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In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 1:24:24 AM

kefgirl

Posts: 6
Joined: 11/2/2010
Status: offline

Tal and greetings to all. As I am relatively new to living the life.I find myself in a need for impartial guidance.
Names of persons involved will never be released. This is non fiction.
A female slave who was 'submitting' to her in-loco parentis Master, during a discipline session , the Master broke His cane...leaving bleeding cuts.
The master in question is an expert in His field, and a highly experienced Master having been active in the lifesyle for over 30 years.
Background info provided. My question is twofol
1: Master has additional responsibility in caring for another Masters property- yes/no ?
2: The bleeding cuts became infected, yet at no point did this "Highly Experieced" in-parentis even bother to send the girl a txt msg to astertain that all was well -is this normal/acceptable practice -?
3: The above event was a one off, though the persons involved have known each other for some time.
Yes, I understand I am capable of caring for infected wounds, however that is not my point. Repeated, constructive feedback would be most welcome. kefgirl

Post #: 1

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 1:28:51 AM

gungadin09

Posts: 3232
Joined: 3/19/2010
Status: offline

My opinion is this: that you already know the answer to your question.

pam

(in reply to kefgirl)

Post #: 2

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 1:55:07 AM

Palliata

Posts: 371
Joined: 8/9/2010
Status: offline

As gungadin says, the answer is fairly obvious. The degree to which the scene was taken is reasonable to precisely the degree the participants believe it is, but aftercare should have been watched more carefully without much doubt.

_____________________________

I speak not of The Way, but only My Way. Think it not an indictment of Your Way.

I'm male. I know it sounds female. Work with me.

(in reply to gungadin09)

Post #: 3

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 1:58:44 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

Tal lass. I messaged you on the other side, which may help.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to kefgirl)

Post #: 4

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 2:03:53 AM

Focus50

Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline

Well I'm too much of an ignorant hick to know what "in-loco parentis" even means so I'll just write that off as window dressing of the grandiosely pretentious and superior.

And where there's fluff, there's flakes.... Cues the expert "master" of 30yrs experience who broke his cane in creating bloody cuts.

1. As much as I care about and respect my own property; I'm doubly dilligent when dealing with the property of others. Pride comes to mind here; reputation, too.... But then I don't pass my slave property around to anyone.

2. Anything is "normal" to those who pass around (or agree to a dynamic of being passed) another person like hors d'oeuvres.

3. One off to her, maybe.... One off to him? You don't get to be that reptilian overnight. Me thinx you've found his true area of expertise.

What you're dealing with is a "Highly Experieced" abusive, self-entitled arsehole. You look older than a scatter-brained teenager - you don't have the life experience to recognise that in those who cloak themselves in lifestyle trappings and formal protocols? Dayam woman; everyone's naked underneath - IF you think about it...!

Focus.

_____________________________

Never underestimate the persuasive power of stupid people in large groups. <unknown>

Your food is for eating, not torturing. <my mum> (Errm, when I was a kid)

(in reply to gungadin09)

Post #: 5

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 4:55:07 AM

angelikaJ

Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kefgirl

Tal and greetings to all. As I am relatively new to living the life.I find myself in a need for impartial guidance.
Names of persons involved will never be released. This is non fiction.
A female slave who was 'submitting' to her in-loco parentis Master, during a discipline session , the Master broke His cane...leaving bleeding cuts.
The master in question is an expert in His field, and a highly experienced Master having been active in the lifesyle for over 30 years.
Background info provided. My question is twofol
1: Master has additional responsibility in caring for another Masters property- yes/no ?
2: The bleeding cuts became infected, yet at no point did this "Highly Experieced" in-parentis even bother to send the girl a txt msg to astertain that all was well -is this normal/acceptable practice -?
3: The above event was a one off, though the persons involved have known each other for some time.
Yes, I understand I am capable of caring for infected wounds, however that is not my point. Repeated, constructive feedback would be most welcome. kefgirl

The master in question is an expert in His field, and a highly experienced Master having been active in the lifesyle for over 30 years.
Anyone can claim anything. Having so-called experience does not equal being skilled at anything.
How do you know that any of what he has told you was true anyway?

Is your in loco-parentis Master subbing for Your current Master or filling in until you have found someone permanent?

How much of any of this has been discussed before hand: what he expects of you and what he gives in terms of aftercare?
Since you are new, if is unlikely you are fully aware of what you need.

There is no "normal, acceptable practice". There is only what has been negotiated and mutually agreed upon by both people.
However, it is normal practice to adminster first aid to things that bleed.

Also there is what is acceptable to you and this clearly was not in many areas.

_____________________________

The original home of the caffeinated psychotic hair pixies.
(as deemed by He who owns me)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_3234821/tm.htm

30 fluffy points!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQjuCQd01sg

(in reply to kefgirl)

Post #: 6

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 5:17:42 AM

DarkSteven

Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline

There is also complicit responsibility in your Master who is responsible for ensuring that Mr. In Loco Parentis would take care of his property. I would only trust one other person I know locally for something like that - too great a risk.

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to angelikaJ)

Post #: 7

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 6:31:13 AM

NuevaVida

Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

There is also complicit responsibility in your Master who is responsible for ensuring that Mr. In Loco Parentis would take care of his property.

Well this was my thought. It's up to the two masters to work out. And it's between you and your master to work out. It appears not all was talked through before this occurred (who provides after care, what if there's an injury, etc.). Maybe"in-loco" is a schmuck, but maybe he's not. Maybe he contacted your master to see how you are. Maybe he doesn't give a shit. Who knows. But ultimately it's between you & your master. If you're his property, and he loaned such property out, and you feel crummy about it, then talk to him.

We don't know enough info here. How long have you & your master known in-loco? How much was communicated while arranging for this caning session? What expectations were set before hand? Was your master attending the caning? Why didn't your own master care for your infections? And so on.

My cold-ass belief is in-loco really owes you nothing at this point. Sure it's disappointing when people lack compassion, but unfortunately it happens. Compassion is not owed. That's why we appreciate it so much when we get it. However, we need to be accountable for keeping ourselves safe. I would be very concerned at my master putting me in the hands of a man with a cane, that he did not know, simply based on a "years of experience" criteria. I would think my master had lost his marbles, and you can be damn sure I'd be holding him accountable for any injuries.

I do hope your wounds heal up quickly.

_____________________________

Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 8

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 6:44:09 AM

Hillwilliam

Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline

If I borrow a friend's car (his property) and I damage it. Am I responsible for repairs? Damn right I am.

Should it be different for a sub?

(in reply to NuevaVida)

Post #: 9

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 6:45:47 AM

angelikaJ

Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline

FR:

We also do not know the length of time you have been with your Master before he let you into another's care.

I am sorry that you have found yourself in such a position of uncertainty.

What does your Master say about all this?

< Message edited by angelikaJ -- 2/5/2011 6:46:29 AM >

_____________________________

The original home of the caffeinated psychotic hair pixies.
(as deemed by He who owns me)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_3234821/tm.htm

30 fluffy points!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQjuCQd01sg

(in reply to NuevaVida)

Post #: 10

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 7:03:11 AM

BonesFromAsh

Posts: 1362
Joined: 6/17/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kefgirl

Tal and greetings to all. As I am relatively new to living the life.I find myself in a need for impartial guidance.
Names of persons involved will never be released. This is non fiction.
A female slave who was 'submitting' to her in-loco parentis Master, during a discipline session , the Master broke His cane...leaving bleeding cuts.
The master in question is an expert in His field, and a highly experienced Master having been active in the lifesyle for over 30 years.
Background info provided. My question is twofol

My question to you is simple....is the use of the term "in loco parentis" to describe this dynamic yours or your master's?

[Latin, in the place of a parent.] The legal doctrine under which an individual assumes parental rights, duties, and obligations without going through the formalities of legal Adoption. In loco parentis is a legal doctrine describing a relationship similar to that of a parent to a child. It refers to an individual who assumes parental status and responsibilities for another individual, usually a young person, without formally adopting that person.

Do you see where my confusion comes from? How far did the rights of this "playtime" master extend?

quote:

1: Master has additional responsibility in caring for another Masters property- yes/no ?

Please see above. Again, for me, much would depend on the extention of rights this person had as compared to those of your master.

quote:

2: The bleeding cuts became infected, yet at no point did this "Highly Experieced" in-parentis even bother to send the girl a txt msg to astertain that all was well -is this normal/acceptable practice -?

Normal is relative. For him, this could be normal. Is it normal for you? For your master?

quote:

3: The above event was a one off, though the persons involved have known each other for some time.
Yes, I understand I am capable of caring for infected wounds, however that is not my point. Repeated, constructive feedback would be most welcome. kefgirl

What was a "one off"...him breaking a cane and causing cuts to bleed? Not checking in on you afterwards? Not providing aftercare? You being loaned out to a person for use?
I gather from your post that you expected a certain amount of care from this person...if you knew this person beforehand, were your expectations "normal" given his past behavior?
I have more questions than answers to offer.

(in reply to kefgirl)

Post #: 11

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 8:04:20 AM

IrishMist

Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

Well I'm too much of an ignorant hick to know what "in-loco parentis" even means so I'll just write that off as window dressing of the grandiosely pretentious and superior.

And where there's fluff, there's flakes.... Cues the expert "master" of 30yrs experience who broke his cane in creating bloody cuts.

1. As much as I care about and respect my own property; I'm doubly dilligent when dealing with the property of others. Pride comes to mind here; reputation, too.... But then I don't pass my slave property around to anyone.

2. Anything is "normal" to those who pass around (or agree to a dynamic of being passed) another person like hors d'oeuvres.

3. One off to her, maybe.... One off to him? You don't get to be that reptilian overnight. Me thinx you've found his true area of expertise.

What you're dealing with is a "Highly Experieced" abusive, self-entitled arsehole. You look older than a scatter-brained teenager - you don't have the life experience to recognise that in those who cloak themselves in lifestyle trappings and formal protocols? Dayam woman; everyone's naked underneath - IF you think about it...!

Focus.

It's not very often that I actually agree with Focus50, but in this case, I can happily say that I do. He said it perfectly, on all counts.

_____________________________

If I said something to offend you, please tell me what it was so that I can say it again later.

(in reply to Focus50)

Post #: 12

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 8:11:13 AM

windchymes

Posts: 9410
Joined: 4/18/2005
Status: offline

I make it a practice not to associate with parentises who are clearly loco.

_____________________________

You know it's going to be a GOOD blow job when she puts a Breathe Right strip on first.

Pick-up artists and garbage men should trade names.

(in reply to IrishMist)

Post #: 13

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 8:45:01 AM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
Status: offline

you're a grown up.

Take responsibility for yourself.

He was some guy you played with and you expected him to take care of you? Why?

Not much different than a one night stand imo.

I wouldn't expect a one night stand to call me the next day and ask me if I'm ok.

(in reply to windchymes)

Post #: 14

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 9:56:17 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

You're underage and your parents signed a legal document saying he was to be your guardian while they were out of town? That's the only construct I can get from in loco parentis.

Or you chose to play with someone new, and didn't bother to find out if he knew what he was doing? Which is it?

Going on the assumption it was the latter, you folks hadn't negotiated anything other than a random play session. That's what you got. Since you didn't go home and put neosporin on your cuts, they became infected. He holds no responsibility.

Now, was he an ass? I don't know. You got exactly what you asked for, a one off session. If you didn't discuss aftercare before playing, then he wasn't expected to provide it. Lots of tops don't do this for random one time playmates. Lots of bottoms don't want it from tops they aren't involved with.

You didn't bother to tell him you expected aftercare. You didn't discuss anything ahead of time. So now you've learned what you need to differently in the future.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to littlewonder)

Post #: 15

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 10:17:22 AM

kefgirl

Posts: 6
Joined: 11/2/2010
Status: offline

Greetings all to You that have taken the time to post a reply. Here is a list of points to ponder;
1:said 'exp Master of 30yrs' not a one night stand
2:Loco in Parentis means exactly that >given by girls owner
3:Was a punishment session, not play. Aftercare was not discussed.
4:I do not have a problem with the 'punishment' itself.
5:Said 'expert' disclosed AFTERWARDS that He has been waiting five months to break that cane over intense feelings "of anger" towards a former sub of His.
Perhaps point 5 may answer the 'why' question of non existant aftercare.
In hindsight, this posting may be better suited to 'Ask a Sub/Slave. If I have made a mistake then I will apologize.
Aftercare is not about 'looking for compassion', it is ethics 101, surely?, even if one is annointed "property".
Thank you all for your considered thoughts. I am gratefull.

(in reply to littlewonder)

Post #: 16

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 10:22:30 AM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
Status: offline

I still hold by my words...

be an adult. Take care of yourself.

If you don't know how to take care of a cut then you need more than just a Master.

I'll never ever understand posts like this.

So your Master gave you to someone else to punish you and you expected that guy to call you and ask you how you were? Why? He had zero responsibility towards you imo.

So you got some cuts from a cane. It happens. Take care of them and move on instead of waiting for someone else to baby you.

< Message edited by littlewonder -- 2/5/2011 10:23:28 AM >

(in reply to kefgirl)

Post #: 17

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 10:27:02 AM

DarkSteven

Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline

Sorry, but you're not going to convince me that he held feelings of intense anger for five months. And someone who is a Master with 30 years of experience would not discipline in anger, especially five month fermented anger.

You say that you have one Master in your life, and another that you submit to locally. Any reason neither is mentioned in your profile?

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to kefgirl)

Post #: 18

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 10:30:21 AM

kefgirl

Posts: 6
Joined: 11/2/2010
Status: offline

To clarify;
The 'expert Master of 30 yrs' wiped the blood of my thigh with sweat covered fingers...perhaps that may be a reason the cut became infected. However that is not the original question. Perhaps the said expert thought 'property' is beneath or not deserving of aftercare ?. However that is a topic in itself.

(in reply to kefgirl)

Post #: 19

RE: In loco-parentis & Responsibility. - 2/5/2011 10:33:54 AM

BonesFromAsh

Posts: 1362
Joined: 6/17/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kefgirl

1:said 'exp Master of 30yrs' not a one night stand

So then, you've scened with this "master" before? If not, I would say it's equivalent to a one night stand.

quote:

2:Loco in Parentis means exactly that >given by girls owner

Did you read the link I posted? Are you saying your owner/partner legally signed away your rights to this "master" for a punishment session?

quote:

3:Was a punishment session, not play. Aftercare was not discussed.

Your bad. If you need/expect aftercare then it's your responsibility to speak up. If you're saying aftercare wasn't an option due to the nature of the scene (punishment not play) then the expectation of aftercare would fall to you.

quote:

4:I do not have a problem with the 'punishment' itself.

But it would seem you had expectations that weren't met or even discussed prior. Why?

quote:

5:Said 'expert' disclosed AFTERWARDS that He has been waiting five months to break that cane over intense feelings "of anger" towards a former sub of His.

Given that this wasn't discussed prior to the punishment by he, you or your owner/partner...his motives are nothing more than his. Communication is key.

quote:

Perhaps point 5 may answer the 'why' question of non existant aftercare.

Not for you, it would seem.

quote:

In hindsight, this posting may be better suited to 'Ask a Sub/Slave. If I have made a mistake then I will apologize.

The majority of your responses came from people who identify as s-types so no apology really need, in my opinion. The boards tend to be free-flowing in that regard.

quote:

Aftercare is not about 'looking for compassion', it is ethics 101, surely?, even if one is annointed "property".

This assumes a uniform code of ethics between those who involved in what it is that we do. Never assume.

quote:

Thank you all for your considered thoughts. I am gratefull.

You're welcome. Good luck. I would suggest you attend some local groups/munches and gain some exposure to others. Everyone was new at one time, the responsibility falls to you to learn and explore what your wants and needs are and how they relate to whatever dynamic you choose to participate in.

(in reply to kefgirl)

Post #: 20

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