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How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 2:35:46 AM   
Brain


Posts: 3792
Joined: 2/14/2007
Status: offline 		I think this is important to know to reduce/prevent terrorism in the future. It’s unfortunate it has not been emphasised or highlighted or reported more in the “left wing biased” media.


Obama Clears Out The Bushes And Restores America’s Global Popularity

I can already hear conservatives snickering and saying, “Of course Obama made us popular around the world, he is always apologizing,” and then throwing in some variant of their belief that real leaders like tyrants must be despised.

However as Gallup pointed out a recent study has shown a potential real world impact that global popularity can have on terrorism, “Princeton economist Alan Krueger’s recent analysis in Science magazine of 19 countries in the Middle East and North Africa suggests there is a statistical link between global leadership approval ratings and terrorist attacks. The findings should not be misconstrued to mean that lower approval ratings equal more terrorist attacks. The main takeaway is that the “…results are inconsistent with one hypothesis: that public opinion is irrelevant for terrorism because terrorists are extremists who act independently of their countrymen’s attitudes toward the leadership of the countries that they attack.”

The hypothesis presented above is one most frequently relied on conservatives. America should go it alone because the terrorists hate our freedoms and are going to attack us no matter what we do. What conservatives ignore when they discount the value of global popularity is the role that it plays in winning the hearts of potential extremists. If the US can create an environment where people grow up and live with a favorable impression of America, then this can be used to negate the message of extremists before it has a chance to take root.

http://www.politicususa.com/en/obama-world-popular





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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 2:49:29 AM   
SexyBossyBBW


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brain
America should go it alone because the terrorists hate our freedoms and are going to attack us no matter what we do.
I've always thought that was the dumbest, most simplistic crap I've ever heard spouted.

quote:

What conservatives ignore when they discount the value of global popularity is the role that it plays in winning the hearts of potential extremists. If the US can create an environment where people grow up and live with a favorable impression of America, then this can be used to negate the message of extremists before it has a chance to take root.

http://www.politicususa.com/en/obama-world-popular
I've also thought that, if the US wasted war money on people in the countries that have massive poverty/wealth imbalance, instead of bombing and killing their families, we would have a significantly less number of people wanting to destroy us.

Seriously though, diplomacy should ALWAYS be the option, and war should always be the very last/for your survival only action. I know war mongers would say this is the case already, but I will never be convinced that we did NOT attack Iraq without provocation, and thereby multiplied our terrorism problem a millionfold. M


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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 10:18:51 AM   
Aneirin


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From: Tamaris
Status: offline 		I don' think it is that much to do with your freedoms compared to their lack of freedom, because many countries other than America also have similar freedoms, but maybe why people target America, is because of American overseas policies, i.e. sticking it's nose in where it is not wanted by any save those that directly benefit, i.e. the political elite and /or the military, who then continue to 'guide' their people in a certain fashion.

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 1:52:44 PM   
Fellow


Posts: 1486
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		I agree Obama is less likely to organize or facilitate major terrorist attacks on American soil compared to G. W. Bush and associates. However, how to classify drone attacks against Pakistan civilians ("suspected militants"), recent "humanitarian" bombing of Libyans? State terrorism?

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 4:05:37 PM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow

I agree Obama is less likely to organize or facilitate major terrorist attacks on American soil compared to G. W. Bush and associates. However, how to classify drone attacks against Pakistan civilians ("suspected militants"), recent "humanitarian" bombing of Libyans? State terrorism?
"organize or facilitate"...Just can't let that one slip by.Not that it is worth dignifying with a response...but I did feel it deserved to be plucked from your post...and allowed to stand by itself.
Get help,it might not be too late.


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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 6:04:27 PM   
Fellow


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quote:

"organize or facilitate"...Just can't let that one slip by.Not that it is worth dignifying with a response...but I did feel it deserved to be plucked from your post...and allowed to stand by itself.
Get help,it might not be too late.


Staged terror is nothing new: 9/11, "underwear bomber" , etc. Almost all recent terror cases on US soil raise questions about CIA involvement. False flag attacks seem to become standard on World stage.  Russia has the same protocol. I understand Americans can not believe it due to religious reasons (true belief of illusive idealized government system) regardless how much evidence is presented.

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 7:15:14 PM   
Brain


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Status: offline 		I agree with you.

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 7:19:44 PM   
Brain


Posts: 3792
Joined: 2/14/2007
Status: offline 		I don't agree with you. That area in Pakistan is a lawless area the government does not control and that's where Obama is hiding. As far as Libya is concerned Obama prevented the massacre of innocent civilians, nothing to do with state terrorism.

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 7:25:49 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brain

That area in Pakistan is a lawless area the government does not control and that's where Obama is hiding.



K.

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 7:26:57 PM   
outhere69


Posts: 1302
Joined: 1/25/2011
Status: offline 		Bin Laden hated our policies much, much more than our freedoms.  Most terrorists couldn't give a shit about our freedoms.

There was a document written by a high ranking Al-Qaeda member that laid out the plan against the US.  It starts with 9-11.  Then they were going to stop US attacks but attack our allies (like Spain, England) in order to isolate us.

Our paranoia is taking our own freedoms.  We have prosecuted and imprisoned terrorists on our own soil (remember the first WTC bombing?) and now everyone's panicing about doing that with the Guantanamo crowd.

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 7:31:48 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		Brain...admittedly I am naive as Carter but... I think it would be great if we as a nation could lay out a set of principles that we would, in all circumstances follow, when dealing with nations of the world... AND STICK to them.

Stick... even if it means high energy or consumer costs... Stick... even if it means war...Stick... even if it means no longer supporting an ally who is in conflict with our principles.

Then if groups of peoples or nations are in conflict with us we will have the moral high ground and the support of like thinking nations of the world.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 3/28/2011 7:33:16 PM >

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/28/2011 11:54:38 PM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
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From: Sydney Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Brain...admittedly I am naive as Carter but... I think it would be great if we as a nation could lay out a set of principles that we would, in all circumstances follow, when dealing with nations of the world... AND STICK to them.

Stick... even if it means high energy or consumer costs... Stick... even if it means war...Stick... even if it means no longer supporting an ally who is in conflict with our principles.

Then if groups of peoples or nations are in conflict with us we will have the moral high ground and the support of like thinking nations of the world.

Butch

This is a great idea. Interestingly there is already such a charter in place. It's the UN Charter. It's backed up by a framework of international law.

Problem is that it's not applied consistently - Israel is allowed to possess WMDs or break any UN resolution/international law it likes, while other countries get invaded or pilloried for the same.

The US insists on human rights correct? Well yes - unless it's Gitmo or a friend (like say, Mubarak in Egypt was) or there's oil involved.

It's not that the principles aren't already there, or need further development, all that's needed is consistent application.

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/29/2011 5:54:54 AM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow
quote:

"organize or facilitate"...Just can't let that one slip by.Not that it is worth dignifying with a response...but I did feel it deserved to be plucked from your post...and allowed to stand by itself.
Get help,it might not be too late.

Staged terror is nothing new: 9/11, "underwear bomber" , etc. Almost all recent terror cases on US soil raise questions about CIA involvement. False flag attacks seem to become standard on World stage.  Russia has the same protocol. I understand Americans can not believe it due to religious reasons (true belief of illusive idealized government system) regardless how much evidence is presented.


Am I to understand correctly, that you believe Sept. 11th, 2001 was a 'staged terror' and NOT an actual, genuine terrorist attack? If you do, then by all means, present the burdern of proof for the arguement.

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/29/2011 10:02:53 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		Thanks tweakabelle

I am not talking about the UN...it is a failed organization with a unmanageable charter. I am talking about a set of principals laid out by the United States and made known to all nations and peoples of the world. I know this sounds corny but a Constitution of foreign policy.

This Constitution would mandate our policy to other nations in the same way the Constitution mandates policy to our citizens.

It is just an idea that will never be implemented but I was just trying to give an answer to Brain

Butch


_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/29/2011 10:38:22 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
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Just imagine how this would work… For instance…

If we find that a middle eastern oil provider is abusing and suppressing the freedoms of their people we refuse to buy oil from them. If this included a certain South American provider we don’t buy from them either. We try to make up as much from Canada and our reserves and implement an emergency alternate fuel source project. Our fuel costs would soar but so would employment and new industry.

If the Israeli’s continue to steal land we withdraw support… If the Palestinians lob missiles into Israel we withdraw support.

What would be the results of these type of actions?

I believe The Saudi’s of this world faced with a massive drop in income would possibly change their treatment of women in their country.

I don’t think the Chavez’s of this world could remain in power without oil income.

I believe Israel would stop new development rather than take the chance of losing our money and support.

The same with the Palestinians they would see a clear policy in America and decide to stop bombing when the developments stop so our aid will flow again.

On and on I can see where this clear policy will help to reduce war and terrorism in this world. If countries KNOW how we will react they will be less likely to confront us.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/30/2011 9:00:27 PM   
SexyBossyBBW


Posts: 1693
Joined: 2/25/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin
I don' think it is that much to do with your freedoms compared to their lack of freedom, because many countries other than America also have similar freedoms, but maybe why people target America, is because of American overseas policies, i.e. sticking it's nose in where it is not wanted by any save those that directly benefit, i.e. the political elite and /or the military, who then continue to 'guide' their people in a certain fashion.
I agree completely. You're preaching to the converted in this case. M

_____________________________

"..touching was and still is and always will be the True Revolution" Nikki Giovanni
"Only when there are many people who are pools of peace, silence, understanding, will war disappear." -Osho

(in reply to Aneirin)
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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/30/2011 9:04:16 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow

I agree Obama is less likely to organize or facilitate major terrorist attacks on American soil compared to G. W. Bush and associates. However, how to classify drone attacks against Pakistan civilians ("suspected militants"), recent "humanitarian" bombing of Libyans? State terrorism?
"organize or facilitate"...Just can't let that one slip by.Not that it is worth dignifying with a response...but I did feel it deserved to be plucked from your post...and allowed to stand by itself.
Get help,it might not be too late.




Here we go, Conservative Mike's into the cooking sherry again! "Get help." lol

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/30/2011 9:23:32 PM   
hlen5


Posts: 5890
Joined: 3/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Brain...admittedly I am naive as Carter but... I think it would be great if we as a nation could lay out a set of principles that we would, in all circumstances follow, when dealing with nations of the world... AND STICK to them.

Stick... even if it means high energy or consumer costs... Stick... even if it means war...Stick... even if it means no longer supporting an ally who is in conflict with our principles.

Then if groups of peoples or nations are in conflict with us we will have the moral high ground and the support of like thinking nations of the world.

Butch


QFT

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/30/2011 9:27:03 PM   
hlen5


Posts: 5890
Joined: 3/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub


Just imagine how this would work… For instance…

If we find that a middle eastern oil provider is abusing and suppressing the freedoms of their people we refuse to buy oil from them. If this included a certain South American provider we don’t buy from them either. We try to make up as much from Canada and our reserves and implement an emergency alternate fuel source project. Our fuel costs would soar but so would employment and new industry.

If the Israeli’s continue to steal land we withdraw support… If the Palestinians lob missiles into Israel we withdraw support.

What would be the results of these type of actions?

I believe The Saudi’s of this world faced with a massive drop in income would possibly change their treatment of women in their country.

I don’t think the Chavez’s of this world could remain in power without oil income.

I believe Israel would stop new development rather than take the chance of losing our money and support.
The same with the Palestinians they would see a clear policy in America and decide to stop bombing when the developments stop so our aid will flow again.

On and on I can see where this clear policy will help to reduce war and terrorism in this world. If countries KNOW how we will react they will be less likely to confront us.

Butch


And again, QFT (except for maybe the bolded statement)!!

ETA: Before anyone guesses what I meant, I believe Isreal has the right to exist, and so do the Palestinians.

< Message edited by hlen5 -- 3/30/2011 9:28:19 PM >

_____________________________



My fave Thread: http://www.collarchat.com/m_2626198/mpage_1/tm.htm

One time "Phallus Expert Extraordinaire"

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RE: How To Prevent Terrorism Without War - 3/30/2011 9:34:08 PM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline 		It completely amazes me... we have been fighting terrorism for almost a decade, and nobody has sat down and found out WHY terrorists attack us.  Lots of hypotheses, and Bush made it a point of honor not to make any changes to make ourselves less attack-worthy, but... why not just look into their motivations, instead of impugning them?

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The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

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