RE: Can I learn to be a Master

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: Can I learn to be a Master

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Master >> RE: Can I learn to be a Master

Page: << < prev 1 [2]

Login

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/20/2010 7:19:34 AM

barelynangel

Posts: 6233
Status: offline

OP, before you worry about being a master OF someone, you first become a master of yourself. Without the latter, you will never have the ability to achieve the former.

Being a Master is not about what you can do with someone else, its about what you do with yourself. Then you are able to take that knowledge of yourself and apply it to mastering someone else and more so holding them in your mastery so that she can achieve your expectations and standards. Without understanding yourself, and setting and achieving your own expectations and standards, you will never be able to form the environment and atmosphere where someone else can achieve your expectations and standards.

You have the perfect practice specimen -- yourself. So master yourself completely before you try your hand at mastering others. To me, too many men try and become masters of others before they are masters of themselves. Anyone can learn to become a Dom, but being a Master of another requires a deep understanding and control of yourself. Also, in order to be a good master, you will need to know how to learn all of her, not just what she tells you or what you see, but everything about her because the goal many times in mastery is you actually do know consciously more than she knows about herself. Mastery isn't something every man is capable of, its a gift really.

Be sure you want to be a Master, you may find you are just as content simply being a dom. If you decide you want to be a master of a woman, prepare yourself for a lot of hard work and vesting a lot of time into a relationship -- both with yourself and the woman you determine you want to be a master of.

I should say this before people get their knickers in a twist lol. I don't know "doms" and what it entails to be one, so my comments are based on a very different concept between Doms and Masters. I do understand not all see a difference. But my post is creating a difference, just as i see a difference between subs and slaves.

angel

< Message edited by barelynangel -- 11/20/2010 7:23:27 AM >

_____________________________

What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
R.W. Emerson

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 21

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/20/2010 8:11:26 AM

DarkSteven

Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline

angel, that was lovely. If it was shorter, I'd add it to my sig line.

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to barelynangel)

Post #: 22

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/20/2010 8:37:45 AM

SpaceSpank

Posts: 244
Joined: 10/3/2010
Status: offline

I do agree with angel on that fully. A Master (and a Dom as well) starts with yourself. If you cannot handle your own life, you cannot, and should not, be looking to control the life of someone else in any way.

From the Master side specifically: Great, you now have a person you are responsible for! What are you going to do with him/her? Can you answer that? Can you answer it for a week? A month? A year? A decade?

If you are not prepared for that level of dedication you are not ready to own a slave. Yes, not every M/s relationship is that involved, but fundamentally speaking, you are taking a huge amount of control in that persons life onto yourself... that means a lot more than, "great, I have someone I can have pleasure me on command!".

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 23

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/20/2010 11:18:23 AM

LadyHugs

Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Wantu2bemine,

I admire someone that is honest and knows how to express it. As, everybody was new at one time but, everybody has their different traits, strengths and flaws.

The question was - can I learn to be a Master. The Answer - yes. But, with that yes, there is much work to be done to achieve that level. Just like the military has West Point, the qualities of being a leader is drawn out as well as to work hard to master your own weaknesses, flaws and doubts. This too, applies to your profession. It didn't come over night and it was as much trial and error, plus many hours, weeks, months and years to gain your first hand knowledge and skills. Mastery skills through others, via reading may give you an understanding yet, lacks in practical application. There are "academies" like Buchman's and the like. These are usually just a week's worth of sharing mastering skills and techniques on a basic level.

I consider myself an antique, as when I came into the scene, it was required to be slave first for at least a year (late 1960's) then allowed to "Switch" and that time you had a year to decide if you wished to return to a slave status or continue learning the skills of a Master. Once in the Master in training mode, you learned from your peers as well as draw on the knowledge of having been a slave, as to gain a library worth of first hand knowledge and applying it. All the tricks attempted as a slave, you know--having probably tried them yourself and are on guard for them. The mastery is having been through the slavery side, the switch is on becoming a leader and trainer of human behavior as it pleases you. Now, that said--in the early 1970's, there was a set series of protocols but, now days its very hard to find people practicing it with a few exceptions within the Gay Leather community, which is set basicly on a military style progression of earned rank, via "Earning your Leathers," and each piece was like adding a chevron to your wardrobe. But, I must add--this is more of a Lifestyle/life's choice in how to live, verses a play in a dungeon situation.

Master as a title is gender neutral. You can be a Master at whip skills yet, can't Master a human being in a submissive role. Some can Master a human and can't Master the corporal skills. Some manage both. Usually the peers help in making a balance as to be good in many areas. However, the most challenging one--is Mastering yourself and arresting ego, pride and the ease in which it offers the opportunity to abuse others, e.g. slaves, servants, submissives; in so many ways, such as emotional, mental, physical and spiritual.

Unfortunately, the community at large is often used by others to abuse. If you are committed into being a guardian of being good at your relationship with your slave(s), then commit yourself fully to the task. From raw leather to final leather, the journey with all its bumps and hollows is a very special journey for yourself and those to whom wish to join you.

I wish you much success in this journey.

Respectfully,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to wantu2bemine)

Post #: 24

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/21/2010 11:23:07 AM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: wantu2bemine
Hi, i have to be honest and up front i am new to this lifestyle and im really looking for some help, Im a 40 yr old man and was wondering if you can learn to be a master, i was introduced to this by a former girlfriend who was a sub and now im really wanting to find a sub, but i could use some guidance and maybe a little help, i have been researching this online and havent really come up with much, can someone help me out.

Of course you can learn to be a master... or... at least... most people can. Most people can learn most things to at least some passable level of skill. Training dominance into a person is not the mystery that is often presented here. SOME people... perhaps 20% or so.... are going to be just plain terribly unsuited. The rest can learn.

As ResidentSadist said though, the important point here is "learn"... which implies active effort on your part. If you're looking to learn dominance (as opposed to topping), it's going to be a LOT of active effort on your part coupled with a mentor... note I say a mentor not a class. Deep skills require a mentoring rather than a training relationship and I generally figure a year to two to really do the job (depending, of course, on the raw material I'm given to work with).

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to wantu2bemine)

Post #: 25

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/21/2010 3:52:43 PM

Zevar

Posts: 801
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: wantu2bemine

Hi, i have to be honest and up front i am new to this lifestyle and im really looking for some help, Im a 40 yr old man and was wondering if you can learn to be a master, i was introduced to this by a former girlfriend who was a sub and now im really wanting to find a sub, but i could use some guidance and maybe a little help, i have been researching this online and havent really come up with much, can someone help me out.

thanks and have a great day

In the nuthshell, either you are a Master or you are not. Then the next step would lend toward if you determine you are a Master, then it is up to you to master yourself by way of becoming the Master you claim to be. Mastering is not about tyrannically domineering of others or merely capable of various types of sexual play or technique(s). Instead it is, in part, about being masterful within your own self, thus capable of compelling another’s submission and servitude through your personal proven abilities of self mastery and ability toward inspiring another to yield.

As I noted, mastering is not about domineering another with various techniques and acts of domineering. Mastering is about demonstrating your own ability to master yourself, which is founded in a self made commitment to become the masterful master that you naturally are, while accepting your need to become skilled at mastering yourself prior to attempting to master another. To do any less, which clearly has nothing to do with being masterful, would prove yourself a mere weak minded fool that lacks self confidence to apply what you learn unto yourself first and foremost, aye!

Take care!

(in reply to wantu2bemine)

Post #: 26

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/24/2010 1:07:24 PM

happypervert

Posts: 2203
Joined: 5/11/2004
From: Scranton, PA
Status: offline

I think the question implies that you can learn to be a master in the same way you can learn to be an artist by buying a paint by numbers kit. So my answer is "No" -- you might learn what masters do, but you won't be a master if you're simply following instructions others have handed you.

< Message edited by happypervert -- 11/24/2010 1:08:42 PM >

_____________________________

"Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live." . . . Mark Twain

(in reply to Zevar)

Post #: 27

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/25/2010 5:07:55 AM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

Mastery by numbers, you may be on to something!

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to happypervert)

Post #: 28

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/25/2010 5:49:41 PM

KnightofMists

Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: happypervert

I think the question implies that you can learn to be a master in the same way you can learn to be an artist by buying a paint by numbers kit. So my answer is "No" -- you might learn what masters do, but you won't be a master if you're simply following instructions others have handed you.

I like this answer..... you can indeed learn what Masters do... just like one can learn what Artist do..... but if you don't have that specific talent within yourself.... you are not likely ever be seen to be a Master anymore than you would be seen as an Artist. Personally, I have trouble drawing stick men.. let alone a circle. But... I do seem to have some ability being the Master within my relationship with Kyra and Alandra...and who knows maybe others.

I would also add that one's Masters is another's fool. There is a personal preference and taste in what makes a good or even great Master for some and horrible Master for others. I know for myself that some slave minded individuals would never suit me just like I would never suit them. This doesn't make me less of a Master... Just one that as specific appeal to a certain type of s-type. Not unlike how some people look at some Artists.

but.... if you never believe in yourself.... somehow I am thinking it's not likely anyone will evere believe in you.

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to happypervert)

Post #: 29

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/26/2010 1:17:51 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: happypervert
I think the question implies that you can learn to be a master in the same way you can learn to be an artist by buying a paint by numbers kit. So my answer is "No" -- you might learn what masters do, but you won't be a master if you're simply following instructions others have handed you.

Wow, that's a really limited view of the available ways to learn. So what... quick fix, "for dummies" books are the only alternatives out there?

You'll note that in my answer I suggested a year or two of hands on mentoring.

I suspect that the reason nobody thinks you can learn to be dominant is that few are actually willing to put in the effort on either side to do the mentoring required. But in the workplace, for instance, where my own job performance rating was directly influenced by how successfully I trained subordinates to be dominant... well... I had plenty of incentive as did they, along with the time required, to do the job. I succeeded any number over times of the last two decades.

Honestly, it isn't that hard. Mostly it's a question of self-confidence (assuming the person has the interest). Training self-confidence isn't that hard. You start with training wheels and slowly remove the safety nets while increasing the risk. People learn, over time, that they survive... even when it all goes belly up.

There's no "quick fix" to training someone into more dominance. But most people have some sorts of kernels of dominance in them and those can be found and nurtured given sufficient time and interest and an already seasoned dominant viewpoint to do the mentoring.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to happypervert)

Post #: 30

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/26/2010 2:26:08 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHugs

The mastery is having been through the slavery side, the switch is on becoming a leader and trainer of human behavior as it pleases you. Now, that said--in the early 1970's, there was a set series of protocols but, now days its very hard to find people practicing it with a few exceptions within the Gay Leather community,

As always, that is complete bullshit. Gay leather was practiced in BARS for gods sake by the same people who brought you glory holes and bath houses. Don't take her word, or mine, pick up any book on leather written in the 1970s...like The Leatherman's Handbook which will talk about how some places had some rules, NONE of which were universal.

So, can you "learn" to be a master? Of course you can, nobody posting in this thread was born with a whip in their hand. Its like any other skill, if you want to get better, you find people, places, or sources to learn from. Natural aptitude helps but most dominants/masters are hacks so why not join the not all that exclusive club.

The reality is if you can learn to keep a woman feeling emotionally safe, you will have surpassed most posting in this thread and most dominant/masters you will ever meet, expecially those telling you that it is impossible for you to learn.

(in reply to LadyHugs)

Post #: 31

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/26/2010 3:32:02 PM

happypervert

Posts: 2203
Joined: 5/11/2004
From: Scranton, PA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

quote:

ORIGINAL: happypervert
I think the question implies that you can learn to be a master in the same way you can learn to be an artist by buying a paint by numbers kit. So my answer is "No" -- you might learn what masters do, but you won't be a master if you're simply following instructions others have handed you.
Wow, that's a really limited view of the available ways to learn. So what... quick fix, "for dummies" books are the only alternatives out there?

You'll note that in my answer I suggested a year or two of hands on mentoring.

Pat yourself on the back for being so brilliant if you like, but I'm not buying it. You can flatter yourself and think your great mentoring can make someone dominant, but if they're just doing what you say without bringing anything innate to the table, then they're simply going through the motions while being submissive to you.

_____________________________

"Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live." . . . Mark Twain

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 32

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/26/2010 5:14:37 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: happypervert
Pat yourself on the back for being so brilliant if you like, but I'm not buying it. You can flatter yourself and think your great mentoring can make someone dominant, but if they're just doing what you say without bringing anything innate to the table, then they're simply going through the motions while being submissive to you.

Wow... where to start here.

OK, I will pat myself on the back. Actually, I'm pretty proud of what I've accomplished in that vein over the last few decades. Thanks.

Now, as to whether or not you want to buy it, that's fine. But honestly, I'm not talking this pseudo self-proclaimed dominance crap that happens all too often here. I'm discussing training real life people to be real life dominant out in the real world. You know... take charge, alpha male (well, alpha-people) types... yada yada... Out in the real world, these sorts of things are actually measured through externally visible and tracked performance indicators. here in the BDSM world anyone can claim anything they want. Out in the real world, you have to actually be able to deliver.

Next, what on god's green earth makes you think that the people themselves aren't bringing anything to the table. Of COURSE they are. They are bringing themselves. But here's a little safety tip. As much as BDSM doms like to believe they are such special little snowflakes, they are not. Neither you nor I have any magical dominance gene. There's no secret sauce. It's convenient to say such things because, of course, if we can get the subs to believe us then it cuts down on competition and makes us all that much more special. Sadly, it just isn't true.

One more final point... real leaders train other leaders... it is a part of the measurement system in ANY organization I've ever seen (well, any organization with any sizable structure anyway). Honestly, anyone who says that such a thing isn't possible is pretty clearly establishing their own lack of knowledge and skill. If I'd said that at work, I'd have been summarily fired.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to happypervert)

Post #: 33

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/27/2010 6:56:48 AM

masterlink65

Posts: 683
Joined: 11/3/2007
Status: offline

Certainly, that is if you are a dom as you say., and your learning curve.you got a late start. There are places and people that can help you.

(in reply to wantu2bemine)

Post #: 34

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/27/2010 7:02:02 AM

masterlink65

Posts: 683
Joined: 11/3/2007
Status: offline

what you said is bullshit. if you are straight how do you know what gay leathermen do? I learned a great deal in a sober environment in the upper midwest, not a gay bar for miles, maybe hundreds of miles. You are obviously confused, you put down gay leather, then you tell someone to read a book about gay leather?

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 35

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/27/2010 1:15:42 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: masterlink65

what you said is bullshit. if you are straight how do you know what gay leathermen do? I learned a great deal in a sober environment in the upper midwest, not a gay bar for miles, maybe hundreds of miles. You are obviously confused, you put down gay leather, then you tell someone to read a book about gay leather?

I am many things, arrogant, cocky, abrasive, but confused I am not. Ever been to the Folsom Street Faire or Dore Alley? I doubt you have but I have, I participate in a number of communities either with or for gay leatherman and have taught for gay leather groups.

I am not putting gay men or leather down, I am simply not putting it on a false pedestal. I mention "The Leatherman's Handbook" as it is a classic done at the time, not decades later with rose colored glasses.

(in reply to masterlink65)

Post #: 36

RE: Can I learn to be a Master - 11/27/2010 1:39:00 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

On Fire Island it's referred to as the meat rack. A section of swampy land between the two gay communities where gays gather to have anonymous sex. Step off the walkway into the dark and grobe and grab the nearest person not otherwise involved. Then get back up on the walkway and go home. And it contributed enormously to AIDS transmission.

I've been out there since the 60's. I've been to parties where at some point the punch which was already pretty lethal would be dosed with hallucinogenics in preperation for orgies. I've stumbled across anonymous two, three and more somes in the dunes while going home. And yes, I've walked past the meat rack on my way to someplace else. It exists. It isn't about power but about sex. And back before Stonewall, it was probably the safest way for gays to have sex without worry of being arrested. And remained the safest way to do so without being outed for decades after.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 37

Page: << < prev 1 [2]

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Master >> RE: Can I learn to be a Master

Page: << < prev 1 [2]

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.094