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LadyPact -> RE: Thanks for the permission (1/31/2011 10:12:04 AM)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant
Before I get started, let me remind you that you know I respect yours' and clip's relationship/dynamic. I am sure that clip submits because the desire to do so is within him and that his desire to serve you and be with you are prime motivating factors.
That said...
Remember the thread about male submissives? Remember that it was noted that while there is an abundance of male submissives, there are a handful of female Dominants in comparison. This allows the female dominant to be fairly choosy and to set the guidelines in a way that suits her more so than it allows the submissive to dictate things. While this is not to say that a male submissive will not have his wants and desires considered nor that they do not have at least some say in the structure of the dynamic, it is pretty clear that his voice is not as strong as hers.
It does not work that way in an awful lot of male Dominant/female submissive dynamics. Yes, the Dominant male is the leader and yes, his may be the main voice in the structuring of the dynamic. But...there are oodles and oodles of male Dominants out there...witness the submissives, even long-standing members of collarme, who receive unsolicited email from "Dominants seeking..." every day. There are not that many unencumbered female submissives by comparison. And just like in female Dominant/male submissive dynamics, this allows female submissives to be more choosy and to have a stronger voice in the dynamic/relationship structure.
Now....many male Dominants and, I am sure, even more female submissives will deny that. But, I point you to the threads you are thinking of when you posted this. I point them to many threads in which it can easily be seen that a female submissive's behavior, if bratty, is considered cute. How much of that do you see in female Dominant/male submissive dynamics? I point them to the many threads in which the changing nature of a female submissive's personality...not as submissive on some days as on others....are expected to be recognized and understood each and every time they occur. How much of that is allowed to go on in your dynamic, Lady Pact? In other female Dominant/male submissive dynamics? Look at your own words below: You make decison X. You EXPECT clip to submit to decision X. If clip does not want to submit to decision X, he is free to leave the dynamic. Now then, while there are a few that will admit to it (Me being one of them)....most male Dominants cannot, at least in the beginnings of a dynamic, afford to be that, for lack of a better word, cavalier about their dynamic. And many female submissives...though they will pay lip service to their own obedience and deny it...would not stand for a dynamic in which this was the rule for very long. I have seen it personally...and I have seen it in many conversations I have had with female submissives. Again...the ration comes into play.
A number of very interesting points in this, Creative. The first one that I'm going to give you right off of the bat is that the original was *not* written with a new dynamic in mind. I absolutely see the obedience issue as one that increases over time as trust increases. That is definitely how it has worked for us. Trust, as well as expectations of obedience have increased as the dynamic has more longevity.
Quick mention here. No, the bratty thing is not considered "cute" by Me. No offense to anyone out there who has that as a part of the dynamic, but it's not something that works for Me. I recently mentioned in another thread that, even if MP were submissive, he and I would not work as D/s and I'm basing that on the very concept that he is a brat type. I know this from our discussions together and that is exactly why we would be hypothetically mismatched.
It's an interesting thought there that you have on what I've been calling the 'numbers game' lately. This being the very concept that women on either side of the kneel (especially on sites like CM) have more of an advantage when it comes to the selection of partners. It's very interesting to Me thinking this also may be a factor, especially in the beginning of a dynamic.
quote:
Though it has not happened a lot, I can tell you that I have had more than one cmail from submissives who took exception to these statements in my profile..."If you are going to submit, then do so." "....(paraphrasing myself here) It is my way or the highway". Even though there are explanations with both statements that lessen the harshness of first reading/sound of the statements.
I will go on to read the rest of the thread and add more later. Interesting post, LadyP...smiles
This does lead Me to wonder if, due to the circumstances of numbers, that some are more lenient in their expectations of obedience for different periods. Something for Me to mull over.
Edited...... fixing quotes.......again.
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