Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 1:12:08 PM   
luckydawg


Posts: 2448
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline
yeah, but let him say what he meant.

and I think the strategy I outlined would fall under a "tactic" in number 10.

10. The major premise for tactics is the development of operations that will maintain a constant pressure upon the opposition.


IF you were going into a mass meeting, and you set up what I described ahead of time, it would put a lot of pressure on the opposition.




_____________________________

I was posting as Right Wing Hippie, but that account got messed up.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 1:13:51 PM   
luckydawg


Posts: 2448
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

I give up. You guys sound like a bunch of hoods in "The Usual Suspects" scaring each other with ghost stories about Keyser Soze. The comedic value of this thread is no longer enough to warrant the waste of time. Have fun, and be sure and let the rest of us know if you decide that Saul Alinsky is really the anti-christ and he's actually alive and living in the basement of the White House. 



Which is of course number 5 on the list



5. Ridicule is man's most potent weapon.


_____________________________

I was posting as Right Wing Hippie, but that account got messed up.

(in reply to ThatDamnedPanda)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 1:16:52 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
Well now it's, "what??!?!?!" to you, Panda. I'm wondering about something. You said you worked with organizations where he was known and admired, if given the latitude and grains of salt we provide to mad scientists we like, but have you brushed up on "Rules for Radicals?"



_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to ThatDamnedPanda)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 1:25:01 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
In the old days Alinsky would be called, "a liar."

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 1:39:41 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

In the old days Alinsky would be called, "a liar."


That's amazing.

You've heard of Alinsky but don't know who Glenn Beck is.

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 1:40:52 PM   
ThatDamnedPanda


Posts: 6060
Joined: 1/26/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Well now it's, "what??!?!?!" to you, Panda. I'm wondering about something. You said you worked with organizations where he was known and admired, if given the latitude and grains of salt we provide to mad scientists we like, but have you brushed up on "Rules for Radicals?"




I'm familiar with them, and - like every other organizer I ever met - I find them on the whole to be as silly, as irrelevant, and as distasteful as I do this paranoid obsession you people have with them.

I've already tried to tell you this a couple of times, but you don't seem to care, so why you'd ask again is a mystery to me. It seems pretty clear you've already decided what opinion you want to have of Alinsky and his supposed diabolical influence on all levels of American government, and aren't interested in anything that might jeopardize that misconception. So just go ahead and continue to think what you want to think.

< Message edited by ThatDamnedPanda -- 2/27/2011 1:51:59 PM >


_____________________________

Panda, panda, burning bright
In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Made you all black and white and roly-poly like that?


(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 1:42:21 PM   
ThatDamnedPanda


Posts: 6060
Joined: 1/26/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

In the old days Alinsky would be called, "a liar."


How would you know? You don't know shit about Alinsky except what you've read in these ghost story threads, which is to say you don't know shit about Alinsky. In the old days, that would be called "ignorant."


_____________________________

Panda, panda, burning bright
In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Made you all black and white and roly-poly like that?


(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 3:07:45 PM   
luckydawg


Posts: 2448
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline
yep, no organizer has ever given Alinsky any credit. They all consider him irrelevant and distastefull.....


_____________________________

I was posting as Right Wing Hippie, but that account got messed up.

(in reply to ThatDamnedPanda)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 3:15:18 PM   
ThatDamnedPanda


Posts: 6060
Joined: 1/26/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg

yep, no organizer has ever given Alinsky any credit. They all consider him irrelevant and distastefull.....



Is English not your first language? Is that part of the problem? Or is it simply that you're not smart enough to understand what people are saying? I've always been curious to know what it is with you.


_____________________________

Panda, panda, burning bright
In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Made you all black and white and roly-poly like that?


(in reply to luckydawg)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 3:54:00 PM   
luckydawg


Posts: 2448
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline
13. Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.



_____________________________

I was posting as Right Wing Hippie, but that account got messed up.

(in reply to ThatDamnedPanda)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 4:14:46 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

In the old days Alinsky would be called, "a liar."


That's amazing.

You've heard of Alinsky but don't know who Glenn Beck is.




Rule, I do now and wouldn't you agree that they're both fuckin' liars?

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 9:37:22 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
Read it for yourself.

http://www.illinoisloop.org/dz_delphi00.html

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to luckydawg)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 9:44:13 PM   
luckydawg


Posts: 2448
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline
Thanks Tazz, so it was exactly what I thought it was.

"his first encounter with a facilitated school meeting using Delphi/Alinsky techniques to cultivate a desired conclusion."


You don't have a problem with the govenrment using tactics like that to negate the use of Public input?

Really?



_____________________________

I was posting as Right Wing Hippie, but that account got messed up.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 9:47:19 PM   
luckydawg


Posts: 2448
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline
Basically the idea goes something like this: An organization (such as a school district) has already decided what it is going to do, but it wants to avoid the appearance that it has acted without public approval. So it schedules a public meeting which is advertised as being held for the purpose of soliciting community input. In fact the organization has no desire to solicit opinions; rather the real intent of the meeting is to give the community the impression that input was solicited.

The meeting goes like this: Everyone arrives and sits down. After an introductory talk, audience members are told that they are going to be divided into N groups (N might be any number depending upon the audience size). So everyone is asked to count off from 1 to N going up and down the seated rows. Each person is then directed into a group whose name is the same as the number that he or she counted off. So for example, if you counted "2" when the count came around to you, then you go to Group 2. There are, of course, N group leaders who then carefully direct the discussion of each group. Each group leader controls the format and, to a great degree, the content of each group's discussion.

Toward the end, group members are asked for inputs, which are then listed on a big sheet of paper by the group leader. At the end of the meeting, everyone reassembles. The sheets from all the groups are posted around the room and each group leader reads the list of suggestions that are on his list. Unpopular or unusual inputs are glossed over and downplayed, while the majority of attention is focused on those ideas that are generic enough that almost everyone would agree to them. At the end a summary is delivered and everyone goes home.

The purpose of the countoff is to split up anyone who came in together, so that each of the N groups will most likely consist entirely of people who have never met, and almost certainly will not contain any two or more like-minded individuals who may have come in together. Once everyone is split up in this manner, the group leaders can then easily control the group conversations because dissenting or outspoken individuals are generally alone in each group, and such people quickly discover that they have little or no support from other group members.


It is a radical perversion of the spirit of Democracy

.

_____________________________

I was posting as Right Wing Hippie, but that account got messed up.

(in reply to luckydawg)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/27/2011 10:12:15 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg

Thanks Tazz, so it was exactly what I thought it was.

"his first encounter with a facilitated school meeting using Delphi/Alinsky techniques to cultivate a desired conclusion."


You don't have a problem with the govenrment using tactics like that to negate the use of Public input?

Really?




Before you even try and get snarky with me on this topic, I freely admit I dont know much about it, which is why Rich, in part, started this thread. My posts here are just to try and gain some understanding, not to be belittled in the process of learning.

So, if snark is on your agenda, keep it to yourself.

SOME of us are trying to have an intelectual discussion.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to luckydawg)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/28/2011 12:02:46 AM   
luckydawg


Posts: 2448
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline
Tazz, you stated,

" As I told Rich in another thread, what I am reading doesnt sound like an evil, twisted plot... "



Having your statements challenged is part of an intellectual conversation.

Does that sound like a legitimate public meeting?

Or a perversion of the process?




_____________________________

I was posting as Right Wing Hippie, but that account got messed up.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/28/2011 4:49:19 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg

Thanks Tazz, so it was exactly what I thought it was.

"his first encounter with a facilitated school meeting using Delphi/Alinsky techniques to cultivate a desired conclusion."


You don't have a problem with the govenrment using tactics like that to negate the use of Public input?

Really?




You, in this post, were assuming it was something I was doing deliberately.

Challenging is one thing... baiting, as you were attempting to do.. is another.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to luckydawg)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/28/2011 5:00:10 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

Does that sound like a legitimate public meeting?

Or a perversion of the process?


Why would it not be a legitimate public meeting?

Why is Delphi an approved method and Alinsky not?

Why did the author feel he upset?

The obvious intent of the counting-off, I realized later, was to break up groups of friends who might have sat down together, thus virtually ensuring that each "facilitated" group would consist almost entirely of people who had never met.

Isnt this part of the Delphi method... just a smaller scale? I mean, if people coming in are friends, then utilizing the Delphi method, which the author seems to approve of, would be useless, no?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to luckydawg)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/28/2011 5:02:20 AM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

In the old days Alinsky would be called, "a liar."


That's amazing.

You've heard of Alinsky but don't know who Glenn Beck is.




Rule, I do now and wouldn't you agree that they're both fuckin' liars?


I don't know.

I still don't know much about Alinsky.

I don't know whether my education was lacking or whether this guy was just dredged up in the last few years by people like Beck to create controversy.



(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard - 2/28/2011 6:31:50 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

I still don't know much about Alinsky.

I don't know whether my education was lacking or whether this guy was just dredged up in the last few years by people like Beck to create controversy.



For the first, maybe read the thread, and the links that come in to it.

For the second, no reason it can't be both.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 60
Page:   <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: The Alinsky Way - NYC Abortion Billboard Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.094