RE: This just in re 0bama0Care

RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (Full Version)

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willbeurdaddy -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 4:56:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Well, dumbed down.....it's dumb. Congress makes a wide range of laws not mentioned in the Constitution. Now, the Constitution spells out a few they can't....but your characterization is inaccurate. No, it isnt inaccurate. Every Federal law that hasnt been stricken down has been found by SCOTUS to have or has not been challenged as having a basis in some part of the Constitution. People will disagree all the time about whether SCOTUS was right in every case, particularly wrt to the ever extending reach of the Commerce Clause, but that doesnt change the fact that every law made by Congress MUST have an explicit basis in the Consitution.

Musicmystery -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 5:04:55 PM)
Like, the right to an abortion? Which article is that one again?

sonictraveler -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 5:08:46 PM)
They force us to buy Apache helicopters, tanks, and guns already...I'd rather be forced to pay into a health care system that doesn't leave people in the dust instead. *Not in reply to musicmystery, just hit fast reply and it automatically did that.

willbeurdaddy -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 5:09:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Like, the right to an abortion? Which article is that one again? What are you into lobbing softballs today? The RvW/privacy argument is EXACTLY what I said above. The Constitution DOESNT mention abortion, therefore they cannot PROHIBIT abortion.

Musicmystery -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 5:18:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sonictraveler They force us to buy Apache helicopters, tanks, and guns already...I'd rather be forced to pay into a health care system that doesn't leave people in the dust instead. Agreed. Our military is larger than the rest of the world's combined. Surely there's a few bucks to be spared without the world going to hell. Start with the stuff Congress buys that the Pentagon doesn't even want.

willbeurdaddy -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 5:47:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sonictraveler They force us to buy Apache helicopters, tanks, and guns already...I'd rather be forced to pay into a health care system that doesn't leave people in the dust instead. When they deliver your Apache that youre forced to buy, let me know. Till then your argument is totally senseless.

Knightwalker -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 8:27:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Our military is larger than the rest of the world's combined. A quick google search can spare you from making statements as false as this one. China alone has more than we do. Add in Iran and North Korea and they have 4 times the size of our forces.

Knightwalker -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 8:34:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy When they deliver your Apache that youre forced to buy, let me know. Till then your argument is totally senseless. You do realize the majority of our tax dollars goes to the defense budget, right? We have no choice in paying taxes, the largest percentage of those taxes go to defense, the defense budget buys military hardware -- ergo we're "forced" to buy Apaches (along with a bunch of other cool toys).

Musicmystery -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 8:39:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Knightwalker quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Our military is larger than the rest of the world's combined. A quick google search can spare you from making statements as false as this one. China alone has more than we do. Add in Iran and North Korea and they have 4 times the size of our forces. Here's your Google search. We're talking about spending, remember? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_expenditures#SIPRI_Military_Expenditure_Database

Knightwalker -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 8:46:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Here's your Google search. We're talking about spending, remember? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_expenditures#SIPRI_Military_Expenditure_Database No, when you mentioned size, that's what I searched. How much is spent is not really the point. You made the statement that our military was larger than the rest of The world's combined. It's not. So it's in our best interest to spend what we do. When we start cutting back, and our forces are already dwarfed by our enemies, that's a problem.

Musicmystery -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 8:48:29 PM)
quote: You do realize the majority of our tax dollars goes to the defense budget, right? Speaking of false statements, a simple Google search would show you that 20% goes to defense, not "the majority."

Musicmystery -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 8:53:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Knightwalker quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Here's your Google search. We're talking about spending, remember? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_expenditures#SIPRI_Military_Expenditure_Database No, when you mentioned size, that's what I searched. How much is spent is not really the point. You made the statement that our military was larger than the rest of The world's combined. It's not. So it's in our best interest to spend what we do. When we start cutting back, and our forces are already dwarfed by our enemies, that's a problem. Simple logic should point out to you the problem with this. Just what are we spending it on? For example, sure, China has more boots. But we have more reserves, far more air and navy capacity--and we fantastically outspend them. Maybe we should buy our equipment from the Chinese?

Knightwalker -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 8:54:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery quote: You do realize the majority of our tax dollars goes to the defense budget, right? Speaking of false statements, a simple Google search would show you that 20% goes to defense, not "the majority." Really? Because according to this chart: http://www.federalbudget.com/ It would seem to be a bit more. While I was wrong about it being in the top spot, 2nd place ain't far off.

Musicmystery -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 8:57:17 PM)
You don't know how to read the chart. Treasury, Health/Human Services, and SS are all in the same ballpark as Defense. Are they ALL the majority?

Knightwalker -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 8:59:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Simple logic should point out to you the problem with this. Just what are we spending it on? For example, sure, China has more boots. But we have more reserves, far more air and navy capacity--and we fantastically outspend them. Maybe we should buy our equipment from the Chinese? Oh simple logic has shown the problem, but ain't on my side of the discussion. You mention and compare China to us and talk reserves. Great, now add in North Korea, Iran and any other country who hates us. Oh, and don't forget the enemies we have that don't claim a country. Suddenly our reserves aren't lookin' so vast, are they?

Musicmystery -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 9:00:52 PM)
Again, you've got talk, and nothing else. Except charts you can't read.

Musicmystery -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 9:02:19 PM)
Try pie graphs. It's easier to look at the pictures. [image]http://armscontrolcenter.org/policy/securityspending/articles/us_vs_world.gif[/image]

Knightwalker -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 9:06:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery You don't know how to read the chart. Treasury, Health/Human Services, and SS are all in the same ballpark as Defense. Are they ALL the majority? You may want to look again. Look at the colors and they are coded by year. Health/human services is no. 1, SS and defense are pretty close, with defense only slightly behind. Treasury is a distant 4th. Even in third, however, defense is still a huge portion, so my point about being forced to buy military toys is valid. Try not nitpicking the details and glean the point of a statement. Would save a lot of bullshit arguments.

Knightwalker -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 9:10:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Again, you've got talk, and nothing else. Except charts you can't read. Wrong again. But some people make such claims when they are losing. I've already stipulated that my "exact" placement of defense in relation to our spending was off a bit. You, however, can't admit you were wrong about our military's size (and instead try to claim you were only talking about spending).

Musicmystery -> RE: This just in re 0bama0Care (2/2/2011 9:10:46 PM)
Oh Jesus Christ. You said the majority--that's 50% plus. It's not. It's 20%. Hardly a small difference. Deal with it. Bullshit indeed.

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