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Republicans & Immigration - 12/27/2010 7:55:11 AM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline 		FYI: The Republican Party wrote last great reform of our immigration laws in 1996, and now they want to engage in more of the same.

As usual, the Republican faithful continue to allow their leaders the widest latitude to fail: banking, regulation, war, the deficit, and immigration.

P.S. When the Senate blocked the DREAM ACT, it was a prime example of how the US Senate is an anti-democratic institution. My hat's off to LaM for pointing out this issue several months ago.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 12/27/2010 7:58:39 AM >
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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/27/2010 10:11:39 AM   
Fellow


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quote:

When the Senate blocked the DREAM ACT, it was a prime example of how the US Senate is an anti-democratic institution.


It is not really true. The opposite is true: the majority of Americans are opposed to the current level of immigration. DREAM ACT actually deals with illegal immigration  Americans mostly oppose.  Personally, I think, the act should be passed in some shortened form (the current form invites fraud). If to deal with children it would not  involve many illegal immigrants (currently the Democrats try to accommodate wide range of illegal immigrants up to age 35).

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/27/2010 10:18:48 AM   
Charles6682


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From: Saint Pete,FL
Status: offline 		Honestly,I think the Ted Kennedy-John McMain immigration bill a few year's ago was a perfect compromise.I think that bill set up a fair appoarch to immigration.Clearly,that didn't pass but the ideas of the bill I feel made common sense.If people want to sit here and play "Indian and cowboys" with immigration,it wont work.We can't "round them all up with a rope" and just fling them back to Mexico.I know thats what the cowboys want though.One thing is for sure,our current immigration system is broken.

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/27/2010 9:08:19 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
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Status: offline 		Regardless of what Americans support or oppose, the US needs to resolve its immigration issues.

The 1996 Immigration Act passed by a fully Republican Congress took a punitive, closed door approach to US visitors who overstayed their visas or snuck across the border. So far this approach has lead to an estimated 11 Million illegal immigrants. It stands to reason that expanding the punitive approach will merely increase the 11 million to a higher figure while also driving up US enforcement costs as well.

Talking tough and proposing a "crackdown" on illegal immigrants sounds good, but it would adversely affect the US labor pool, cost billions of dollars to enforce, and while forcing millions of potential new tax payers and contributors to the US economy into the black market. The numbers of illegals would likely increase as well.

The infusion of talent, energy, drive, and ambition that comes with US immigrants is the life blood of the US, and it is what has made us a great nation. Draconian policies involving closed doors, deportations, etc. will only set us back as a nation. Also, these policies are not a solution, for if they were, the 1996 law would have reduced the number of illegal immigrants in the US.

I just wish the Republican faithful had a better grasp on reality, so that its leadership would be more realistic and less ideological, bombastic, angry, and ineffective.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 12/27/2010 9:13:09 PM >

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/27/2010 11:28:19 PM   
popeye1250


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Status: offline 		CB, how about Democrats and Immigration?

"We will never again seek another amnesty and the borders will henceforth be secured."
Ted Kennedy 1986

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 6:54:11 AM   
cloudboy


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Status: offline 		The Immigration Act which runs the system right now was put forth in 1996 by a Republican Congress.

No major reform of Immigration has happened since.

Why go back to more of the same? Americans need a solution that will help our economy, improve our tax base, and give hard workers contributing to the US a legal status. (Legal status does not have to be either permanent residence or citizenship, either. It could be a temporary status.)

The Dream Act was passed by the house and had a majority vote in the Senate, but was help up by a minority of Republican Senators.

This is what constitutes today's news. Ted Kennedy is dead and the 1996 Immigration Act was not his baby.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 12/28/2010 6:56:02 AM >

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 12:19:23 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

The Dream Act was passed by the house and had a majority vote in the Senate, but was help up by a minority of Republican Senators.



1. Passed by a House that shouldnt even have a vote, since they lost the confidence of the voters. The "lame duck" concept needs to be eliminated.
2. A "minority of Republican Senators" cant hold anything up.

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 12:24:32 PM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy
2. A "minority of Republican Senators" cant hold anything up.

Somebody slept through Clinton's first term, it seems...

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 4:58:34 PM   
Fellow


Posts: 1486
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Status: offline 		Chris Matthews explains the Democrat position and the state of illegal immigration affairs well here:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2010/12/28/chris_matthews_dems_dont_want_to_stop_illegal_immigration.html


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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 6:29:58 PM   
Charles6682


Posts: 1820
Joined: 10/1/2007
From: Saint Pete,FL
Status: offline 		Realclearpolitics is just another right wing website.I might as well get my news from "Fixed"news.Only CNN and MSNBC are unbiased.

< Message edited by Charles6682 -- 12/28/2010 7:03:22 PM >

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 6:42:11 PM   
TheHeretic


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From: California, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682
Only CNN and MSNBS are unbiased.





It's a shame we can't ever get a good discussion of how bias affects the news offered to consumers. If it ever happens though, maybe don't try to contribute, ok, Chuckles?

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 6:52:49 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

the majority of Americans are opposed to the current level of immigration


The majority of Americans don't know shit about the current level of immigration.

They have what they like to repeat from people's web pages, media entertainment, and partisan talking points.

They could give a shit whether it's true. They simply believe it, and get worked up over it despite their ignorance.

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 8:36:16 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

Only CNN and MSNBC are unbiased.


Even i have to disagree with this. There is no such thing as unbiased anymore.

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 9:08:38 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
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From: California, USA
Status: offline 		Right, Muse. It's not like anybody ever meets an illegal immigrant, or gets approached by five looking for day labor in a hardware store parking lot, or has a family member injured when an unlicensed, uninsured, drunk one t-bones them, and totals their car.

The media just makes it all up...

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 9:41:17 PM   
Charles6682


Posts: 1820
Joined: 10/1/2007
From: Saint Pete,FL
Status: offline 		Well,legal or not,I don't want drunks driving on the road,period.Either way,that is illegal.

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 10:25:08 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
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quote:

2. A "minority of Republican Senators" cant hold anything up.


Check the facts. Its all about the cloture rule. A minority of Republicans also blocked health care funding for 1st Responders at the scene of 9/11 until John Stewart exposed them, after which they did an about face.

The Senate as it is now set up can pretty much block all legislation that can't muster a super majority of 60 votes.

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 10:28:28 PM   
cloudboy


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Obama has deported more people than BUSH. The talk show format of Chris Mathews isn't very conducive to understanding anything.

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 10:33:30 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

Well,legal or not,I don't want drunks driving on the road,period.Either way,that is illegal.


He's always pointing out some anecdotal story to drive home a "point" about a larger policy issue. If we were discussing education, for instance, he'd probably have a story about a truant child stealing an apples from the local grocer instead of reading his text books paid for by public funding.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 12/28/2010 10:34:53 PM >

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/28/2010 11:19:18 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

The media just makes it all up...


Suddenly he trusts the media.

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RE: Republicans & Immigration - 12/29/2010 12:08:00 AM   
popeye1250


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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


Obama has deported more people than BUSH. The talk show format of Chris Mathews isn't very conducive to understanding anything.



CB, what differance does that make if he deports 400,000 illegal aliens per year but 1.5 million are sneaking over that Mexican border?
No matter what happens with immigration in the U.S. we should end all immigration from Mexico, Cent. America and the Caribean countries as they are the biggest offenders.
And what's wrong with simply ending all immigration and for a good long time?
Oh yeah, when I want an unbiased view I always watch MSDNC.

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