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RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 1:29:24 AM   
Hippiekinkster


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Pension contributions from state and local employers aren't blowing up budgets. They amount to just 2.9 percent of state spending, on average, according to the National Association of State Retirement Administrators. The Center for Retirement Research at Boston College puts the figure a bit higher at 3.8 percent.

Though there's no direct comparison, state and local pension contributions approximate the burden shouldered by private companies. The nonpartisan Employee Benefit Research Institute estimates that retirement funding for private employers amounts to about 3.5 percent of employee compensation.
____________

Boston College researchers project that if the assets in state and local pension plans were frozen tomorrow and there was no more growth in investment returns, there'd still be enough money in most state plans to pay benefits for years to come.

"On average, with the assets on hand today, plans are able to pay annual benefits at their current level for another 13 years. This assumes, pessimistically, that plans make no future pension contributions and there is no growth in assets," said Jean-Pierre Aubry, a researcher specializing in state and local pensions for the nonpartisan Center for Retirement Research at Boston College.

In 2006, when the economy was humming before the financial crisis began, the value of assets in state and local pension funds covered promised benefits for a period of just over 19 years.

At the bottom of Aubry's list is Kentucky, which would have enough assets to cover 4.7 years. Other states do much better: North Carolina local government pensions are funded to cover 19 years of promised benefits; Florida's state plan could cover 17 years; and California's plans about 15 years. http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2011/03/06/109649/why-employee-pensions-arent-bankrupting.html


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"We are convinced that freedom w/o Socialism is privilege and injustice, and that Socialism w/o freedom is slavery and brutality." Bakunin

“Nothing we do, however virtuous, can be accomplished alone; therefore we are saved by love.” Reinhold Ne

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Profile   Post #: 81
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 1:50:45 AM   
Hippiekinkster


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"According to the Pew study, Wisconsin had about $77 billion in total pension liabilities in 2008. But according to that same Pew study, those liabilities were 99.67 percent "funded," giving Wisconsin one of the four-highest of such ratios in the nation. Other states had funding ratios as low as 54 percent. For comparison, expert analysts and the Government Accountability Office consider an 80 percent level to be a good benchmark for pension fund stability, while Fitch Ratings considers 70 percent adequate.

Pension accounting relies on a very long-term outlook. When the state calculates its pension liabilities, it adds up the total expected pension expenditures for the entire lifetimes of everybody currently receiving a pension and all employees expected to receive pensions. That outlook routinely eclipses 30 years, depending on the ages of state employees. A $77 billion liability is only a problem if the state has no realistic way of meeting those expenses over that 30-plus year timeframe. But the Wisconsin pension system actually does have the vast majority of that money -- in fact, in 2008, the pension fund had 99.67 percent percent of that $77 billion total on hand. If all of the assets in the fund had simply been sold at market values on June 30, the resulting cash would have been enough to pay 99.67 percent of the state's total pension payouts for decades to come.

According to the Wisconsin pension fund's own 2010 annual report, the system had $69.1 billion in total assets at June 30, 2010, while paying out $3.7 billion in benefits over the course of the previous year. The value of those assets has since risen. According to Dave Stella, secretary of the Wisconsin Department of Employee Trust Funds, the retirement system's assets were worth $79.8 billion at the end of last month. The most recent solvency test for the fund was conducted for the fund's operations at Dec. 31, 2009. At the time, the funding ratio was 99.8 percent. The next solvency test is scheduled for June of this year

According to the pension fund's 2010 report, the fund spends about 84 percent of its management costs on outside help -- highly-compensated fund managers who work for private-sector financial firms. While Wisconsin has made a concerted effort to bring more of its fund management in-house, it could do more. "

"In 2009, roughly half of the pension fund's total assets were managed by state employees, who were paid a total of $28.4 million for their work. By contrast, outside Wall Street professionals were paid $194.7 million to manage the other half of the fund's assets. Cutting Wall Street pay, or simply moving more fund management in-house, could easily generate the $30 million in new taxes Walker wants to assess on state employees. " http://gratewire.com/topic/wisconsins-pension-fund-among-nations-healthiest

_____________________________

"We are convinced that freedom w/o Socialism is privilege and injustice, and that Socialism w/o freedom is slavery and brutality." Bakunin

“Nothing we do, however virtuous, can be accomplished alone; therefore we are saved by love.” Reinhold Ne

(in reply to Hippiekinkster)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 3:27:04 AM   
Louve00


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

tazzy, it's not every generation that is able to witness their country spiraling backwards at such a fast rate.
Unbelievable
I keep wondering just how far down are country will end up going?


Me too, Marini.  This is a major step backwards concerning our freedom as Americans.  Public, federal or any other kind of hushing of bargaining rights.  Rights have been taken away.  When they outlaw the abortions they keep threatening to do, then we will finally be living in a dictatorship!!


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Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 5:36:26 AM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NewOCDaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


Only for public unions taz.

Wisconsin wins.



And they didnt lose their rigth to bargain over wages. More lies from Dizzygirl.


Hi wontbe

Another new nic, I see.

tsk tsk

I was going to come on this morning and post about how well I thought this discussion went last night.... no name calling... very little snarks... then I come across yours. Such a disappointment to see it could not continue... but completely expected when you enter a thread.

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 3/10/2011 5:44:32 AM >


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Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Profile   Post #: 84
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 5:56:48 AM   
truckinslave


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PATCO tried that.

For every teacher fired for participation in an illegal strike there will be 100 applicants eager to fill the vacancy.



_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 5:59:26 AM   
truckinslave


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quote:

Of course this will be appealed,


To whom, and on what grounds?
The state of Wisconsin gave teachers certain rights.
The state of Wisconsin terminated those rights.
End. Of. Story.

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to Marini)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:02:38 AM   
truckinslave


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I see political battles, not legal ones.

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 87
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:06:44 AM   
truckinslave


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quote:

Now, with test scores decreasing, parents have less interest in living in a state governed by clueless idiots


The clueless idiots (previously) governing the state are the teachers responsible for the declining test scores.

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 88
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:09:37 AM   
truckinslave


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quote:

a stale mate seems to still be in effect.


Firings are next, and immediate.
I hope there is a way he can fire according to some merit-based standard rather than seniority.
Proof of merit would be registering as a Republican, of course

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:13:06 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline


quote:


Why I'm Fighting in Wisconsin

We can avoid mass teacher layoffs and reward our best performers. But we have to act

By SCOTT WALKER


In 2010, Megan Sampson was named an Outstanding First Year Teacher in Wisconsin. A week later, she got a layoff notice from the Milwaukee Public Schools. Why would one of the best new teachers in the state be one of the first let go? Because her collective-bargaining contract requires staffing decisions to be made based on seniority.


Ms. Sampson got a layoff notice because the union leadership would not accept reasonable changes to their contract. Instead, they hid behind a collective-bargaining agreement that costs the taxpayers $101,091 per year for each teacher, protects a 0% contribution for health-insurance premiums, and forces schools to hire and fire based on seniority and union rules. My state's budget-repair bill, which passed the Assembly on Feb. 25 and awaits a vote in the Senate, reforms this union-controlled hiring and firing process by allowing school districts to assign staff based on merit and performance. That keeps great teachers like Ms. Sampson in the classroom.


Most states in the country are facing a major budget deficit. Many are cutting billions of dollars of aid to schools and local governments. These cuts lead to massive layoffs or increases in property taxes—or both.


In Wisconsin, we have a better approach to tackling our $3.6 billion deficit. We are reforming the way government works, as well as balancing our budget. Our reform plan gives state and local governments the tools to balance the budget through reasonable benefit contributions. In total, our budget-repair bill saves local governments almost $1.5 billion, outweighing the reductions in state aid in our budget.

Read the rest at http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704132204576190260787805984.html?mod=WSJ_hps_sections_opinion


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Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to Hippiekinkster)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:13:14 AM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

Proof of merit would be registering as a Republican, of course


And extremely illegal

And you are right, firings will be next.

Ending with his own.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:25:01 AM   
truckinslave


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Joined: 6/16/2004
Status: offline
The people will indeed have an opportunity to fire him.

Oughta get an Intrade started on Walker.....

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:28:13 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
Fire or recall. LOL... as I have said before, should be an interesting election season.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:36:35 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

Of course this will be appealed,


To whom, and on what grounds?
The state of Wisconsin gave teachers certain rights.
The state of Wisconsin terminated those rights.
End. Of. Story.

Wisconsin open meeting law
14th amendment grounds
1st amendment grounds

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:41:08 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

Do you think most people like outrageously high budget deficits, or the Dem 'solution" of legislating ever higher taxation levels?

Do you think most people like fat cat union bureaucrats and teachers? Especially considering the miserable results weve been getting from them?

I would put such questions up to a vote any day of the week.


_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:45:17 AM   
tazzygirl


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Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker won his job last November with 52% of the vote, but his popularity has slipped since then.

A new Rasmussen Reports telephone survey of Likely Wisconsin Voters finds that just 34% Strongly Approve of the job he is doing, while 48% Strongly Disapprove. Overall, including those who somewhat approve or disapprove, the new Republican governor earns positive reviews from 43% and negative reviews from 57% of voters statewide.

It’s also interesting to note that among households with children in the public school system, only 32% approve of the governor’s performance. Sixty-seven percent (67%) disapprove, including 54% who Strongly Disapprove.

This may be partly due to the fact that 77% of Wisconsin voters have a favorable opinion of the state’s public school teachers. However, only 50% have a favorable opinion of the teachers’ union.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/general_state_surveys/wisconsin/wisconsin_governor_walker_43_approval_rating



_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:51:20 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

How popular are the crybaby Dems who ran and hid




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Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

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Profile   Post #: 97
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 6:54:49 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

The point is, its all relative. Nothing occurs in a vacuum, we will only really see how popular who is come the next round of elections.


_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 7:00:26 AM   
tazzygirl


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Among those asked about the state budget deficit, 52% supported the Democrats and 44% supported the Governor. Most of those 50 and over support the Governor, 40-somethings are evenly divided, and those under 40 support the Democrats.

Additionally, 49% believe it’s good that most teachers belong to a union. Among those with children in the public school system, 58% believe that’s a good thing.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/general_state_surveys/wisconsin/wisconsin_poll_support_for_budget_cutting_not_for_weakening_collective_bargaining_rights

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: Wisconsin loses collective bargaining - 3/10/2011 7:01:37 AM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
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Federal employees do not have collective bargaining. State workers do not need it. In Wisconsin they will still have be able to bargain for wages. Everything else they have already.

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 100
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