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ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Tazzy, med school isn't just expensive,
No it is not ...look it up...how much does it cost a california resident to go to a u.c med school?

it is also hard,



Really???what is the drop out rate????less than 2% after the first year.

and requires great committment and personal sacrifice.

More than joining the army?


I'm certainly in for methods that might allow the students to clear the debt through public service, but if prospective students don't have the brains and drive to clear the financial hurdle at the gate,

If they had the brains and drive to pass the academic hurdles and not the financial hurdles what does that say about your perception of the problem?

how many classroom seats are we going to be clogging with those who don't have what it takes to finish anyway?

As has already been pointed out there is a really small attrition rate in med school.

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No, that is NOT another topic... somebody has to PAY for education. There is no money to pay for it... they are linked.

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Paying for it creates far more incentive to be prepared than knowing youre going to be sitting across the aisle from someone who shouldn't have graduated high school much less be in college for free.

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Assuming we think learning the importance of hard work, individual responsibility, creative problem solving, and personal sacrifice, are irrelevant to becoming educated.

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

You can see the "me" attitude on this thread.

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

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And no there are not many US educated doctors in Germany

Thank you, calamity. Its typically the first argument against Drs... that many from other countries come to the US system to be educated.

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Sick of Bad Pay, Doctors Flee Germany
German doctors are packing their scalpels and seeking their fortunes abroad, lured by the prospect of far higher pay and driven away by stifling bureaucracy in their country's health service.

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"Fröhling has been working in England for over a year, he's one of 2,600 German doctors in Britain who escaped from the woes of their country's health service to greener pastures. Away from Germany, the land of bad pay, long working hours, all-encroaching bureaucracy and rigid organization."

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"Fröhlich comes from a family of doctors. When he started as an assistant doctor in a hospital in the northern city of Bremen in 1982, he still believed in "the healing function of my profession". But after just a few shifts he came to the sobering realization that in everyday hospital life, the interests of the patients come last..."

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"Most of the German doctors who emigrate go to the United States, which has taken about 2,700. Britain comes second, according to figures from the National Association of Statutory Health Insurance Physicians. Sweden, which has taken 700, and Norway, with 650, are becoming more popular. Special agencies lure doctors by placing advertisements in professional publications and doctors who want to supplement their income spend weekends working in Britain. After finishing their week's work in German practices they can earn up to €2,000 for a weekend shift in a British hospital.
Doctors' salaries have fallen steadily in the last three years. Many a young clinic doctor gets paid less than a long-serving nurse even if he puts in 70 hours a week. Because ever fewer people are applying for such jobs there's a growing shortage of doctors in parts of the country. Many rural doctors are complaining that they can't find successors to hand their surgeries to.

The situation is disastrous for public health and a debacle for the economy. If the trend of recent years continues -- with only 7,000 of 12,000 medical students completing their training -- over €1 billion of university costs will have been wasted. The deficit will continue to rise the more qualified doctors decide to earn their money abroad."

Source: http://www.spiegel.de/international/0,1518,399537,00.html

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ORIGINAL: thompsonx

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ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Something given has no value, Tazzy.

The love your mother gave you has no value?

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ORIGINAL: thompsonx

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No, that is NOT another topic... somebody has to PAY for education. There is no money to pay for it... they are linked.

There is money enough for the war in the sand box but you say there is no money for education?

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Currently (as of 2008) Germany has 334 Physicians per 100,000 people.

UK has 230

Sweden has 328

The US has 256

San Marino has 4,735

Cuba has 591

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

...over 40.000 in cash and benefits at 1 year of service.

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

BASIC PAY FOR ACTIVE DUTY SOLDIERS*

Chart reflects Basic Pay only and does not include bonuses, allowances and other benefits.

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

...they still had more Doctors per capita than the US or the UK.

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And expenses extend beyond simple "benefits"... benefits do not equate to CASH FLOW -- you know, that thing you use to pay rent, buy baby food, diapers, heating, etc.

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Duke University Hospital admitted a "tragic error" Monday in transplanting the heart and lungs of the wrong blood type into a 17-year-old girl now in critical condition.

Jesica Santillan, who underwent the surgery Feb. 7, is not expected to live more than a few days, said Mack Mahoney, a family friend who has medical power of attorney for the girl because her parents do not speak English.

As of early Tuesday afternoon, family friends were reporting the girl was still in declining health and getting more swollen, while doctors have told them her kidneys have stopped operating.

"In our efforts to identify organs for this desperately ill patient, regrettably, a mistake occurred," Chief Executive Officer of Duke Hospital Dr. William Fulkerson said in a statement. "This was a tragic error, and we accept responsibility for our part."

Hospital officials refused to elaborate on exactly how the type-A organs were mistakenly transplanted into the girl, who has type-O-positive blood, but Mahoney, a philanthropist who helped raise the money for the operation, claimed the family was told it was a "clerical error" that Jesica was listed as a potential recipient for the organs.