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Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justice lo... - 5/3/2011 1:33:09 PM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		From  Der Spiegel
Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justice looks like? Al-Qaida boss Osama bin Laden was killed on Sunday in a secret military operation in Pakistan. Americans are celebrating, but there are serious doubts about whether the targeted killing was legal under international law and the laws of war. An Analysis by Thomas Darnstädt more... [ Forum ]
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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 1:36:23 PM   
mnottertail


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This is not the first violation of international law we have ever perpetrated, if it is a violation. 

Horse apiece, then--- Osam.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 1:59:21 PM   
readyfordomina


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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 2:18:13 PM   
farglebargle


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Status: offline 		"Legal" hasn't been a standard our politicians have been held to for a long, long time....

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 2:26:56 PM   
jlf1961


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Status: offline 		Okay lets see.

1) violation of a country's air space with military aircraft without permission. Violation of International Law

2) armed military action within a country without prior notification or cooperation. Violation of international law

3) killed Osama bin Laden. Killing a terrorist bastard responsible for 3000+ American lives.


Who the fuck cares if it was illegal.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 2:33:53 PM   
hlen5


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Status: offline 		Let's see:

1). Hijacking 4 planes and running 3 of them into buildings

2) Killing over 3,00 people at a blow.

Were these things against international law?

Releasing a glee-filled video on an attack that exceeded your expectations (the towers falling vs just death and destruction for hitting them) was just the icing on the cake.



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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 2:36:05 PM   
jlf1961


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Status: offline 		Hlen, I was saying that illegal or not, the result was worth it.

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You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 2:42:08 PM   
hlen5


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Hlen, I was saying that illegal or not, the result was worth it.


Sorry I wasn't clear enough, I was agreeing with you!

I wonder how uninformed the Pakistanis really were? Maybe it was a wink and a nod, "Nope, we didn't know nuthin about it"??

Him holed up amongst retired military generals might raise other suspicions.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 2:45:15 PM   
defiantbadgirl


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Status: offline 		Government officials in Pakistan may be guilty of deliberately hiding Osama Bin Laden. President Obama did what he had to because a secret operation was the only way to get him.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 2:59:18 PM   
NorthernGent


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Status: offline 		From the BBC website:

Was the killing of Bin Laden legal?

The use of deadly force against Bin Laden is unlikely to be challenged in an American court. But the US account stating that the al-Qaeda leader resisted capture suggests the military is mindful of legal issues.

Assassinations are banned under both US and international law. Extrajudicial killings are only allowed in an armed conflict.

According to British law professor Philippe Sands QC, of University College London, much will turn on what Pakistan knew and authorised, what the US objectives were, and what happened when they confronted Bin Laden.

Until the facts are established, it is unclear whether the raid and its consequences were legal or not, Mr Sands adds.

The US can certainly argue that it was entitled to take action to protect its citizens against a deadly enemy.

"Even if the use of deadly force was unlawful, international law recognises that there are exceptional circumstances where necessity precludes wrongfulness, and this will be said to be one of those case," Mr Sands told the BBC.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 3:07:09 PM   
NorthernGent


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Status: offline 		The question I would ask is exactly what values are being defended by the US and the West in general (in relation to the ongoing occupations and sortees into places such as Libya)? The rule of law?

Would seem to me that defending the rule of law by undermining it (e.g. assassination), is a strange way of promoting US or Western values.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 3:22:17 PM   
hlen5


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Status: offline 		I don't disagree that internationally it was illegal. I believe we should practice what we preach.

The fact that the powers that be deemed the success of the mission in jeopardy IF they informed Pakistan muddies the water a lot.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 3:25:05 PM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: hlen5

I don't disagree that internationally it was illegal. I believe we should practice what we preach.

The fact that the powers that be deemed the success of the mission in jeopardy IF they informed Pakistan muddies the water a lot.



Just about every report I've read states that until the details are disclosed, the legality of the operation can't be determined.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 3:27:01 PM   
Lucylastic


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Status: offline 		ok reuters was saying earlier that the Pakistani government have members of his family in detention..
but they didnt know about it but kept the family without protesting??
theres some diplomatc crap going on somewhere


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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 3:32:06 PM   
Phydeaux


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Status: offline 		And who really cares if a bunch of pinheads wonder if it was legal or not.

I mean.. really.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 3:32:22 PM   
hlen5


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Status: offline 		One of the helicopters broke down. Those family members were all trussed up for transport and the Pakistanis were batting clean-up.

But you're right, something smells rotten.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 3:34:15 PM   
kalikshama


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White House officials on Tuesday sought to correct the official account of the raid in Pakistan that ended in the killing of Osama bin Laden, saying that the Qaeda leader was not armed and that his wife was not killed.

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 4:08:43 PM   
KenDckey


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Status: offline 		Wasn't it Bush who said that any state that harbors a terrorist is an enemy?    I am remembering here since it was 10 years ago.   But that then set the stage for the intrusion.  It declared Pakistan a terrorist state according to that definition.   Just trying to remember.   But if Pakistan was declared a terrorist state and subject to attack, then they were prewarned.   Just asking here

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 4:48:48 PM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		IMO it is a slippery slope to ignore the rule of law.  Mob rule if you like.

It is what it is-   yet-  what have we become in the process?

The kill raises alot of legitimate questions.   We SAY we want the rule of law- and then do a hit.   Who is next and who decides if it is ok?

As mentioned we dont have the full facts yet....   we should be asking questions.     The guy was scum- no doubt.  

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RE: Was Bin Laden's Killing Legal? Is this what justic... - 5/3/2011 4:57:57 PM   
jlf1961


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Status: offline 		Hunk, was the hijacking of four jets legal?

How about the number of suicide bombers who killed innocent bystanders, were they committing legal acts?

In other words, who gives a shit, the bastard got what he deserved, legal or not. And considering the fact that Osama Bin Laden was living a mile or so from the Pakistani military academy, I cannot believe that someone in the Pakistani government did not know he was there.

Furthermore, the US has made it clear that any nation harboring terrorists are terrorists themselves and subject to military action.

In other words, Hunk, someone in Pakistani government knew he was there, knew how the US felt about harboring terrorists and knew that just by letting him live there, they were in the line of fire.

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Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

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