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Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 12:48:03 PM

AislynLass

Posts: 56
Joined: 7/5/2009
Status: offline

I’m well aware that a submissive is entitled to choose a man on the basis of his bank account. It is just when this is done under the guise of submission, that it renders the D/s dynamic to a financial transaction.

And what happens if the man stops or is unable to make the money he was making? What if an investment fails or the market plummets? Drop him and latch onto the next man who has his wallet open? Or what happens if you can’t find the next man…what happens then if you aren’t capable of standing on your own two feet?

I never said it was a bad thing to not wish to be involved with a Dominant who can’t afford him or herself. Personally, I would not have much respect for a “Dominant” who expected a submissive or slave to financially support him or her (and I am not referring to a situation where one partner in the relationship may have become ill or lost their job). It is the mindset of using the guise of D/s to overshadow the primary purpose of golddigging.

Aislyn

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Aislyn

Life is short. bend the rules, forgive quicky, kiss slowly, love truly, laugh uncontrollably, and never regret anything that made you smile.

Post #: 1

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 12:55:19 PM

DarkSteven

Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline

In this society, ya gotta have money. That's a consideration for those on both sides of the kneel.

Both parties must bring something to the table. Work, time, abilities. And, yes, money too.

If a Dom (or the sub for that matter) suddenly cannot earn at the previous level, changes will have to be made. In my case, I was married to a woman who refused to work - she'd gotten used to staying at home with our daughter for her first five years and didn't want to reenter the world of work. She refused to contribute financially, and that was one of the factors that hurt our marriage.

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to AislynLass)

Post #: 2

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 1:19:13 PM

barelynangel

Posts: 6233
Status: offline

OP, do you have an idea of what financial security is? Its much different from choosing someone "based on his bank account." Its about THE MAN. A man who knows how to have financial security. I don't think you understand what a Man's financial security, stability and yes wealth says about him. It says a lot.

Serious question here -- what do you care what happens between two people in their relationship? You ask questions of what if, hell, EVERY relationship and choice a woman makes about a Man has a WHAT IF factor to it. Why only ask what if wherein a woman may have a financial security or hell even a financial consideration in a relationship?

Do you really think men who have been financially successful are that stupid that they don't know this expectation of the women they choose to be with? I mean seriously, do you really think the Men are THAT stupid?

So what if the answer is YES to your questions? I mean seriously, what if a woman is with a Man simply for his money and she is willing to please him as long as he keeps her in a style she wants to be kept? Are you going to really sit here and say its WRONG? Because that sure is what you are implying. Why is it wrong, people in history did it all the time. Hell that is what MOST women were required to do -- marry up, get with a Man who can keep her.

Why do you imply women who do this OBVIOUSLY can't stand on their own two feet? You do realize women who are sugar babies tend to be very intelligent and capable of not only standing on their own two feet but also learn from the men they are with?

I love the assumptions people come up with. Why do you think that a woman who wants a Man for his financial security is using D/s as a guise? To me, that concept is a HUGE concept of D/s. You have a Man who holds all the power based on her need for financial security and she in turn submits to him because of same. However, financial security tends to be a PORTION of her expectations for the man. Rarely if ever have i seen a relationship based SOLELY on her need for financial security. But i see many relationships where a PORTION of her expectations of the man is financial security.

There are MANY women wherein the Man doesn't wish his slave to work. Are you telling me that SHE should just shrug and have NO expectation of financial security, his ability to give her a retirement fund, his ability to pay the bills, his ability to know how to save and maintain a comfortable level of living? Seriously -- to me a woman would be stupid to not have financial security as part of her considerations of him.

I enjoy a certain level of living, and if a Man wants to own me, he will have to show he is 1) financially stable, 2) financially secure, 3) capable of handling finances responsibly etc. This isn't THE ONLY think i consider in the man but it is a big part of it. To me, money is power and i enjoy powerful men. I cannot see a man who is incapable of taking care of himself, incapable of being financially stable or secure as being powerful. I cannot see a man who lives paycheck to paycheck as a Man who can "take care of someone else."

Do i hold this against men, no, i understand many women who will take on men who aren't financially stable or secure. I simply am not one of them. I can't tell you what would happen if he somehow lost his ability to be financially stable or secure, i may very well determine i am better off on my own. Or i may decide to tough it out with him. But you aren't speaking of relationships, you are speaking of considerations of men who a woman MAY wish to be in a D/s or M/s relationship. BIG difference.

There are many things that hold a relationship together, and yes, i don't care what anyone says, financial stability and security IS something many women look at. If a woman wants a man for his ability to provide for her in a style she wants, so what? It utterly amazes me why so many people get their knickers in a twist about this. What do you care.

angel

< Message edited by barelynangel -- 11/14/2010 1:21:02 PM >

_____________________________

What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
R.W. Emerson

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 3

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 2:31:40 PM

AislynLass

Posts: 56
Joined: 7/5/2009
Status: offline

Yes, I do know very well what financial security is.....I worked to put myself through college and graduate school to earn financial security. And yes, I do know what a man's financial security and stability says about him. It says that he is a strong individual who is responsible and prudent, among other qualities. The interesting thing is that these qualities also pertain to a woman who earns financial security as well.

And these very same qualities are valued by the men I know who are financially successful in the women they chose to be with, unless submission is viewed by the man (and woman) as a commodity to be purchased. You made a statement regarding a man who holds all the power based on the woman's need for financial security, and she in turn submits to him because of same. This suggests that this man is primarily able to master the woman based on his financial resources, and not based on his overall qualities as a man and what he inspires in that woman...and that the woman's submission is based on consideration of the financial transaction. I don't know of many Dominants who would want a woman's submission on this basis, as opposed to their mastery of her based on their character, strength, ability to create desire within her, etc.

Aislyn

_____________________________

Aislyn

Life is short. bend the rules, forgive quicky, kiss slowly, love truly, laugh uncontrollably, and never regret anything that made you smile.

(in reply to barelynangel)

Post #: 4

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 3:41:29 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

I don't think I've ever seen someone come here or in real life and say he lost his job and that's why she's leaving him. I have seen people end relationships because he became deeply depressed and would not seek medical attention. Because he started drinking heavily, because he became verbally and physically abusive. I've also seen men end the relationship because he believed that his value as a man lay in his paycheck and that he couldn't continue to be in charge if he wasn't outearning her.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to AislynLass)

Post #: 5

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 3:46:11 PM

hlen5

Posts: 5890
Joined: 3/2/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

.......................I don't think I've ever seen someone come here or in real life and say he lost his job and that's why she's leaving him...........................

I read a Wall Street Journal article about this very subject. During the financial meltdown, this did happen. These were very high-income couples and some women DID leave for greener pastures.

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(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 6

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 4:09:39 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

People choose partners for lots of reasons, not any single one. A PART of why Carol chose me was my bank account. There are also a lot of other reasons she chose me. Together, they all went into the hopper with some sort of weighted score and out came a "yes" answer.

Honestly, women choose men in large part based on status. Money is a prime indicator of status in the US. So women choose men with fat wallets. Is this any surprise? What next? Are we going to start saying how men should care less about physical appearance? These sorts of comments are always interesting to me in that they are essentially saying, "humans should not be humans".

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to AislynLass)

Post #: 7

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 4:40:16 PM

poise

Posts: 9509
Joined: 7/3/2010
Status: offline

I don't agree that all men that have achieved financial security have great moral
character and integrity. But even supposing they did, not every strong man is looking
for an equal. Some actually thrive on having a woman that is totally dependant on them.
Have you never heard of the trophy wife?
I still fail to see how any of this is different regardless of the dynamics of the relationship...
or what your purpose of this post was....just sharing some thoughts with us?

_____________________________

When the path ignites a soul, there’s no remaining in place.

(in reply to AislynLass)

Post #: 8

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 4:41:23 PM

daddysprop247

Posts: 1712
Joined: 6/24/2005
From: DC Metro area
Status: offline

have to say, i can't/don't understand the concept of choosing a mate or even a Master based on financial status. but then i tend to be kind of idealistic and more than a little weird (some may say insane, lol)...if my Master lost everything and we became absolutely destitute and homeless, i may miss hot running water on demand something fierce, but i wouldn't see him as any less and certainly would never wish to no longer belong to him. now mind you, if we were living on the streets i'd expect him to be The Top Bum, intimidating even the psychotically dangerous streetfolks with just a look, and making sure we always had front row seats to the oil barrel fireplace in winter.

(j/k, but not really!)

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 9

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 5:22:02 PM

ExSteelAgain

Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline

Money is great and I agree being successful is indicative of positive character traits. But what if the submissive woman had more money than the guy, yet, the guy was desireable? To limit the idea to women being able to choose the men they want misses the point that it can work for both sexes and dominants as well. It depends on the individuals.

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You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to daddysprop247)

Post #: 10

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 5:32:12 PM

Lockit

Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

While I have lived in many situations, both where I have supported and been supported for various reasons, I can agree that it can be a dangerous thing for many reasons. What I also find dangerous is deciding that people that have made these choices are gold diggers, interested only in the money a man makes and picking a partner because of this. It does happen but to assume it is happening without knowing the details, is a bit presumptuous.

What two people decide to do in their relationships is theirs to own. If it turns into a disaster, they will learn a hearty lesson, but that isn't for anyone one else to decide.

We can discuss the merits of this or that all day long and I might join in, but I see no reason to give merit to the judgment of two people harming no one else and living how they wish to. What's to discuss? OP, when you cannot see the very valid points barelynangel pointed out, you aren't going to hear anything I can feebly say.

To your own self be true and leave others alone if they aren't hurting anyone.

_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!

(in reply to ExSteelAgain)

Post #: 11

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 6:07:40 PM

anniezz338

Posts: 1183
Joined: 8/17/2010
Status: offline

Money is relative. What some would consider good money, some would call it slumming.

Money is also power, which can be considered attractive, especially from a submissive standpoint. But it's not the bottom line for me. But I have to admit I enjoy a man who enjoys spending money on his girl, especially to spend time with her like going on a trip. Diamonds are nice but time with your Dom doing Paris or Rome would be awesome. Not that I wouldn't take the diamond......lol.

As for me, I don't have any money. So it's a non issue....lol.

(in reply to Lockit)

Post #: 12

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 6:09:54 PM

porcelaine

Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: poise

I don't agree that all men that have achieved financial security have great moral character and integrity. But even supposing they did, not every strong man is looking for an equal. Some actually thrive on having a woman that is totally dependant on them. Have you never heard of the trophy wife? I still fail to see how any of this is different regardless of the dynamics of the relationship...or what your purpose of this post was....just sharing some thoughts with us?

Greetings poise,

Your comments are in line with the things I've encountered in my personal relationships. I don't think that ideology is one sided. In fact, I think the other person has to be in possession of a certain mindset to make it work. Either she desires to be kept or the idea of sacrificing financial autonomy is abhorrent and she vehemently fights against it. If his personality is such where he thrives on a challenge this is obviously an area he'd address. It was a very uncomfortable notion for me to embrace and I find that level of dependence to be pleasing in some respects but probably not in my best interest in the long run.

Namaste,

~porcelaine

_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to poise)

Post #: 13

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 7:02:25 PM

sweetsub1957

Posts: 2201
Joined: 4/28/2009
Status: offline

~FR~
Were I looking, I don't think I would ever choose a mate on the basis of His bank account. I am, and intend to continue being, self-supporting. I learned my lesson the hard way, when my vanilla ex refused to let any wife of his work and, when we got divorced, I was up shit creek w/o a paddle. Never again.

If, for some reason, my mate were suddenly unable to fend for Himself, I would do my best to help Him out. I could never dump Someone because He suddenly wasn't able to take care of Himself.

~sweetsub~

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Member: Lance's Fag Hags.

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In lowering yourself to talking behind my back, you're perfectly positioned to kiss my ass.

An it harm none, do what ye wilt.

(in reply to porcelaine)

Post #: 14

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 7:06:24 PM

soul2share

Posts: 7084
Joined: 12/18/2007
From: somewhere out there.....
Status: offline

I don't really consider anyone's financial status when looking for a partner. Yes, he needs to be able to support himself, but I am NOT looking for someone to support me! The gentleman that I am currently involved with has told me, no, ORDERED me, to tell him if I need anything, be it financial support or food, or literally anything. I have always been self-supporting, and accepting financial help from him doesn't seem proper in my eyes at this stage in the game. We're off to a slow start, he's been out of town for almost 2 months selling a house, but we've been in touch alot. I was actually afraid to tell him I'd lost my job because I didn't know if he'd still want an unemployed sub. His response to the e-mail I sent was the order to tell him if I needed anything at all, no matter how big or small. That alone lifted a ton of pressure off my shoulders. He has been a great help to me when I've felt my lowest. The only other person that knows my job situation is my mom.....I didin't want to worry her, but hey, when I got let go, I just wanted my mommy! They live in NYS, so it's not like I could run to her......but now she's worried.

But I digress....no, I don't look at the size of a guy's wallet when involved with him. If he were to lose his job, I also wouldn't bail, as long as he was making an attempt to get a job...any job. Life is a bitch, and just because someone has a bump in the road doesn't mean you turn tail and split when the going gets tough. I believe in "for better or worse"!

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I have to stop saying "How stupid can you be?"...people are starting to take it as a challenge!

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Post #: 15

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 7:10:26 PM

poise

Posts: 9509
Joined: 7/3/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: porcelaine

quote:

ORIGINAL: poise

I don't agree that all men that have achieved financial security have great moral character and integrity. But even supposing they did, not every strong man is looking for an equal. Some actually thrive on having a woman that is totally dependant on them. Have you never heard of the trophy wife? I still fail to see how any of this is different regardless of the dynamics of the relationship...or what your purpose of this post was....just sharing some thoughts with us?

Greetings poise,

Your comments are in line with the things I've encountered in my personal relationships. I don't think that ideology is one sided. In fact, I think the other person has to be in possession of a certain mindset to make it work. Either she desires to be kept or the idea of sacrificing financial autonomy is abhorrent and she vehemently fights against it. If his personality is such where he thrives on a challenge this is obviously an area he'd address. It was a very uncomfortable notion for me to embrace and I find that level of dependence to be pleasing in some respects but probably not in my best interest in the long run.

Namaste,

~porcelaine

Greetings porcelaine,

While the idea of being kept does have some desirable components, I feel it would soon
lose it's appeal for me as well. I am most joyous when I know that I have earned my submission to him.
By the way, I love the variety of avatars you have been displaying of late. :)

< Message edited by poise -- 11/14/2010 7:22:01 PM >

_____________________________

When the path ignites a soul, there’s no remaining in place.

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Post #: 16

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 9:37:25 PM

Vargus2

Posts: 11
Joined: 3/24/2010
Status: offline

If you have a choice between a man who offers you finacial security or financial freedom... choose financial freedom

because that man knows that finacial security is a myth.

(in reply to poise)

Post #: 17

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/14/2010 11:44:53 PM

LuneRune

Posts: 33
Joined: 8/19/2008
Status: offline

I look at a whole slew of things when I am looking at a potential partner. But having a lot of money is not what I am looking at first. I am looking at HIM - who he is, what his character is like, how he handles himself - and whether I like him. Or not. His financial standing is part of a much larger picture, and if I find someone that really makes me say "mmmmmm" I aint gonna split because he lost his job, and/or the market took a tumble. It's a whole lot easier to overcome when there are two. Still, I wouldn't want to be him if he did decide to pick battery and abuse as his stress busters. All bets are off at that point - and I'd have one hell of a mean roundhouse comin' right back at him.

(in reply to Vargus2)

Post #: 18

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/15/2010 9:10:07 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: hlen5

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

.......................I don't think I've ever seen someone come here or in real life and say he lost his job and that's why she's leaving him...........................

I read a Wall Street Journal article about this very subject. During the financial meltdown, this did happen. These were very high-income couples and some women DID leave for greener pastures.

I read that same article. However I did state that I've never known of such a thing personally and indeed, I've never seen anyone here state that was why.

Which says to me that these relationships were marriages of convenience, made because he wanted a trophy wife to show off, agreed to for the paycheck she received. Not that they were love matches to begin with.

And yes, if he wants a hostess and someone whose sole value lies in her being arm candy, then when he is no longer keeping up his end of the bargain, there is no reason for her to do so. If your employer goes bankrupt, you don't continue to work for free, you go look for another job. And that's what those relationships appeared to be, jobs.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to hlen5)

Post #: 19

RE: Financial Considerations in Choosing to Submit - 11/15/2010 9:27:14 AM

NuevaVida

Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline

Why use the term "guise?" If both people are in agreement about what they want, and find it together, then what's the issue? Whether it's a submissive or slave who wants to be supported and not work outside the home so she can focus solely on her owner and the needs of their home, or an owner who, among many things he makes use of his slave for, her income is one of them. If both walk into the relationship fully aware and in agreement, if she submits to his authority, why is this a "guise?" I'd say both parties are fully aware and getting what they want.

For me, financial stability does not equate to wealthy. I wanted to be with someone who was financially responsible and who had a history of holding a job and being self reliant. My owner has been at his job 19 years and owns a modest home. He is not wealthy, and that's just fine with me. His character is more important to me than his bank account.

_____________________________

Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.

(in reply to AislynLass)

Post #: 20

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