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Fear of your own desires? - 3/7/2011 9:16:46 PM   
Asherscorp1


Posts: 143
Joined: 3/6/2011
Status: offline 		I was wondering if any Doms/Masters out there have ever run into this situation. Have you ever wanted to whip/beat/torture your submissive but been afraid of letting yourself because you are not yet entirely comfortable with that side of yourself? How did you over-come this and make sure that both of you had your own needs met in the mean time?

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"The path to slavery is so narrow that two cannot walk upon it at the same time, hence why the slave must crawl behind." -- Unknown

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/7/2011 9:44:37 PM   
SailingBum


Posts: 3225
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Sailin the stormy sea
Status: offline 		Ive had the luck to be comfortable in my skin, so Im not sure I can help you. Start beating the bitch in small doses and work up to the brutal stuff.

BadOne

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We are all so very lucky to have you with us to impart your great wisdom.

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/7/2011 10:10:27 PM   
CarnalNightmare


Posts: 16
Joined: 3/6/2011
Status: offline 		Nope.  If it feels good, do it. 

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/7/2011 11:07:04 PM   
Jennislut


Posts: 234
Joined: 2/24/2011
Status: offline 		i can't really speak from that perspective - but from the other side, i have never been scared of the way i want to be beaten/tortured - surprised yes, but afraid no

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i just popped in to say

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/7/2011 11:13:28 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		I have a couple of times been ever so slightly tempted to engage in practices and techniques which are in the RED zone as in the chances of the sub/slave's survival is reduced by more than 60%.. I don't gamble with lives or risk permanant dammage to people in my stewardship. Such techniques are best left where they belong in the hands of a  torturer/hard interrogator. Ergo such things are a no brainer to me and my answer is always a resounding NO!!.


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Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 4:55:18 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		Well, firstly, if you don't have the skills necessary to use a whip, and that takes about a year to acquire - then don't use one.

If you're talking about getting over social conditioning which states boys shouldn't hit girls, that takes about six months with a supportive partner. It helps enormously to have an understanding partner who will give you positive feedback, tell you how hot it is, and how much she wants you to do it again.

If you don't have a partner right now, then the best plan I could suggest is attending demos and taking workshops to get your technical skills up to speed. Because if you're absolutely sure that you know what you're doing, then you won't get nearly as worried about it. And you need to know what you're doing because if you don't, then you can harm someone permanently even through such a seemingly innocuous activity as spanking.


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Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 5:05:06 AM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline 		I know better than to match myself with someone who needs more than I feel up to giviing.

Aside from that, once play starts, it's just giving her almost more than she can handle. After a few times, it becomes easy.

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"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 8:45:32 AM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline 		A wise man knows his shadow self, respects and controls it.

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 9:15:17 AM   
leadership527


Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Asherscorp1
I was wondering if any Doms/Masters out there have ever run into this situation. Have you ever wanted to whip/beat/torture your submissive but been afraid of letting yourself because you are not yet entirely comfortable with that side of yourself?

Not in the sadist sense, but sure, in the process of enslaving Carol there have been MANY moments when I wondered how wise this path was.

quote:

How did you over-come this and make sure that both of you had your own needs met in the mean time?

I stopped looking at nameless fears and started dealing in facts. Was this activity actually likely to harm Carol and could I specify how that harm might occur or was I simply jumping at shadows?


_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 9:40:04 AM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Asherscorp1

I was wondering if any Doms/Masters out there have ever run into this situation. Have you ever wanted to whip/beat/torture your submissive but been afraid of letting yourself because you are not yet entirely comfortable with that side of yourself? How did you over-come this and make sure that both of you had your own needs met in the mean time?


Greetings,

I'd be hard pressed to align myself with a man that never experienced a moment of discomfort or trepidation. I'd sincerely wonder how he'd aid me when I found myself in a similar position. As to your question, I don't find the thought uncommon. Administering pain in thought and actually striking another person is a different reality. It isn't odd to feel some measure of ambivalence when attempting new things, interacting with someone for the first time, or simply wanting to push further but feeling the need to rein in your impulses.

I believe there's always some element of temperance until both parties feel comfortable and at ease. It has been previously mentioned in other threads the realities of engagement that could have unfortunate consequences. That's not a selling point for RACK,but the conscious acknowledgment that there will be an oops or two at some point and it's important that you're on the same page when it occurs. I find that letting go usually has two components and you've referenced them. If the mind is not in accordance you will find yourself ill at ease and wavering back in forth. My solution has always been to embrace the idea in thought before it happens in the natural. If I can wrap my head around it we're good.

From this side of the paddle it boils down to trust and utter dependence that he will exercise restraint when needed. And that isn't in response to his desires alone, but mine as well. I need to know that even though I may wish to go to point 'a' he has the good sense to recognize that is not an appropriate place for us and prevents its occurrence. Of course this requires honest communication and an understanding of the other as well. The reverse holds true. He may wish to take me places that I'm uncomfortable exploring. Yet, I trust that he won't leave me hanging or thrust me in harm's way. Fear and ambivalence not withstanding, I know he has me and that awareness is what truly keeps the Boogeyman at bay. Her acceptance and belief in you coupled with unflinching faith will often create the same in the dominant.

Namaste,

~porcelaine


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His will; my fate.

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 12:03:50 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Asherscorp1

I was wondering if any Doms/Masters out there have ever run into this situation. Have you ever wanted to whip/beat/torture your submissive but been afraid of letting yourself because you are not yet entirely comfortable with that side of yourself? How did you over-come this and make sure that both of you had your own needs met in the mean time?


The short answer is "no". 
 
The longer answer is that I don't let the really dark parts of myself out to play.  Ever. 
 
The complete answer is more complex so bear with me.  I am a sadist.  Heavy impact play with floggers, paddles and such is par for the course.  I am an edge player.  I will cheerfully engage in breath play, knife play, fire play and other things a lot of people list among their hard limits without batting an eye.  However, none of these things are edgy for me.
 
What is edgy to me is to go to the place in my head where my scientific detachment takes over and I start thinking to myself "if I do X, what reaction will I get" or "I want Y reaction, what will cause that to happen?  Let's find out."  It's the place where I stop seeing a person and only see a body in front of me.  It's the point at which I stop trusting myself to stay in control and keep my partner safe, so I just don't go there.  For that reason I don't engage in certain types of play that many other people find enjoyable, such as objectification.  I will never feel comfortable unleashing that part of myself, so I never will.  There are plenty of other fun things I can do which don't put me in a position to stare into my personal Abyss. 
 
The trick was knowing myself well enough to tell the difference between social programming - because nice girls don't [fill in the blank] - and where my personal zones of (dis)comfort were.  Then it was a fairly straightforward process of discarding the programming that wasn't working and embracing the rest.  This isn't to say that the process happened overnight, but it became much easier once I realized that I have the freedom to choose my actions based on my needs and desires, those of my partners, and my personal ethics.

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 12:38:52 PM   
Palliata


Posts: 371
Joined: 8/9/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Asherscorp1

I was wondering if any Doms/Masters out there have ever run into this situation. Have you ever wanted to whip/beat/torture your submissive but been afraid of letting yourself because you are not yet entirely comfortable with that side of yourself? How did you over-come this and make sure that both of you had your own needs met in the mean time?

When I was just starting out I was a bit uncomfortable with my sadistic side and I had real trouble with the things I enjoyed doing. It was really just a matter of working into it slowly for me - start out with spanking and just work your way up to the more extreme stuff. To be honest this is a very, very good idea anyway as it allows you to master one skill before moving onto the next.

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I'm male. I know it sounds female. Work with me.

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 1:01:25 PM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SylvereApLeanan

The longer answer is that I don't let the really dark parts of myself out to play.  Ever.


In some respects I was very much the same, but the differences fell along gender lines instead. Men weren't privy to that part of me. But with women I could let my hair down completely.
 
quote:

There are plenty of other fun things I can do which don't put me in a position to stare into my personal Abyss.


Therein lies the difference. I crave the abyss and when you've been there it's very hard to forget. I think that is why I enjoy catharsis so much. The fear of breaking doesn't haunt me. I don't worry about an endless plummet either. In some respects I crave the shattering because I know what follows after. Cracking the alabaster is a gift, but not one to be undertaken lightly. He needs experience.
 
quote:

The trick was knowing myself well enough to tell the difference between social programming - because nice girls don't [fill in the blank] - and where my personal zones of (dis)comfort were.


My respectability was part of the problem. I wouldn't allow myself to be seen in another fashion with the opposite sex. I was not permitted to work through it with my previous partners. They ripped it away and rubbed my face in the truth instead. In their mind it was an insult that I would keep that part of myself out of their grasp. They didn't ask but merely took and claimed it as theirs.

Namaste,

~porcelaine


_____________________________

His will; my fate.

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 1:16:38 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: porcelaine

quote:

ORIGINAL: SylvereApLeanan

The longer answer is that I don't let the really dark parts of myself out to play.  Ever.


In some respects I was very much the same, but the differences fell along gender lines instead. Men weren't privy to that part of me. But with women I could let my hair down completely.

 
That's intriguing.  May I ask why you drew that line? 
 
quote:


I crave the abyss and when you've been there it's very hard to forget. I think that is why I enjoy catharsis so much. The fear of breaking doesn't haunt me. I don't worry about an endless plummet either. In some respects I crave the shattering because I know what follows after. Cracking the alabaster is a gift, but not one to be undertaken lightly. He needs experience.

 
Staring into my Abyss has the potential to get people seriously hurt or dead, though.  I can control myself well enough to dance along the edges of that mental space but I don't let my Abyss look into me for too long.  I don't fancy being brought up on charges.  
 
quote:
My respectability was part of the problem. I wouldn't allow myself to be seen in another fashion with the opposite sex. I was not permitted to work through it with my previous partners. They ripped it away and rubbed my face in the truth instead. In their mind it was an insult that I would keep that part of myself out of their grasp. They didn't ask but merely took and claimed it as theirs.


How do you feel about that now?

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 1:42:03 PM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SylvereApLeanan

That's intriguing.  May I ask why you drew that line? 


I'm certain part of it is related to conditioning of some sort. I was raised in a conservative atmosphere with well defined behavioral expectations. In terms of the sexes, I felt more at ease with women. They accepted me with all my different nuances, where men were apt to pigeonhole me instead.

quote:

Staring into my Abyss has the potential to get people seriously hurt or dead, though.  I can control myself well enough to dance along the edges of that mental space but I don't let my Abyss look into me for too long.  I don't fancy being brought up on charges.


I agree and respect your stance. It's important for you to recognize what's lurking in your internal basement and readily assess if it should be unleashed or confined. Admittedly I was traversing my house long before I happened upon this path. I don't think I'd be as inclined to do it if I didn't have the experience to draw on. I couldn't fathom the trip if I didn't have an escape plan in hand. I must be able to pull myself out of that place if something goes awry.
 
quote:

How do you feel about that now?


I've come full circle and balanced both aspects until they found cohesion. I didn't lose my lady-like ways, but I haven't repressed the primal either. I don't view them as opposites. But more along the lines of Yin and Yang. And interestingly enough I seek the same harmony in the men I select.

Namaste,

~porcelaine


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His will; my fate.

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 2:07:01 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: porcelaine

I was raised in a conservative atmosphere with well defined behavioral expectations. In terms of the sexes, I felt more at ease with women. They accepted me with all my different nuances, where men were apt to pigeonhole me instead.

 
I can understand that although my experience has been almost the opposite.  I was raised in a conservative atmosphere where the women were catty bitches who shredded anyone who didn't conform to social expectations.  Men have been far more accepting of my proclivities, probably because I tend to think more like a man than a woman.

quote:

I agree and respect your stance. It's important for you to recognize what's lurking in your internal basement and readily assess if it should be unleashed or confined. 


I'm a huge proponent of self-examination.  It's not that I'm afraid of what will happen if I cross that line.  I know exactly what will happen...I'll enjoy it far too much.  I won't want to come back.  Since control is my primary kink, a loss of it runs counter to my internal wiring.

quote:

I didn't lose my lady-like ways, but I haven't repressed the primal either. I don't view them as opposites. But more along the lines of Yin and Yang. And interestingly enough I seek the same harmony in the men I select.


I feel exactly the same way.  I don't have to repress my Shadow, I just have to maintain a proper balance.  I think that's why my husband and I work so well; he loves and respects my "evil" side and we help each other stay on an even keel.

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 4:38:10 PM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SylvereApLeanan

I can understand that although my experience has been almost the opposite.  I was raised in a conservative atmosphere where the women were catty bitches who shredded anyone who didn't conform to social expectations.  Men have been far more accepting of my proclivities, probably because I tend to think more like a man than a woman.


My familial influences have touched many areas of my life. I have bits and pieces of all of them in some way. We've grown and transformed over the years and the rebellious girl has become a dutiful woman. It is that spirit that I bring to my partner and community. In regard to outside opinions, I find the value of external acceptance is measured against its internal vacancy. I accept when others do not accept me.

quote:

I'm a huge proponent of self-examination.  It's not that I'm afraid of what will happen if I cross that line.  I know exactly what will happen...I'll enjoy it far too much.  I won't want to come back.  Since control is my primary kink, a loss of it runs counter to my internal wiring.


It takes a very big person to admit that. And a disciplined one to maintain it. I have to look at the areas where I'm holding on too tightly and need to release. I try to confront them alone as best as I can. But certain things require the other person's assistance.

quote:

I feel exactly the same way.  I don't have to repress my Shadow, I just have to maintain a proper balance.  I think that's why my husband and I work so well; he loves and respects my "evil" side and we help each other stay on an even keel.


Heavens no! But balance is necessary or it consumes and throws everything out of whack. I look for a person that dances in the shadow but hasn't gone so far he's lost his appreciation for rays. You need a bit of both for sustenance.

I've enjoyed our discussion. Thank you for sharing. :)

Namaste,

~porcelaine


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His will; my fate.

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/8/2011 5:08:35 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
Status: offline 		It's not my desires I fear...its the combination of my desires and my schizophrenia that I fear. I do not think I trust myself.

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Ha Ha...Charade you are!

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CM's #1 All-Time Also-Ran


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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/9/2011 4:21:09 PM   
Buzzzz


Posts: 839
Joined: 11/28/2010
Status: offline 		all the time . I am very efficient at a lot of things (especially like whips and canes), but I never hit someone like I really wanted to.. Always control myself.. Maybe oneday, I will find a sub willing to try.

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RE: Fear of your own desires? - 3/9/2011 5:14:54 PM   
SirRussellP


Posts: 107
Joined: 1/10/2006
Status: offline 		Yes I have, of course at age 17 I almost beat a kid to death so since that time I have worked very hard to be in control of myself.  Now that kind of experience also makes me plan each and every scene including what to do if something goes unexpected or totally wrong.  Once you have worked out the details it is easier to just enjoy.

Now having been whipped as a young teen by mommy dearest I have had an aversion to floggers and whips.  Took one sincere sub to beg for me to use her flogger on her a few times till I finally said what the hell and tried it to please her.  Now I make floggers.

Never error in favor of risk, just remember that a Dom's first responsibility is to the sub/slave well being.

Russell

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