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Nslavu -> RE: Critical Thinkers vs Drones (11/11/2010 8:08:32 PM)
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ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
Yikes. This makes some sense. [8D] Problem, not everyone has the courage anymore than everyone has the right people in their vicinity or any of the other variables you mention and omit.
This is the real problem. Not everyone has those qualities, or will, no matter how hard you drill it in.
I get that and that is my point. Missing a leg, missing the wired brain that eats up what's being drilled in, missing the muscles, missing whatever, shouldn't be a reason to also cripple opportunity and or payment for whatever they can do with their better individual talents that they do possess.
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But the 'other' variables? Sigh... so many ways people try to deal with that problem. Japan has a 'group mind' culture that uses peer pressure to try to keep everyone moving in the same direction. Germans lean really hard on people who don't work. Norway and Sweden are much nicer; they'll therapy you to death. It actually works pretty well for them.
America? prizes individual effort and initiative. We let people fall down. Though if someone's trying, culturally speaking, we root for them and hope for the best. We don't groupthink them. And...
...I don't see any other countries with economies three times the size of the next nearest, but with only 5% of the population. But you'd say that we do it because we're the nobles keeping everyone else down. Or as an artifact of historical processes hidden from view. There's a smidge of truth to that. But less than you'd think.
Please refer to previous post on defining Nobles. I also have noting against Americans, how they work or how they produce. I have lived there, seen it with my own eyes, and have relatives there. They do what they have to do within the system. More importantly I am not here to chastise Americans, I'm not anti american nor pro american. If there are any real Nobles in America, I wouldn't name the few I thought there were. I think it evokes the 'conspiracy bullshit' and that is far from my intentions. That they exist or not is irrelevant. That the Noble lie and its extensions and variances still exist and still affect how we treat and reward each other is what I am on about here.
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Oddly, the U.N. --NOT a U.S. run organization - says that American workers are the most productive in the world. Not just the richest... we are the ones that take X and multiply it by the most Y's. And if you're a company that can afford to play ball in this country and hire us, you get mothafuckin' PAID. Americans work longer hours and do more with what they've got than anywhere else in the world. That is, unless you'd rather ignore those statistics and buy into the idea that we're all lazy slobs. You go ahead and do that.
Well statistics kind of help paint the wall the color your hoping to show the world, or color one's words in a post to best impress the point. You've made your point. Lazy slobs? Some Americans are. Some are not. Some are lazy sometimes, while others are slobs sometimes. By and large, lazy and or slobs isn't how I would characterize Americans on the whole. It's pretty much the same here and I imagine all over the world. I don't subscribe to thinking that the majority of people on the planet want to be lazy or slobs as a career choice. Quite the reverse.
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But most people, looking at the numbers, will probably draw the conclusion that we're really wealthy because we work really hard. I guess that would be part of what feeds the whole noble lie, eh? Pure fuckin' razzle dazzle right there.
You work with the system. I've done the same. Work with it, until I realized there were other ways, even if they didn't affect the entire world and change the planet. Milk the system so you can affect change no matter how small.
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But o.k. You're making the assertion that the nobility of the world never went away, and are still running things, just being more deceptive about it.
By proxy? In any event as I said I don't care if they exist or not.
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Part of this is based on the idea that wealthy people don't need all their wealth. You draw parallels to nature. Well, here's another parallel for you.
The human brain constitutes only 7% of body mass. Yet it uses appx. 20% of the energy. That's three times the average. That's just what it uses; it regulates almost all of it.
errrm... who is regulating what is in question in my mind. The brain may be the motor but autonomic behavior and what spurs it to keep things functioning that we don't even think about on a daily basis is a matter of debate but it's off topic so...
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The percentage of 'wealth' held by the top 20% of americans is much higher, but it's misleading to draw a direct parallel, because it's primarily invested in structures and services that everyone uses. It's 'owned' by them, but used by all. Although that's misleading too, because value is not a direct one-to-one correlation to dollar amount. A million-dollar mansion is just land and structure, and its price is based on what people are willing to pay for it.
I assume you're talking about infrastructure and if so I would debate your assertion that 'what their willing to pay for it' isn't quite the same as an individual would. Government waste and stupidity is a mountain of grief. I have worked with government (contracting), and the opportunity to take advantage of their 'standard' practices is laughable and I have told them so. They still do it of course. The public wants cheap so they get it. You probably know about the 'low bidder process'? A process that constantly beats itself to death because it doesn't demand excellence, promotes poor quality then re-feeds itself in repair costs that aren't then 'bid out' It ends up costing the public more but they don't see it because it's buried in 'other items' on the budget.. I do agree with the premise that price is what people are willing to pay in the private sector though.
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But it's clear that, in nature, some head chefs are worth more fuckin' carbs than the majority of line workers. Despite all of the cells being 'useful.' The humans that pay their brain cells more, outfight the ones that paid their muscle cells more. It's not some razzle dazzle trick that the brain cells pulled on the rest of the body. Just how it is.
This interests me as a global, even regional economic model. I draw comparisons with body economy and nature economy mostly because it's self sustaining and efficient when properly used. Humans I think tend to mess it up pretty well and feck with the natural balance but we're trainable so there's hope. I'm no Hopi but I understand the wisdom in a self sustaining economy. A body needs exercise, needs food. When you over or under exercise it, it begins to fail. And every body has it's own threshold of tolerance. Analogous is your assertion of profit and loss as a body. It's all about balance. Excess and lack are damaging, just as they are in finance.
It amazes me that we don't think along these lines as it pertains to finance. Maybe someone has, you'll correct me if I'm wrong. Some people have way to much fucking money and it's throwing the world out of balance. If you have two people in one world and $100.00 dollars, with one taking $95. (for whatever reason, logical or illogical), that means the other only gets $5. That person who took the $95 better have one damned good fucking reason for taking it because the imbalance will come home to roost, especially when the one who got $5 realizes the reason is the fallacy of nobility or assumed entitlement based on false class distinction. Now if they both got $5 and $90 is used for infrastructure, things that benefit them both, then no problem.
I know that's a poor example to represent 6.6 billion people economically, but it is essentially what is going on.
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