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RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/25/2010 5:34:40 PM

smilingjaguar

Posts: 271
Status: offline

I have 3 littles (6, 4, and almost 2) and am married. I had three fairly complicated pregnancies and the oldest was very sick for 2 years. Even when he was caring for me, he was the boss. The orders were just different...as in yes, you're going to do as the doc says, don't you dare get out of bed, it's time for you to eat I don't care what your appetite is like, and don't hesitate to ask if you need something. We didn't play, but that isn't the entirety of our relationship. Heck, after the oldest was born I slept on the opposite end of the house in the nursery for 18 months because of her risk of aspirating food and the fact that the feeding tube sounds kept him awake at night. We're still here. The dynamic is still here. The first rule in our dynamic is that the health and well being of the family comes first always. Everything else, including my service to him and his ownership of me, comes after that.

You're getting handed a line of crap. If you want a master/dom who you marry and have a family with, you can have it. Don't settle for a sleazeball. Hold out for a real man who isn't afraid to say what he wants.

(in reply to littlewonder)

Post #: 21

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 5:58:10 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW

quote:

The first one: finding someone who joyously embraces your need for a BDSM relationship is probably the safer choice.

I have to ask this question, as a life-long poly... "safer" in what way?

Calla

Safer emotionally than being a married guy's dirty little secret.
Safer physically, too. Since he isn't fluid bonded with every girl he can get to play with him.

_____________________________

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(in reply to CallaFirestormBW)

Post #: 22

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 7:30:49 AM

CallaFirestormBW

Posts: 3651
Joined: 6/29/2008
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quote:

Safer emotionally than being a married guy's dirty little secret.
Safer physically, too. Since he isn't fluid bonded with every girl he can get to play with him.

The post in question didn't address the particulars of the OP, but was referencing poly in general... on those terms, Ok, I may not have addressed these issues in the earlier post, but "being a married guy's dirty little secret" is -not- Poly... it is "cheating", and I'm sorry, but I've been in this way of life for 30 years, and in 30 years, 'cheating' has NEVER been an acceptable definition for "polyamorous".Cheating is cheating -- it hurts everyone involved except for, maybe, the cheater... but in most cases, it comes around to the same thing.

As far as "fluid bonding", if the family in question has a "condom compact" (which most healthy poly households do), then the individuals involved are NOT necessarily bonded with "every girl [person] he [she, they] can get to play with him [her, them]". Most poly households have a set group of people who are fluid-bonded to each other, and play outside of that group is "non-fluid-exchanging". Even for me, with the knowledge that I do blood-play outside of the house, I follow -strict- protocols... the people I play with are tested, and bring their test results with them. We also use barriers (gloves, etc.) and no blood is -exchanged- outside of the group to whom I'm fluid-bonded (IE, I don't do vampire play outside of my fluid-bonded family).

Statements like those quoted show a marked unawareness of the realities of poly life and play, and these kinds of mis-understandings and biases can be very misleading to people who are trying to learn.

Calla

_____________________________

***
Said to me recently: "Look, I know you're the "voice of reason"... but dammit, I LIKE being unreasonable!!!!"

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(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 23

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 8:04:41 AM

SubmissiveFox

Posts: 23
Joined: 10/13/2008
Status: offline

Thanks for the responses.

that was interesting about the effect of children and pregnancy. I want to get married but marry someone who is dom. I would like children too - I found all this a bit depressing to be honest.

I can kind of see where he was coming from - I mean it probably doesn't sit well spanking your wife, calling her a slut and then being all "I love mummy" in front of the kids.

(in reply to CallaFirestormBW)

Post #: 24

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 8:37:10 AM

angelikaJ

Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW

quote:

The first one: finding someone who joyously embraces your need for a BDSM relationship is probably the safer choice.

I have to ask this question, as a life-long poly... "safer" in what way?

Calla

I would like to address this again if I might... Part of the issues that I have seen on the forums is sometimes when people want to fit in with partners they love but are not compatible with they engage in self-deception.

It's often hard to admit that they know deep in their heart they will always only be monogamous, or only poly... only be vanilla with no interest in BDSM or vice versa etc...or one partner wanting children and the other not.

Sometimes too, they hear the words their partner says, but deceive themselves, and try to imagine that for them, out of love their partner will change who they are for them.

In the worst cases I've seen people on either side grow resentful and angry at either the deception or needs not being met.
In the best scenarios there is sadness with the realisation that this relationship just isn't going to work.

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(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 25

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 8:49:42 AM

CallaFirestormBW

Posts: 3651
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Agreed -- this is a big issue that often shows up on the boards... I guess my issue with the comment is that these issues aren't limited to poly -- in fact, by sheer proportion they come out a lot more often in monogamous relationships, just because the largest majority of relationships that exist happen to be monogamous.

Poly does not increase the chances that someone will immerse themselves in self-deception... it is just one more category to add to the areas that a person -might- put themselves at risk if they're not completely honest. It's no different than the person who, deep inside, knows that xhe can never yield in a full-authority dynamic, and yet enters into a relationship with someone who insists on that kind of dynamic, because the one entering the relationship is SURE that "their -love- will mean that this person will change and no longer want a full-authority dynamic. Replace that example with everything from vegetarian/meat-eater to religious/atheist to talkative/silent, and then add in the whole -range- in which these imbalances can exist and it rapidly becomes apparent that relationships are risky regardless of the number of people involved... and that the most functional relationships come from knowing and accepting -yourself- first (along with the acknowledgment that one is going to -change- over time), and -then- accepting the realities of the other person, either spoken or unspoken, and recognizing what one is truly able to compromise, to -try- compromising on (with the understanding that one may find that one is not able to do so), and which things one is either unable, unwilling or both to compromise on... ONLY from there, whether poly or monogamous, can one really decide whether a given relationship is going to work.

Believe me --- I've MADE the mistakes. I was married for 13 years in a monogamous marriage because I really -liked- the person I was with... and he knew that I was poly from the outset, and that it was an -experiment- for me to enter into the relationship, because I really wasn't sure I could change enough to be the "normal" wife I thought he wanted -- HE, on the other hand, thought he could adapt to having someone who was as wild and chaotic as I was around -all- the time, and that he'd be able to adapt to my 'strangeness'... We spent 10 years in the military, where I didn't spend a lot of time with him because he was always deployed... and it only took 3 YEARS of him and I being together -all- the time to realize that NEITHER of us, as much as we cared about each other, could change our natures enough to be happy most of the time in the relationship we were in... we spent 80% of our time miserable for that 20% of the time when we were ecstatic... and that just was too imbalanced for both of us, so we ended up parting ways -- very amicably, but it was -still- very difficult... especially because we'd spent more than a decade building a life with one another. After that, I learned that, for me, I have defined boundaries that affect how much I can change to suit a relationship -- and I'm honest if it looks like what the relationship is going to -require- is going to slip far enough outside those areas of flexibility that I won't be able to hold up my end of the bargain.

Each person has to take on these responsibilities--and we can't always depend on the other person or people involved to know themselves and be capable of the amount of awareness it takes to be that honest with -us-... so there is always a risk, in every relationship -- so a monogamous partner -isn't- necessarily a "safer" option.

Does that make sense?

Calla

Calla

< Message edited by CallaFirestormBW -- 10/26/2010 8:56:46 AM >

_____________________________

***
Said to me recently: "Look, I know you're the "voice of reason"... but dammit, I LIKE being unreasonable!!!!"

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(in reply to angelikaJ)

Post #: 26

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 9:26:41 AM

Toppingfrmbottom

Posts: 6528
Joined: 6/7/2009
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certainly hope he wouldn't be doing stuff like that in front of any kids. It's absolutly abbhorent to me to think some one would. Nick names. Like slut whore n kink have no buisness around underagers.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SubmissiveFox

Thanks for the responses.

that was interesting about the effect of children and pregnancy. I want to get married but marry someone who is dom. I would like children too - I found all this a bit depressing to be honest.

I can kind of see where he was coming from - I mean it probably doesn't sit well spanking your wife, calling her a slut and then being all "I love mummy" in front of the kids.

_____________________________

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(in reply to SubmissiveFox)

Post #: 27

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 10:23:53 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SubmissiveFox

I've come across 2 married men recently who wanted to have an affair with me as a sub.

Both of them are into reasonably serious domination - slapping, rape scences, violence, ball gags etc.

Both of them have wives that don't know anything about their interest in this stuff.

One of them said to me it's not possible to be doing that with a woman if you have children. He said it's completely alien to family life.

Is this true? Is there anyone out there involved in a male dom/female sub relationship where the sub is the mother of the dom's children?

I hope this isn't true because I'm not married and I don't want to end up in this situation. Married to someone who doesn't really satisfy your sexual tastes and having to look for it outside marriage.

It seems to me that it's really common and men particularly compartmentalise their sex life. It's kind of like whore/madonna complex - I don't want my wife to be a slut for me.

What are your views/experiences?

I'm not your direct demographic. Yet, I know a good number of people who have that dynamic, have kids, and live their lifestyle in the way that they want. This is no different than vanilla couples who have children who, gee whiz, maybe they can't have sex on their kitchen floor at seven in the evening because kids are doing their homework at the table. We don't sit here and suggest that vanilla couples are doing things that are inappropriate in front of their children. I don't know why people even bring that up because the couple is interested in kink.

I'm not suggesting that every type of scene is a good idea if non adults are sleeping under the same roof. Types of play that are going to be "louder" may have to be prearranged and planned for those occasions where there are no little ears that will pick up the sounds. I had various solutions for this over the years. Certain types of play, I only did at play parties or I got a hotel room. Going to multiple day kink events was a perfect solution for this. Not only did I get the educational benefits from the event, it was a fantastic place to do those take down scenes, rape scenes, and anything else that I wanted to do that was higher in noise level. (One year, I even joked that I should have brought post-its to put on the doors of our hotel floor to say that I hope we hadn't disturbed anyone's sleep.) There are also times those little ears are away because they want to stay overnight with a friend or with a relative for the weekend.

What you're running into, OP, is just an excuse because the woman that they married doesn't share their kink interest, so they are attempting to get their wants met on the side. Otherwise, their wife would be aware of what they were doing. It's not the kids that they are worried about.

_____________________________

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Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to SubmissiveFox)

Post #: 28

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 10:42:17 AM

blkmaster4harem

Posts: 4
Joined: 11/3/2009
Status: offline

i agree with you ladypact....those men are nothing more than adulterers.....that's it...

submissivefox....it's one thing if their wives knew of their feelings and 'let' them play with other women but keeping it a secret is nothing more than an affair and cheating.....don't bother with either guy

when i get married, even if my wife doesn't share my kinks, i'll atleast tell her....if i was worried that she wouldn't accept it then i wouldn't be willing to marry her....a man or woman should trust their spouse with their kinks....if they can't then they shouldn't have married....

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 29

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 11:45:04 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW
The post in question didn't address the particulars of the OP, but was referencing poly in general... on those terms,

Cheating is not poly. The op probably doesn't know the meaning, she's new. But the situation presented had nothing to do with poly.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to CallaFirestormBW)

Post #: 30

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 2:28:31 PM

angelikaJ

Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW
The post in question didn't address the particulars of the OP, but was referencing poly in general... on those terms,

Cheating is not poly. The op probably doesn't know the meaning, she's new. But the situation presented had nothing to do with poly.

But one of my possible solutions did.

And it is a valid option.

_____________________________

The original home of the caffeinated psychotic hair pixies.
(as deemed by He who owns me)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_3234821/tm.htm

30 fluffy points!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQjuCQd01sg

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 31

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 5:31:02 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

For the men who wrote to the op, I doubt poly is a valid option. It's only valid for people who are wired for it. Regardless, even if their wives were okay with them playing with others, unless she is also friends with both, and loved by both, loving both in return, it still isn't poly. In that case it's an open relationship. However the op's question really didn't address any of this. It asked if a married couple with children could engage in a power relationship. And the answer to that, as I hope she's realized by now, is a resounding yes.

I don't think she was talking about open or poly relationships. I got the feeling she was referring to a monogamous marriage. If not, she needs to clarify and ask specific questions about the other possible dynamics.

< Message edited by DesFIP -- 10/26/2010 5:34:01 PM >

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

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Post #: 32

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 5:47:31 PM

angelikaJ

Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline

Des,

My reply (post #6 btw) was to the OP.

It was not offered as a solution to the married men.

She asked about marriage.
I offered 2 possible solutions.

I did not push poly, and in fact, my post favored monogamy.

However, at this point I want to clarify my words as you took a quote from my post and it seems to have led us down a rabbit hole.

_____________________________

The original home of the caffeinated psychotic hair pixies.
(as deemed by He who owns me)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_3234821/tm.htm

30 fluffy points!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQjuCQd01sg

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 33

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 6:13:56 PM

DarkSteven

Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SubmissiveFox

I can kind of see where he was coming from - I mean it probably doesn't sit well spanking your wife, calling her a slut and then being all "I love mummy" in front of the kids.

Why not? I treat my woman differently in different situations. Even vanillas do that.

It is NOT inconsistent to have D/s and kids. It's a bit tricky but what worthwhile things aren't?

_____________________________

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The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

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Post #: 34

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 7:54:52 PM

smilingjaguar

Posts: 271
Status: offline

It actually works rather well if you keep the spankings and pet names behind closed doors. It's no different than not doing those things in front of employers and the vanilla public.

(in reply to SubmissiveFox)

Post #: 35

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/26/2010 8:15:22 PM

DMFParadox

Posts: 1405
Joined: 9/11/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

It's a bit tricky but what worthwhile things aren't?

Sunrises. A deep breath. Morning coffee. Hearing a new song. Hearing an old song. Singing a song you half-remember.

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(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 36

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/27/2010 3:17:04 AM

SubmissiveFox

Posts: 23
Joined: 10/13/2008
Status: offline

quote:

certainly hope he wouldn't be doing stuff like that in front of any kids. It's absolutly abbhorent to me to think some one would. Nick names. Like slut whore n kink have no buisness around underagers.

OF COURSE I wasn't suggesting this went on IN FRONT of the kids.

What I meant was that I understood that theoretically it may emotionally be a difficult switch to make - to go from a behind closed doors role play dynamic of dom/sub involving verbal humiliation and violent TO THEN in the normal family environment, looking at the cute kids and having warm loving feelings to your wife as the mother of the children BUT knowing that last night you were treating her v. differently.

And yes - to clarify - my original question was about monogamous marriage and not poly.

I am scared of ending up in a relationship like these guys have with their wives. I'm not married but I'd like to be - but I don't want to be in a marriage where my (admittedly weak and tint of vanilla) sub tendancies are not met.

(in reply to DMFParadox)

Post #: 37

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/27/2010 4:36:42 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

Many people have reframed the term slut to have positive connotations, meaning someone who is self aware and without shame in regards to their sexuality. Those who do view it with this definition find it's a praiseworthy name, as it applauds her being fully herself sexually.

Regardless, if you or your partner have negative feelings about either a term or an act, then you don't have to do it. And a man who cannot respect the woman he had sex with the previous night is not someone you should marry. Just as you should not be ashamed of your sexuality, neither should he. This isn't a bdsm thing, lots of vanillas have a divide between wife and lover. Lots of women feel ashamed of being maternal and also being sexual. Lots of men chase women and say they wouldn't ever marry a woman who had sex with them on the first date. This whole attitude is wrong and can be addressed and changed with therapy.

And no, The Man has no trouble tying me up, spanking me, clamping me, laughing when I squeal, and having sex with me and then getting up in the morning and asking me to get him more tea and kissing me good morning while the teens roll their eyes and tell us to get a room!.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to SubmissiveFox)

Post #: 38

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 10/27/2010 5:22:18 AM

Nineveh

Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SubmissiveFox

quote:

certainly hope he wouldn't be doing stuff like that in front of any kids. It's absolutly abbhorent to me to think some one would. Nick names. Like slut whore n kink have no buisness around underagers.

OF COURSE I wasn't suggesting this went on IN FRONT of the kids.

What I meant was that I understood that theoretically it may emotionally be a difficult switch to make - to go from a behind closed doors role play dynamic of dom/sub involving verbal humiliation and violent TO THEN in the normal family environment, looking at the cute kids and having warm loving feelings to your wife as the mother of the children BUT knowing that last night you were treating her v. differently.

And yes - to clarify - my original question was about monogamous marriage and not poly.

I am scared of ending up in a relationship like these guys have with their wives. I'm not married but I'd like to be - but I don't want to be in a marriage where my (admittedly weak and tint of vanilla) sub tendancies are not met.

As long as you are clear with potential husbands about what you expect and hope for in the relationship you should be ok. If you ever reach a space where your sub side is not being fulfilled it's time for a good long talk about what is going on and what to do about it.

(in reply to SubmissiveFox)

Post #: 39

RE: BDSM & family life/children - 11/1/2010 1:47:54 PM

waterystream

Posts: 3
Joined: 6/29/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Welcome to collarme, dina!

Thank you Sir, been on here for a bit, just never felt the inkling to respond to anything til now... It just bites my arse when someone says there can't be a M/s or D/s relationship with a wife and children....Obviously, they have never tried it, or in this case just is an excuse to have extra curricular activites. Anyone can have the type of relationship they want to have regardless if its a vanilla world or alternative lifestyle such as ours. They just have to know what they are looking for, and not being gullible to the wiley ways of predators. Hope this finds everyone well and in good spirits.

~dina

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 40

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