brokedickdog -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/18/2010 8:40:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

What this period is doing is forcing banks to actually read the paperwork, ensure all the "i's" and dotted and all the "t's" are crossed... and that someone actually has some knowledge of what is happening. homes have been forclosed upon that had no mortage at all.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-08/man-who-had-no-mortgage-faced-foreclosure-anyway-ann-woolner.html




Tazzy,

As you can see from some of the response posts there are a lot of folks that are simply in denial in regard to the extent of the frauds, and which parties are perpetrating such. For that reason I don't bother with lengthy, informative posts here anymore. It appears that rule hadn't even read the link you provided when he first responded. That was evident as well for a lot of the folks that responded to my posts. Denial is much easier when one doesn't look at, or expose themselves to, information or evidence that contradicts the uninformed belief they have already decided upon.

If I'm going to battle denial and willful ignorance I feel there are better venues for me to do that. So rather than spending, or wasting, my time posting at length here I am focused more on providing information, frequently in the form of documents pulled from decided cases and from public records, to several media sources, both local and national, and also to a network of attorneys that are advocating for homeowners. The "boots on the ground" research, having enough data to analyze and recognize the patterns, is the aspect both media and attorneys struggle with. It is time consuming, and thus expensive.

When examining only one document the fraud/s may not be readily apparent to an untrained, inexperienced or impatient eye. When presented with 100 other examples of the same or similar it becomes obvious.

Immediately after the Jeffrey Stephans "robo-singer" story broke I went out to the Summit County Ohio online court records and pulled up a dozen examples of perjured affidavits he had executed in that jurisdiction. I did this in less than an hour. With 10,000 perjured affidavits a month, and that for 5 years, these are pretty easy to find. I've since pulled up many others, and also examples of other robo-signers.




luckydawg -> RE: The case that froze the banks. (10/18/2010 1:03:53 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

fr

you mean like returning that note to you when the property is paid for?

Banks lend you NOTHING.

YOU are the ONLY signor on the promissory note!

They float that note on the market and MAKE INTEREST off it as a security and YOU GET NOTHING, well you get the payments.



Imagine that!

Banks make money from loans.

And here I thought they did it just out the goodness of their hearts.

Keep spreading the truth RealOne.




What you must consider is that 224 years of established private property law- is now in question.   Since the banks will get a blanket pardon via congress- the precedent is set for crazy -- claims against private property.

The whole system is suspect now- even if your house has no mortgage on it.



No Pahunk, the whole system is not suspect but there are problems within the system.

If your house is free and clear then you have nothing to worry about, despite what the conspiracy sites you and RealOne like to believe.



Yeh you might have something there!


[image]http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o296/nine_one_one/blacks/mortgagedfornationaldebtcongress-1.jpg[/image]



the problem with having your head in the sand is your ass tends to be in the air for anything that comes along.








After all these years the Dumb ass still does not understand what the Congressional Record is. Really kind of sad.




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