The Mental Carousel

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

The Mental Carousel

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Submissive >> The Mental Carousel

Page: [1] 2 next > >>

Login

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

The Mental Carousel - 3/29/2011 3:56:41 PM

peachgirl

Posts: 396
Joined: 6/25/2009
Status: offline

Something that porcelaine referenced on another thread got me thinking. Often, when I am having a hard time yielding, for lack of a better word, I find that I fall back on a familiar behavior pattern. I call it the "it's always my fault" diatribe. The funny thing is, I don't really believe it's all my fault. It's a form of passive-aggressive behavior, I suppose. In the past, when I got to feeling this way, it inevitably led to a fight, because I would be stuck in this mental carousel and he would get really frustrated with me. It's taken some really hard work on my part to break through the fact that I don't need to put myself in this position and that it gives only on result.

What are some of the behavior patterns you are working on? Do you know what triggers it for you? If so, how do you keep yourself from "going there"?

Thanks.

_____________________________

Have you seen that girl in the corner?
I'd like to take her out of her chains
Cause if I had my way with you baby
I would be changing your life today.
- Bob Welch

Post #: 1

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/29/2011 4:34:21 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

We used to see similar things and yes, it was a passive aggressive. It was her attempt to play the martyr and thereby make me feel bad and relent. I worked on that for a while via direct command. What really solved the problem though was her surrender. After that, the carousel stopped before it barely got started with a mental (and often times physical) shrug and "I'm his". I actually find it rather odd how the runaway freight train just gets stopped in it's tracks so abruptly. That same "surrender" (or call it what you will -- the internalization of her role as property) stops a lot of thought trains before they get going. It's like "I'm his" became an adequate period for pretty much any sentence in her head.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to peachgirl)

Post #: 2

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/29/2011 5:55:17 PM

Asherscorp1

Posts: 143
Joined: 3/6/2011
Status: offline

I have adopted the Lexus (at least I think it's Lexus) philosphy, "the passionate pursuit of perfection." The trouble with this is that I have a very difficult time accepting anything less and often forget that it is a PURSUIT not a destination. So, when I inevitable become snarky with Master, fail to follow a command the first time it is given, am unable to do something during play (such as not squirm when needles are being used) immediately and must be worked up to it, I feel like a complete failure and beat myself up for it endlessly. A few nights ago Master praised me for behavior that I thought was less than perfect and I burst into tears denying that I deserved His praise. Lol. Needless to say that led to an interesting and awkward discussion. In the end, I try my best to remind myself that Master is much more patient than I am, that He only expects my best at every moment and realizes some days my best won't be as great as it was the day before and not as good as it might be the next day. As long as I am sincerely trying and willing to accept any consequences of failure, along with any praise for pleasing Him. And in the end, my feelings are utterly irrelevant, His perception is the only thing with any weight and accepting that helps me just let go of any opinions or feelings I may have.

_____________________________

"The path to slavery is so narrow that two cannot walk upon it at the same time, hence why the slave must crawl behind." -- Unknown

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 3

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/29/2011 6:02:39 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
Status: offline

I have a bad habit of just wanting to get angry and give up when one thing after another thing goes wrong with my life. I start to feel like everything around me is completely hopeless and nothing will ever turn out right.

I get over it by taking a break from things; go away for a day or two, go out with some friends, go to church, meditate...

and then there's talking to Master...he's basically my guru. He always knows exactly what i need to hear to make me change my thought patterns and see things in a more positive manner.

(in reply to Asherscorp1)

Post #: 4

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/29/2011 6:19:00 PM

porcelaine

Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: peachgirl

Something that porcelaine referenced on another thread got me thinking. Often, when I am having a hard time yielding, for lack of a better word, I find that I fall back on a familiar behavior pattern. I call it the "it's always my fault" diatribe. The funny thing is, I don't really believe it's all my fault. It's a form of passive-aggressive behavior, I suppose. In the past, when I got to feeling this way, it inevitably led to a fight, because I would be stuck in this mental carousel and he would get really frustrated with me. It's taken some really hard work on my part to break through the fact that I don't need to put myself in this position and that it gives only on result.

Greetings,

i'm going to address your question in two parts. The initial portion is part of a journal entry that i composed for my previous Owner. i haven't made any alterations, mainly due to something i picked up in your remarks. i believe this voice is best suited to address that part of your comment. :)

"in this descent, it is the Master who creates the order, the Master who lifts the slave out of the engulfing chaos of abuse, and disciplines the slave, refines him, drives him further in ways that random punishments might never provide. it is the Master, not the punishments, who perfects him." "then it is not engulfing," "it is embracing."

one word comes to mind - yielding. for these things to occur the slave must be willing to allow the reshaping to happen. this is when you move beyond the resistance and begin to see yourself through Their eyes. i am reminded of the maestro directing various areas of the orchestra, making them come alive. restraining, and requiring them to adhere to his cadence. it sounds difficult, but when all parties listen to the words of the maestro and follow without question, the melody that comes forth is incredibly sweet.

Part two of the above addresses the voice in your head.

obedience is a continual choice, an ongoing movement as to whether we will obey at that given time. when i find myself confronted by situations i now
employ the following questions:

a.. how do i know this is according to His wish?
b.. is my attitude good at this moment?
c.. is this an act of my submission or will?
d.. is it in accordance with His standards, values, ethics, and what He would want in my life?

by attaching meaning to events we open ourselves up to suffering. although that does not imply that we are oblivious to the impact and emotions that occurred because of the event. but if we can remove the meaning from the event and look at it in a detached manner so to speak, we are able to open ourselves to the good and the lessons that can come out of our experiences.

i would give serious consideration to the four questions posed. You may find them useful in combating this situation and others that you encounter. They have been ingrained in my person and have served me well over the years.

quote:

What are some of the behavior patterns you are working on? Do you know what triggers it for you? If so, how do you keep yourself from "going there"?

i have three items on my plate that i'm addressing in various perspectives: mindfulness, humility, and transparency.

All three have been sharply impacted by the changes i've undergone. The unveiling has made communication easier, but there are instances when i find prior ways of thinking creeping in and i have to eliminate them. In regard to transparency, that means i can't tiptoe around my feelings or silence myself as a protective measure. It means honoring my truth and embracing the risks that entails. It isn't always a cozy way of interacting but i've discovered that i reclaim my power (internally) and release fears grip when i'm honest and open. It's very freeing.

As for humility, the past week has been very odd and i've been off kilter. i felt my mind shift and i didn't attempt to realign it immediately. i should interject that i know when i'm moving away from my default and slipping back into the old. There were moments of frustration, uncertainty, and a general sense of bleh that finally dissipated. When it fell away the familiar confines that humility brings wrapped me in its embrace. i don't feel its presence when i'm out of sorts. But it is hard to miss when things are flowing in the proper direction internally. i still feel i have a long way to go. i'm still trying to figure some of this out and gaining comfort with this level of exposure. But overall i'm happy and settled.

When i started veering i knew it was time to get the ship aright and rediscover mindfulness and put it into practice once more. Maintaining a personal journal has been one step in the right direction. i'm able to convey my thoughts and feelings in a healthy manner without bottling things within or allowing them to spill out at the wrong moment. Though the latter is not something i struggle with. But i have irritations like the next person. i don't vent very often in my writings because that was frowned upon on the past and i find that is merely anger or frustration talking, not what's resting underneath. In those instances i wait and write when i'm calm and collected.

i've maintained my affirmations and i'm working on another project that allows me to put some of the skills and other elements i've gained over the years down on paper. It's almost a stark contrast to the life i knew, but it's my way of embracing surrendered living and discovering new avenues of expression in that vain. i still haven't composed my development plan for the current quarter and i don't know why i'm dragging my feet. But the reluctance is what sparked the30 day exploration project that i'm presently undertaking. Procrastination is not a facet of my slavery, so there's clearly a reason why i'm dragging my heels. i suspect the in depth probing and weekly planning tool that i've found will provide some much needed insight and productivity.

Namaste,

~porcelaine

_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to peachgirl)

Post #: 5

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/29/2011 7:00:57 PM

peachgirl

Posts: 396
Joined: 6/25/2009
Status: offline

Thank you everyone for your responses. You all have given me some excellent food for thought.

_____________________________

Have you seen that girl in the corner?
I'd like to take her out of her chains
Cause if I had my way with you baby
I would be changing your life today.
- Bob Welch

(in reply to porcelaine)

Post #: 6

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/30/2011 7:10:16 AM

sunshinemiss

Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline

... sorry... I'd only read the first post. Didn't realize you'd gotten what you wanted and were closing the thread.

best,
sunshine

< Message edited by sunshinemiss -- 3/30/2011 7:14:57 AM >

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to peachgirl)

Post #: 7

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/30/2011 7:40:55 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

I would just like to say that before things are said to be passive aggressive and blame the doer for doing it deliberately, that it should be noted these kinds of behaviors are learned in early childhood when they are the only safe way for a child to express negative emotions without being punished for them. Growing up in such an environment is not healthy and if severe enough can lead to changes in the developing brain that cannot be reversed later in life.

Blaming someone for this when it was a salvatory mechanism of survival is hardly helpful. It can require long term therapy to learn new ways and it also requires understanding on the part of the dominant instead of coming down hard which is a repeat of the original behaviors that caused the sub to learn the behavior. Patience, no anger, and having her reframe words, even giving her the appropriate words to use for those who haven't learned them are much more helpful ways to change deep seated behavior.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to sunshinemiss)

Post #: 8

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/30/2011 7:56:55 AM

windchymes

Posts: 9410
Joined: 4/18/2005
Status: offline

For me, it's working on not having knee-jerk reactions of anger along with a "the best defense is a good offense" attitude when something pisses me off....or for that matter, letting something piss me off before I've taken a breath and thought the situation through. It's behavior I learned for survival in some workplaces with some "difficult" personalities, as well as from an abusive relationship: when treated badly, or even bullied in some way, I developed an "armor up, attack!" method of dealing with the negative behavior.

So, here I am at this stage of my life, not really liking myself much when I act that way, and I have been working really hard to settle down, take a breath, speak calmly, and not engage in an attack with the attacker. It's still a work in progress, but I have made a lot of progress.

_____________________________

You know it's going to be a GOOD blow job when she puts a Breathe Right strip on first.

Pick-up artists and garbage men should trade names.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 9

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/30/2011 7:57:44 AM

porcelaine

Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Blaming someone for this when it was a salvatory mechanism of survival is hardly helpful. It can require long term therapy to learn new ways and it also requires understanding on the part of the dominant instead of coming down hard which is a repeat of the original behaviors that caused the sub to learn the behavior.

Blame has many guises and i suspect in a lot of instances it is really about personal responsibility and being accountable for ones actions versus looking to the past as a constant crutch. While its influences may have been pronounced, most people reach a point in their lives when they realize certain behavior is both unhealthy and self-destructive. It's when they turn a blind eye to the true and allow the cycle to continue that outsiders take issue. It is one thing to have a problem and acknowledge you cannot handle it alone or don't have the resources to resolve it. And far different to know of its existence and use an array of convenient excuses to maintain ones dysfunction.

Namaste,

~porcelaine

_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 10

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/30/2011 8:10:28 AM

peachgirl

Posts: 396
Joined: 6/25/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss

... sorry... I'd only read the first post. Didn't realize you'd gotten what you wanted and were closing the thread.

best,
sunshine

Please feel free to add your comments. I am just looking for others to share their experiences.

_____________________________

Have you seen that girl in the corner?
I'd like to take her out of her chains
Cause if I had my way with you baby
I would be changing your life today.
- Bob Welch

(in reply to sunshinemiss)

Post #: 11

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/30/2011 8:14:02 AM

peachgirl

Posts: 396
Joined: 6/25/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

I would just like to say that before things are said to be passive aggressive and blame the doer for doing it deliberately, that it should be noted these kinds of behaviors are learned in early childhood when they are the only safe way for a child to express negative emotions without being punished for them. Growing up in such an environment is not healthy and if severe enough can lead to changes in the developing brain that cannot be reversed later in life.

Blaming someone for this when it was a salvatory mechanism of survival is hardly helpful. It can require long term therapy to learn new ways and it also requires understanding on the part of the dominant instead of coming down hard which is a repeat of the original behaviors that caused the sub to learn the behavior. Patience, no anger, and having her reframe words, even giving her the appropriate words to use for those who haven't learned them are much more helpful ways to change deep seated behavior.

Interesting point...my childhood was filled with verbal and emotional abuse. I have worked VERY hard to break patterns of behavior that I didn't want repeated in my children's lives. It also took a lot of work on my part to be able to recognize when I was going to hop on that carousel.

I have to give credit where credit it due...the Man was the first one who said to me that my "it's all my fault" was the behavior I falled back on the most when I was getting ready to shut down.

_____________________________

Have you seen that girl in the corner?
I'd like to take her out of her chains
Cause if I had my way with you baby
I would be changing your life today.
- Bob Welch

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 12

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/30/2011 8:37:37 AM

littleone35

Posts: 2828
Joined: 2/17/2005
Status: offline

I never thought i was very pretty but i have been told i am, and i am a litle overweight. Master days i am beautiful and he loves my body. I used to put myself down wg=hy i don't know i just di not all the time but enough. When i started to do that Master used t say you are putting down what belongs to me and what/who i love. Are you saying i made a bad choice?

I just have to remember i am pretty and Master loves me just the way i am. I do want to lose weight but that is for me not him, he (like the song) loves mre just the way i am.

I try to no longer put myself down that would be disrespecting Masters girl. Sometime i slip back intoto old thought patterns, but i just tell myself Master loves you and you are beautiful to him so i snap myself back.

Matt's littleone

< Message edited by littleone35 -- 3/30/2011 8:38:53 AM >

(in reply to peachgirl)

Post #: 13

RE: The Mental Carousel - 3/31/2011 3:01:03 AM

ranja

Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline

i suppose everybody goes through some kind of this type of stuff in a relationship... when things go wrong and partners seem to be at loggerheads it can be very difficult to find a way through

it is all my fault usually means it is all your fault
the trick is to somehow manage to determine how much of the problem is exactly your own fault... changing yourself or the way you approach things is easier than expecting to create a change from the other in the argument...
as soon as you have yourself under control and sort of know what is what you can cleverly start manipulating your partner...
it has sort of worked for me over the years

(in reply to peachgirl)

Post #: 14

RE: The Mental Carousel - 5/2/2011 12:40:17 PM

LondonDomsslut

Posts: 6
Joined: 4/26/2011
Status: offline

I'm still quite new to submission, and even more new to collarme but I thought I'd add my two cents worth :)

I think I have two main areas I'm trying to focus on at the moment.

Firstly I am an absolute perfectionist which I've come to realise is a double edged sword. It helps me to push myself to my very best, to push my boundaries as a submissive, and it's what motivates me to do what I can for my Master. The last eight months with my Master has helped me explore myself and grow more than I thought possible. Sometimes though, when I stumble or believe I have failed to carry out a task perfectly, I become despondent and am convinced that I have failed my Master, even if I have done as much as I could at that moment. We then end up having to take time out to work through it. I can identify with Asherscorp1, I have to keep reminding myself that my aim is always to please my Master, who sometimes I'm sure understands me better than myself, and with far more patience! I need to accept that if he is happy with my performance at that time, and I have genuinely tried, then I have been successful in pleasing him. My challenge, and I'm getting there slowly, is to focus on being happy in having pleased him, and instead of seeing the event as a failure, focusing on the ways to improve next time - thus making the experience more positive for both of us.

My second area is communication, going into my submission I 'knew' that the ability to communicate was essential, but it was many months later that I truly realised what this meant. I'd not really appreciated how closed off I had been and how little I let others in. With my Master I'd always think that I shouldn't bother him with anything I was struggling with or that was making me unhappy; I always thought it would make him believe I was being too much trouble (I should add this was my own insecurity and not in any way as a result of actions on my Master's part)! Over time though, and with his help, I've managed to overcome the voice in my head that was telling me to keep everything to myself lest it prove the final straw. Opening up and letting him in has allowed us to become much closer and allowed our relationship and my submission to blossom. It's terrifying sometimes, having someone see me that exposed and vulnerable, but he always knows what to say and do and makes me feel safe.

I've got a way to go on both fronts and I know it will take more effort and willing on my part but it's worth it.

(in reply to ranja)

Post #: 15

RE: The Mental Carousel - 5/2/2011 2:36:22 PM

uncertainlyizzy

Posts: 42
Joined: 4/11/2011
Status: offline

It's not passive aggressive in all people. I really do believe it's my fault. The common denominator is me in the bad situations right? So it's obviously me at fault. If it wasn't me then everyone wouldn't walk away would they? It has nothing to do with D at all. He knows this and every time he sees me jump on the carousel he takes me aside as soon as possible and helps me yank myself right back off. They're generally highly uncomfortable conversations where he contradicts every statement inside my head and doesn't let me hide my face or eyes (Eye contact sucks!) and uses that awful horrible thing called logic to show all the holes in my negative thoughts. The most prominent one is if he's not mad to begin with then there's nothing to apologize or blame myself for. I'm trying to continue that even without him and in other situations but changing things that deeply ingrained are hard. My parents are wonderful people who did the best they knew how to do with a difficult child but even saying that childhood experiences do play a role in our development no matter how hard anyone was trying.

The other part of that that I'm working on really hard currently is the idea that anyone would want to help. That I don't have to do everything on my own. The idea that D would watch my daughter for me for 10 minutes so I can step outside for a breather or be willing to buy me dinner or would be concerned because I'm in pain is foreign to me. He's having to beat it into my head that yes I am important to him so therefore he does want to help me out when he can. My side of changing that is learning to ask for it and speak up when I'm needing something instead of just smothering it so I'm "not a bother". Me being weird from not eating or stressing too hard from being "on" with my daughter for too long or just plain hurting so bad I'm stupid with it bothers him more than me asking for help ever would and I'm learning to focus on that more than anything else.

(in reply to LondonDomsslut)

Post #: 16

RE: The Mental Carousel - 5/2/2011 4:35:02 PM

sunshinemiss

Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline

Hello Peach Girl,
I'd like to commend you on your choice to eliminate the "stinkin' thinkin'" that you spoke of earlier. It is a dang difficult task, perhaps even a lifelong process, and to do what you are doing takes courage. Good on you!

What I'm working on - I'll get back to you on it. I'm working on procrastination *wink

sunshine

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to uncertainlyizzy)

Post #: 17

RE: The Mental Carousel - 5/2/2011 5:57:55 PM

aromanholiday

Posts: 307
Joined: 4/12/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: peachgirl

What are some of the behavior patterns you are working on? Do you know what triggers it for you? If so, how do you keep yourself from "going there"?

Thanks.

I am forgetful and absentminded. I don't think it is triggered; it's always there. I think it is a pervasive lazy habit that started a long time ago. Perhaps there's also some sort of physiological deficiency behind it, it's hard to know for sure. In fact, I do not pursue that avenue too closely as it might make me lazier, prevent me from doing all the things I can do on my own to fix it--which right now, are bearing fruit. Having experienced "culturally sanctioned drug-assistance" during some "tsunami" years, I know exactly what sort of enabling, addictive crutch that can be and how it keeps you from doing all the many things you can do on your own because you assume your difficulties are not your fault or under your control to change. This is the wailing assumption of death in an adult because of the way it infantalizes her, makes her helpless and open to culturally sanctioned institutional control. But anyway, here's what I do: I keep myself from diving too deeply into forgetfulness partially with extensive written notes, not just about things I might forget, but also notes about the forgetfulness episodes themselves and their consequences. Fear of repercussions certainly helps prevent this trait from occurring more than it does. I'm also learning--albeit slowly--to be always alert, always on my guard...against myself.

Anger used to be my biggest issue. But the tsunami that has been my later life managed to detach that trait from me somehow, so, as horrible as some things have been, I'm very grateful for that particular side-effect. I wonder sometimes where the waves of time swept my anger after they detached it? I hope it didn't get attached to someone else!

I doubt that the black remorse I feel over how I once was will ever leave me, and that is good: it will be more than sufficient to keep me from ever going there again.

I smiled at your "everything is my fault" diatribe. At first I thought you meant you accused yourself of that too much for your partner's liking. My tendency is always to believe that anything bad is my fault. That has never proved to be too much of a problem in the D&s relationships I've pursued, although I have feared feeling this too much, because it can be used by someone submissive in an unconscious attempt to assume control--not something I'd particularly relish doing.

_____________________________

"Isn't it odd how we misunderstand the hidden unity of kindness and cruelty?"

My profile is not turned off. It is broken and I am too lazy to make a new one.

(in reply to peachgirl)

Post #: 18

RE: The Mental Carousel - 5/2/2011 6:08:29 PM

peachgirl

Posts: 396
Joined: 6/25/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss

Hello Peach Girl,
I'd like to commend you on your choice to eliminate the "stinkin' thinkin'" that you spoke of earlier. It is a dang difficult task, perhaps even a lifelong process, and to do what you are doing takes courage. Good on you!

What I'm working on - I'll get back to you on it. I'm working on procrastination *wink

sunshine

thanks, sunshine...you know how it is, one step up, one step back, or two or three...

btw, are you a flybaby?

_____________________________

Have you seen that girl in the corner?
I'd like to take her out of her chains
Cause if I had my way with you baby
I would be changing your life today.
- Bob Welch

(in reply to sunshinemiss)

Post #: 19

RE: The Mental Carousel - 5/2/2011 6:09:43 PM

sunshinemiss

Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline

No, just a traveler.

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to peachgirl)

Post #: 20

Page: [1] 2 next > >>

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Submissive >> The Mental Carousel

Page: [1] 2 next > >>

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.109