RE: self-destructive subs

RE: self-destructive subs (Full Version)

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imperatrixx -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 1:07:57 PM)
you know what I take that back. op says she hates herself and gets suicidal. i will be positive and uplifting about this. op, your suicidal thoughts and self loathing are good and natural. you should embrace these feelings as positive. do not see yourself as "self destructive" instead embrace the fact that your "self" is batshit crazy and your fits of psychosis are actually strengthening that self.

subbykat -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 1:12:21 PM)
Anyway....thank you those who really took the time to empathize. I really appreciate it.

imperatrixx -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 1:13:16 PM)
you are welcome. and next time you feel suicidal please remember my encouraging words.

Rule -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 1:19:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: subbykat You know, I can really tell when someone genuinely wants to help and when someone is there to just point the finger and lecture me. You can up to a degree. You cannot when the other person is in a realm that you cannot possibly imagine because you lack the wherewithal to do so. Let me illustrate this by an analogy: Someone who lacks the ability to see the color green can tell when someone else is telling the truth about any other colors, such as red and blue - but when the other person is discussing the color green, such a colorblind person lacks the wherewithal to be able to tell what he is talking about. I have now read the full first page of this thread. Most of the posters on that first page have said the exact same thing as I have said in my recent posts. I recommend that you read the posts on that first page again. You may not comprehend them, but perhaps you may get a faint suspicion - as faint as the light from a faraway galaxy - that they perceive a truth that you are completely unaware off.

uncertainlyizzy -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 1:34:39 PM)
Ok. Probably talking to a brick wall on this but I'm saying it to assuage my inner annoyance and I'll be honest about that. Depression can be both situational and/or chemical. Sleeping 20 hours a day out of 24 and ceasing to eat or bathe or function completely? Is not a habit. It is a serious issue that needs to be addressed in any matter whatsoever that helps it in anyway. There are some people out there who through no fault nor cause of their own are dealing with an illness that seems to be kicking their ass no matter what they do. Doesn't make them weak or make them not trying hard enough. There are people who can get through depression just fine with therapy. There are people who can't. There's no difference between the strengths of the two sets of people or of their dedication to their own care. There are depressive states of thinking and there are chemical states of dopamine and serotonin imbalance. If you spend any time at all with a diverse group of people who deal with mental illness then you'll encounter both. They are both in equally valid states of depression. Hearing "Just do it!" or "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps!" from a stranger hurts. Hearing it from someone who claims to know what it's like or to have been there cuts you like you wouldn't believe.

littlewonder -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 1:41:45 PM)
so basically you just came here not to get advice but just to hear yourself talk and only talk to those who agree with you. Gotchya. Thanks for letting us know that.

subbykat -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 1:44:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: littlewonder so basically you just came here not to get advice but just to hear yourself talk and only talk to those who agree with you. Gotchya. Thanks for letting us know that. No. Not at all. It's not so much WHAT a person says, as HOW they say it (or write it). Don't you know it when someone is lecturing you as opposed to offering you advice? A lot of people's "advice" is tainted with their prejudice and judgments.

subbykat -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 1:53:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule quote: ORIGINAL: subbykat You know, I can really tell when someone genuinely wants to help and when someone is there to just point the finger and lecture me. You can up to a degree. You cannot when the other person is in a realm that you cannot possibly imagine because you lack the wherewithal to do so. Let me illustrate this by an analogy: Someone who lacks the ability to see the color green can tell when someone else is telling the truth about any other colors, such as red and blue - but when the other person is discussing the color green, such a colorblind person lacks the wherewithal to be able to tell what he is talking about. I have now read the full first page of this thread. Most of the posters on that first page have said the exact same thing as I have said in my recent posts. I recommend that you read the posts on that first page again. You may not comprehend them, but perhaps you may get a faint suspicion - as faint as the light from a faraway galaxy - that they perceive a truth that you are completely unaware off. You are right that a colorblind person lacks the wherewithal to be able to tell, what those who talk about other colors are talking about. But then, we are all a little colorblind, aren't we...in our own way. So, then there is no point in talking in blues, to the one who doesn't see it. that way.

angelikaJ -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 2:11:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: uncertainlyizzy Ok. Probably talking to a brick wall on this but I'm saying it to assuage my inner annoyance and I'll be honest about that. Depression can be both situational and/or chemical. Sleeping 20 hours a day out of 24 and ceasing to eat or bathe or function completely? Is not a habit. It is a serious issue that needs to be addressed in any matter whatsoever that helps it in anyway. There are some people out there who through no fault nor cause of their own are dealing with an illness that seems to be kicking their ass no matter what they do. Doesn't make them weak or make them not trying hard enough. There are people who can get through depression just fine with therapy. There are people who can't. There's no difference between the strengths of the two sets of people or of their dedication to their own care. There are depressive states of thinking and there are chemical states of dopamine and serotonin imbalance. If you spend any time at all with a diverse group of people who deal with mental illness then you'll encounter both. They are both in equally valid states of depression. Hearing "Just do it!" or "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps!" from a stranger hurts. Hearing it from someone who claims to know what it's like or to have been there cuts you like you wouldn't believe. And that is the point as I see it, and my Master cares about my physical and emotional wellbeing. When I have a sinus infection or bronchitis, he takes me to the doctor's if I need help getting there. Mental health is no different. I do have a responsibility for my health. If an aspect of the relationship was creating a situation that was causing me to be self-destructive, I would be expected to let him know. There is little question, by the way, that "situational depression" can cause changes in brain chemistry in some circumstances. Also, while vitamin D may be quite helpful for S.A.D., simply pulling one up by one's bootstraps isn't going to do the trick. For the majority of people on medication, medication plus therapy is much more effective than just medication on it's own.

Rule -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 2:11:22 PM)
Quite. Hence: Be your own self.

tiggerspoohbear -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 5:37:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: subbykat quote: ORIGINAL: subbykat What people need to do is stop taking meds, which kill the libido and start having better sex. Now, don't tell me having full body, multiple orgasms aren't a mood boost. Doctors won't tell you. They want you to take their pills. It's not just about the sex. That's what you don't understand. It's about having that "heart-connection" with someone. My suggestion is to learn tantra with your partner. I know I wrote that post when I was really down. I get moody occasionally and become the martyr. It's actually a bad habit I learned in childhood when I didn't get my way. Fortuntely, I have better control of it now than I ever did before, but once in a while, my old "pity me" self arises and if I don't nip it in the bud, it can take over. But let me tell you something about depression. It's never a permanent state of mind. It's just a state of mind and like any state, it can be changed through learning to better control how you think. Yep, it can be done. But most people train themselves to feel so bad, by replaying the worst events of their lives like pushing the replay and rewind button, it's no wonder they make themselves depressed. I believe in the mind-body connection and I believe that our minds can alter our brain chemistry, in negative or positive way... I'm so glad you have the temerity to make such an unfounded statement. The bolded part emphasizes that. I've suffered from bouts of depression since I was 6 yrs old. From clinical depression for at least the last 10 yrs. Guess what? My brain is wired differently. I can't change the way I think anymore than I can change the fact that I'm 48 yrs old. I'm going to be on meds for the rest of my life. Do I want this? O hell to the no. Is it a fact? Yes, it is. One acknowledged by hospital psychiatric units who've run numerous tests on me, psychiatrists I've dealt with and a jewel of a psycho-therapist. I've also dealt with counselors and psychologists. I'm not in a relationship right now, and yes, I do better when there's someone there for me. So what am I supposed to do for that mind-blowing sex I so miss? Go out on one-night stands. I did that years ago and it didn't make me feel better. Good for you if you think you're in a healthy relationship and think that your mood is associated with mind blowing sex. But don't you dare put down those of us who suffer daily from depression and various assorted disorders. They're real to me and affect my daily life in ways I wish they didn't. You're a condescending child who has no real knowledge of what goes on in different peoples lives and you're quick to dismiss them. By the time I was your age I'd live more than 2 lifetimes, a lot of them very rough years. Yet I've never even thought of suicide because I know the damage it leaves behind with family, loved ones and friends. I've been there to see that damage and been affected by it too. You think you're being witty with your comments, but you're not. You're just showing ignorance about something you have no real clue about. So get one, a clue, before you get hit in the head by a clue-by-four wondering what happened to you and how you found yourself there. But don't come back here, because crying wolf is not going to work. Some of us have very long memories and will remember this thread you started and how you laughed off the advice you were given. You made you bed, now lie in it.

subbykat -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 6:10:37 PM)
I guess some of these posts just reinforce that "what we like or dislike in others, is what we like or dislike in ourselves..." just sayin'.. I know there's no point in arguing with people who have a lot invested in being sad and depressed. It's not my problem. Some people are happy being unhappy. That;s ok too. I don't have enough time in a day to convince anyone otherwise.

LafayetteLady -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 6:18:22 PM)
Not at all. We just see you for being the whiney, foolish brat you are. Thankfully, precious few of us are stupid enough to stay with an asshole who resorts to emotional blackmail. And what you see as people "seeing too much of ourselves" is really just some of us being tired of listening to your childish bullshit and giving you the verbal bitch slap your "master" is too busy fucking other women to be bothered to give you himself.

subbykat -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 6:27:27 PM)
I get the feeling people want me to be depressed here. lol. I get a lot of put downs. It's like the internet Jerry Springer show. btw, Lafayette, you were blocked a long time ago, since that first post where you said... if I died, my Dom wouldn't even show up at my funeral. That's just cruel and abusive dear.

juliaoceania -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 6:48:15 PM)
quote: When depression is caused by a chemical imbalance, drugs are necessary and they can be lifesavers. Chemical imbalances can be straightened out with proper diet and exercise, in addition with meditation and cognitive behavioral therapy. Drugs are not always required. In fact it can be extremely dangerous when treating depression with different drugs as this can cause depression to worsen. I know people who have been on several medications trying to find the right one to aid them in their attempts to get over depression. Chemical imbalances can happen after a pregnancy, during menopause, after a short-lived drinking binge, out of unresolved grief.... etc etc etc. In fact, the role of additives, hormones in food, and preservatives in understanding mood disturbances is being studied. Sometimes people just spontaneously recover from a depression with no treatment at all. Many people have a depression episode that never gets diagnosed or treated, and yet they get better. One thing they are finding about depression, and that is the role of neuropathways, and how certain pathways get built up over habitual negative thoughts. For those who have negative thoughts most of the time, it gets harder and harder to look at things in a positive way. This can lead to a feedback loop in which the person has to struggle for a thought that "feels" good. It takes a lot of effort to reteach such a person to look at the bright side of their challenges. In other words, they are mentally out of shape, just like someone who is a couch potatoe would have trouble running a marathon. I just find it very one sided to suggest to depressed people that they need to drug it away, especially since we do not know how effective that treatment would be anyways. I was treated for depression and now I know I was misdiagnosed with PTSD. CBT did not help me, and I did not go on drugs. I made a conscious decision to exercise, eat right, and to think more positively. Yes, sometimes my moods become funky, and I am more anxious than depressed.... but the role of training my brain to think about the world in a more positive manner has saved me from what was at one time a terribly dark place. The only reason I did not end it was because I thought of my son, and how I am all he has in this world. I could never break his heart like that, and it would have broke his heart in two. My advice to people who are resistant to "professional" psychologists.... talk to a friend, a school counselor, an aunt, a cousin, a sibling.... just talk to someone whom you trust. Keep talking. I do not think that everyone needs to get "professional help, but if you are thinking of ending it all, you need to talk about that with people in the real world so they can help you.

subbykat -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 7:00:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: When depression is caused by a chemical imbalance, drugs are necessary and they can be lifesavers. Chemical imbalances can be straightened out with proper diet and exercise, in addition with meditation and cognitive behavioral therapy. Drugs are not always required. In fact it can be extremely dangerous when treating depression with different drugs as this can cause depression to worsen. I know people who have been on several medications trying to find the right one to aid them in their attempts to get over depression. Chemical imbalances can happen after a pregnancy, during menopause, after a short-lived drinking binge, out of unresolved grief.... etc etc etc. In fact, the role of additives, hormones in food, and preservatives in understanding mood disturbances is being studied. Sometimes people just spontaneously recover from a depression with no treatment at all. Many people have a depression episode that never gets diagnosed or treated, and yet they get better. One thing they are finding about depression, and that is the role of neuropathways, and how certain pathways get built up over habitual negative thoughts. For those who have negative thoughts most of the time, it gets harder and harder to look at things in a positive way. This can lead to a feedback loop in which the person has to struggle for a thought that "feels" good. It takes a lot of effort to reteach such a person to look at the bright side of their challenges. In other words, they are mentally out of shape, just like someone who is a couch potatoe would have trouble running a marathon. I just find it very one sided to suggest to depressed people that they need to drug it away, especially since we do not know how effective that treatment would be anyways. I was treated for depression and now I know I was misdiagnosed with PTSD. CBT did not help me, and I did not go on drugs. I made a conscious decision to exercise, eat right, and to think more positively. Yes, sometimes my moods become funky, and I am more anxious than depressed.... but the role of training my brain to think about the world in a more positive manner has saved me from what was at one time a terribly dark place. The only reason I did not end it was because I thought of my son, and how I am all he has in this world. I could never break his heart like that, and it would have broke his heart in two. My advice to people who are resistant to "professional" psychologists.... talk to a friend, a school counselor, an aunt, a cousin, a sibling.... just talk to someone whom you trust. Keep talking. I do not think that everyone needs to get "professional help, but if you are thinking of ending it all, you need to talk about that with people in the real world so they can help you. Juliaoceania, You got! I especially like where you wrote: quote: One thing they are finding about depression, and that is the role of neuropathways, and how certain pathways get built up over habitual negative thoughts. For those who have negative thoughts most of the time, it gets harder and harder to look at things in a positive way. This can lead to a feedback loop in which the person has to struggle for a thought that "feels" good. It takes a lot of effort to reteach such a person to look at the bright side of their challenges. In other words, they are mentally out of shape, just like someone who is a couch potatoe would have trouble running a marathon. I've found this to be very true in my life. I know that positive thinking and changing one's mental processes can be difficult when a person is so accustomed to thinking a certain way. It doesn't change overnight. All I know is that a keeping an open mind and having the desire to change goes a long way... btw, this is an old thread. The way I felt when I wrote it, is very different to how I feel now. Fortunately, I have some tools that can quickly help me change mental states. It's fairly simple, once I decide I want to feel good.

coookie -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 7:38:47 PM)
I do agree with the fact that some people can handle situations on their own and that support networks (friends/family/pets) can be a fantastic counselor but some people also are unable to get to the other side of the corn field. subbykat this is not really an old thread. 2 weeks is not a long time to be in a remission for depression. What many here are concerned about is the next time that it comes. You should have some sort of safety net. Talking about suicide is serious as most successfully carried out attempts are done after they have told people that they have these feelings. It is very rare for it to come out of nowhere. We are a forum board and can only go on the information you have posted.

juliaoceania -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 8:38:21 PM)
quote: subbykat this is not really an old thread. 2 weeks is not a long time to be in a remission for depression. It is long enough to show a dramatic mood swing from one extreme to the other, which isn't depression at all, but bipolarity. I am not saying this is what is going on with the OP, but it is a different sort of animal than your garden variety depressive state. Only a medical professional can diagnose it....

coookie -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/23/2011 8:47:36 PM)
Absolutely and since the OP had mentioned lithium in an earlier thread i was wondering if that was her diagnosis though since she only referred to depression i went on what she posted. It would be a very normal swing for bipolar though though still would not be considered "old" behaviour.

subbykat -> RE: self-destructive subs (4/24/2011 6:40:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: subbykat this is not really an old thread. 2 weeks is not a long time to be in a remission for depression. It is long enough to show a dramatic mood swing from one extreme to the other, which isn't depression at all, but bipolarity. I am not saying this is what is going on with the OP, but it is a different sort of animal than your garden variety depressive state. Only a medical professional can diagnose it.... Oh please spare me the diagnosis...I was down for like 2 days. That doesn't make me "clinically depressed"...What's wrong with you people wanting to put everything into a little box? I must give your boring lives something to talk about. Now knock yourselves out with your psycho...anal...isis. I'm out of here.

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