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RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 9:08:05 AM

mnottertail

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One would also ask that of the horrendous campaign monies that are out of pocket by politicians who then cry that they are not renumerated sufficiently and it is all about their service to god and country.

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RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 9:09:27 AM

rulemylife

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

And you think blackmailing the community using the education of the kids is the way to do that?

Do you think self-sacrifice is to be expected on their part in the goal of educating kids?

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RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 9:10:00 AM

thishereboi

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yup

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RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 9:12:08 AM

thishereboi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

And you think blackmailing the community using the education of the kids is the way to do that?

Do you think self-sacrifice is to be expected on their part in the goal of educating kids?

You first.

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RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 9:17:41 AM

rulemylife

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

And you think blackmailing the community using the education of the kids is the way to do that?

Do you think self-sacrifice is to be expected on their part in the goal of educating kids?

You first.

Yes, I do think it is their right to do that, though the "blackmailing the community" is kind of out there.

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Post #: 25

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 9:26:37 AM

thishereboi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

And you think blackmailing the community using the education of the kids is the way to do that?

Do you think self-sacrifice is to be expected on their part in the goal of educating kids?

You first.

Yes, I do think it is their right to do that, though the "blackmailing the community" is kind of out there.

They are saying give us what we want or we won't let your kids go to school. Sounds like blackmail to me. Now I know a lot of teachers and I don't see a lot of self sacrificing. I know the teachers in this district are among the highest paid in the state. Detroit isn't so lucky, but the teachers that work there tell me you make more money if you go with the unions. So if the pay and benifits are that bad, then they need to get new union reps, not make the kids suffer.

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RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 9:31:19 AM

mnottertail

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They are saying give us what we want or we won't let your kids go to school.

Funny how perspectives differ.

I thought they were saying you can have the money, we will pitch in to solve the budget woes, but we don't want to let you make us revote every year and give you our rights to collective bargaining.

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RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 10:43:59 AM

EternalHoH

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quote:

Ask yourself one question. What would happen if we allowed the military to collective bargain.

The military doesn't need to, because they have the only 100% socialist situation. Three squares, health care, college, low interest housing loans, you name it.

Even better than public school teachers get.

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Post #: 28

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 11:34:42 AM

Fellow

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quote:

It appears, from this article, http://reason.org/news/show/public-sector-private-sector-salary that it isn't a myth that government workers (at least at the federal level) DO make a LOT more than private sector workers.

40% or so is what the article says.

As the article mentions, it is difficult comparison. Some economists claim different [ http://therealnews.com/t2/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31&Itemid=74&jumival=6319 ] Based on experience, I agree, public employees do make more on some levels of salary ranges. Sometimes averages are compared, that is inappropriate as the gradients are differently shaped and private sector average is higher. Top officials in public sector make significantly less, but it is not a complaint. In private sector top officials are overly (I know, this claim irritates many) compensated. In addition, public sector job security is much better than in private sector. The private sector has been actively suppressing workers wages during last quarter of century by killing unions, preventing minimum wage increases, outsourcing, using illegal immigrant labor, buying government and so on. Instead of trying to suppress public sector income, energy should focus how to raise private sector worker compensation. The ongoing destruction of the middle class will hurt everybody.

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Post #: 29

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 1:27:10 PM

YSG

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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I don't know how many times I have to repeat myself. I am NOT anti-union. I do disagree with illegal union activities. Trashing the state capital is something I never did as a union member. Teachers shutting down entire school districts by calling in sick is wrong anyway you look at it. They are saying screw everyone, except us. It is costing taxpayers here in WI. 3 to 4 million a week for police overtime.

Then maybe they should hire more police officers instead of paying time and a half or even double for overtime.

What SB5 does is take away state workers rights to strike and collectively bagain, in essence killing the unions. It is an attack on their rights as workers, and as American citizens, to unionize, and to negotiate for better pay, benefits, and working conditions. Yes, strikes, including "blue flu" ARE negotiation tactics. Personally, Im ok with teachers calling off for a day. Its not going to effect the poor education they are getting, trust me.

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RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 1:30:24 PM

YSG

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Also, a quote I think alot of you would find interesting:

"We must close union offices, confiscate their money and put their leaders in prison. We must reduce workers salaries and take away their right to strike."
- Adolf Hitler, May 2, 1933

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Our duty is to hold ourselves responsible to the people. Every word, every act and every policy must conform to the people's interests, and if mistakes occur, they must be corrected - that is what being responsible to the people means- Mao Zedong

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Post #: 31

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 1:33:40 PM

Moonhead

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At this point, you get the impression that strikes are the only form of negotiation Walker is going to pay any attention to, sadly. He's been pretty much begging them to start something, after all.

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RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 1:37:27 PM

tazzygirl

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quote:

They are saying give us what we want or we won't let your kids go to school.

Interesting. Now, my take on this was... teachers are refusing to teach. No one is stopping the kids from doing anything. There is a huge difference between the two. Its not like nurses, cops or firemen. When they strike, someone will be hurt, possibly even die.

And, for that matter, what is wrong with the parents stepping in to make sure suzie or johnny are getting an education while this is all going on?

Maybe Walker and the District School Board needs to come into the classroom until this mess is cleaned up.

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Post #: 33

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 4:40:08 PM

rulemylife

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

They are saying give us what we want or we won't let your kids go to school. Sounds like blackmail to me. Now I know a lot of teachers and I don't see a lot of self sacrificing. I know the teachers in this district are among the highest paid in the state. Detroit isn't so lucky, but the teachers that work there tell me you make more money if you go with the unions. So if the pay and benifits are that bad, then they need to get new union reps, not make the kids suffer.

This is no different than any other labor dispute except you want to introduce the "suffering children" into it.

If I recall my school years correctly, I don't think I would have felt I was suffering when I had a few extra days off from school.

But more to the point is that you want to put the onus on the unions and exempt Kasich from any responsibility for those poor suffering children.

< Message edited by rulemylife -- 3/3/2011 4:44:14 PM >

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Post #: 34

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 4:42:06 PM

jlf1961

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quote:

ORIGINAL: YSG

Also, a quote I think alot of you would find interesting:

"We must close union offices, confiscate their money and put their leaders in prison. We must reduce workers salaries and take away their right to strike."
- Adolf Hitler, May 2, 1933

I keep trying to tell these people that the Nazis were a RIGHT WING political organization.

And Walker is proving the point rather nicely. The Republicans biggest fear is the power of the labor unions and the workers.

< Message edited by jlf1961 -- 3/3/2011 4:43:14 PM >

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Post #: 35

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 5:24:17 PM

servantforuse

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Maybe there is a little hope for all of us. A liberal judge from Madison, WI, has ordered the state capital building closed. Police and the state patrol are now in the process of throwing the scum out of our beautiful but now trashed state capital.

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Post #: 36

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 5:41:20 PM

rulemylife

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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Maybe there is a little hope for all of us. A liberal judge from Madison, WI, has ordered the state capital building closed. Police and the state patrol are now in the process of throwing the scum out of our beautiful but now trashed state capital.

"The scum".

As I said, you never cease to amaze me.

Did that latest pension check arrive on time?

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Post #: 37

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 5:44:48 PM

servantforuse

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I don't get a pension check. I took the lump sum and invested it on my own with a non union investment firm. No more union dues.

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Post #: 38

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 5:47:14 PM

rulemylife

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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I don't get a pension check. I took the lump sum and invested it on my own with a non union investment firm. No more union dues.

Except you conveniently forget to mention that it was the union that negotiated that for you.

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Post #: 39

RE: Ohio to Limit Public Unions - 3/3/2011 5:52:34 PM

servantforuse

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And you seem to forget, I never went on an illegal work stoppage, shutting down the states school system.

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Post #: 40

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