RE: protection collar? (Full Version)

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valeca -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 11:08:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ginawithaB


quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Ya know, I personally do not see what the big deal is all about. It just sounds like one of those situations that if you don't agree with it then you quite simply do not participate! I don't see that anyone is getting hurt,  or that anyone is getting a collar of any sort rammed over their head. No one is forcing any Dom/Domina to play with or consider having a submissive/slave with a protection collar. What is the big flipping deal??? If someone wants one and someone wants to give them one, isn't that between them? Hell, if you want someone to pry your mouth open and shit down your throat I am SOOOOOOOO not gonna get the thrill from either side of that coin but, hey, if its your thing......by all means have a party! ( just don't ask me to clean up the mess or even watch )


Good grief to this thread! and Amen, LaTigresse...I am soooooo with you on this one!


Discussion board = venue to discuss concepts, debate, educate, share/present
experience (or lack thereof)...and oh, yeah, voice opinions on the topics posted.  I'm gonna go out on a limb here and assume this is why the forums were created.

Note: The preceeding post is meant to be taken as good natured, playful rib-poking with no intent to offend.




ginawithaB -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 12:13:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: valeca

quote:

ORIGINAL: ginawithaB


quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Ya know, I personally do not see what the big deal is all about. It just sounds like one of those situations that if you don't agree with it then you quite simply do not participate! I don't see that anyone is getting hurt,  or that anyone is getting a collar of any sort rammed over their head. No one is forcing any Dom/Domina to play with or consider having a submissive/slave with a protection collar. What is the big flipping deal??? If someone wants one and someone wants to give them one, isn't that between them? Hell, if you want someone to pry your mouth open and shit down your throat I am SOOOOOOOO not gonna get the thrill from either side of that coin but, hey, if its your thing......by all means have a party! ( just don't ask me to clean up the mess or even watch )


Good grief to this thread! and Amen, LaTigresse...I am soooooo with you on this one!


Discussion board = venue to discuss concepts, debate, educate, share/present
experience (or lack thereof)...and oh, yeah, voice opinions on the topics posted.  I'm gonna go out on a limb here and assume this is why the forums were created.

Note: The preceeding post is meant to be taken as good natured, playful rib-poking with no intent to offend.


Right......I expressed my opinion...and then you expressed yours...that IS usually how it works.

For the record, here's more of my opinion. I object to what in my OPINION is less of a discussion, less of a debate and more of a judgmental free-for-all against a practice that may in fact, be beneficial for some and not beneficial for others. And the irony in all of this is that the OP, the original question which inadvertantly spurred this whole "debate" was never even properly addressed. I hope the OP managed to find the answer to that question elsewhere, `cause it sure ain't happenin' here.

And while I have the floor I will address an issue that was raised here by a few of those against the collar of protection. That is the issue of how one will learn to protect oneself in this lifestyle if one is depending upon others to do it for them...Well, I don't know much about the original thinking behind the collar of protection, but I look at it in much the same way as I see Mentoring. And the purpose of Mentoring is not for the Mentor to take over responsibility from the Mentee, but rather to nurture the Mentee into growth. I would hope that in offering a collar of protection, the individual offering would have this same sort of idea of Mentoring and guiding a submissive through to learning. Not every sub comes into this lifestyle knowing all she or he needs to know...and some require a significant amount of assistance in learning all that she or he needs to know. And some may greatly benefit from the type of assistance this collar of protection may offer. And I'm sure that this collar, as any collar, can be and is at times, used as an excuse to abuse. But a collar of protection offered in good faith can also have the potential of guiding a sub into realizing her or his strength.

Here endeth my soapbox.

Peace.




Wulfchyld -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 1:09:12 PM)

squick reply, no one in particular...


I am amazed that it is being so broadly assumed that the collar of protection is being viewed as a tool of rape and plunder. So just to try and get a sense of what the debate is about let my toss down a couple things here:

Protection, Collar of protection: The protector is screening contact looking of for “red flags” for the sub/slave. There is no physical contact, obedience training, brain washing, blah blah blah. The protector is offering advice, information, and mentorship to guide the sub/slave to find out her kink’s (I know there is a string of letters that say that better, but I don’t remember them), discover limits and just plain old “OMFG no way”.  I am pretty much sure the touching, humping, rubbing, spanking, and 100 other “ing” are not part of the protocol. I have handed out a collar myself so a slave would have an instant safety net in plain view, why? Because she didn’t want confronted with a situation she wasn’t all together sure she could call red or even no thanks to. She is servile and obedient and her kink is pleasing people. By havening my color of protection around her neck she was protecting herself by being aware that I was looking for her well being and that pleasing me was by protecting herself. Even though I wasn’t with her, she took care of herself, turned down scenes that were not her kink and felt good because she was still pleasing a Dom, me, by protecting herself.

Trainer, trainers collar: This looks more like the little imp that everyone is rabid over. I am pretty sure everyone knows this guy and has been fucked or fucked over by him. Not saying all trainers are bad, but it is a meat market mentality. The good ol trainer is going to mentor, protect, guide, teach, show the ropes, and in some cases fuck you nine ways to midnight and play with your head. I suspect more than a few has had the hard rod of “this is how it is” up places you would rather it not be. Then comes the sore discover of this inst how it is or this is how it is for you and a dozen others. He/she is forming mentor bonds and leading you on. No need to keep going, you know the story all ready.

I would rather not pick at a sore but I think it is high time for this thread to be looked at:

http://www.collarchat.com/No_protective_order_for_woman_who_signed_contract%25%25%25/m_275753/tm.htm




ShivaTS -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 1:56:32 PM)

You have read my posts and how I felt when I got into the lifestyle.  My Master gave me a training collar and places a lock on it everytime we go out to places he knows I will feel uncomfortable and he isnt able to keep an eye on me when I draw into myself.  The lock he places on me tells others I am not availible and therefore I dont have to deal with people dominating me.  It's so easy to not fight the urge to give in and do whatever someone tells you.  No thinking, no feeling. just doing what someone wants because you know that it will please them.  Even after being sent to the hospital, I continued to submit to people that acted dominant and continued to pay for it.  I am lucky I have no lasting injuries.  I realise after 3 months of my Master's attention and training that I was in a very bad place in my life and was mentally broken.  I know better than to just give in now, and my Master has given me help by collaring me.  He has never given anyone a training collar before but after relaying my little experience in the lifestyle, he told me it would be better if I wore it.  I am happy he gave it to me.




twicehappy -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 2:43:05 PM)

Loki as usual a great post, smiles




LaTigresse -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 3:32:33 PM)

Loki, thank you for sharing that thread, I had not read it previously.......and wow........the things I could think of to "educate" people like that guy




Wulfchyld -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 3:47:31 PM)

Thank ya {my secret fantasy fetish...} Did I say that out loud?
 
That thread is a very fine example of how someone can mentor/protect you against such things. Sadly, she could mentor/protect through life experience, but that is exactly what people are offering... life experience. I have to say that we get that from books, forums, advice, and a very powerful dynamic of someone taking the time to offer "protection" to someone that they have no motive with other than guidance.



oops guess bita snagged my "n" and not my "o". lol




LadyHugs -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 3:53:32 PM)

Dear Wulfchyld, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
I am in agreement with your first paragraph, to which to your amazement, as well as mine frankly; that the "collar of protection" is a tool of rape and plunder. 
 
I do have close ties and associations to many individuals who are scene notables, authors, title holders, leaders of groups, organizations, speakers, presenters, trainers, lifestyle Masters, Mistresses like me, slaves, here and abroad.  I don't use them to justify myself or give weight to my words.  My friends, associates and I have earned our leathers properly and do not shove it up everybody's face but, we have all come to the agreement; that people are the problem when it comes to abuse of others.  However, vigilante mentality, attitude and behavior like everybody is ready to rape, plunder, kill and or injure, fanatics; that I seem to see manifested by some; is not the answer, especially when it comes from an opposite coast who have no standing, in organizations, groups, clubs, etc. 
 
It clearly must be said, it is not a "collar" issue but, more of a "people" problem.  If individuals have an evil intent to use, abuse others--they will do so and that is that.  On the other side of it all, there are those who have ethics, high standards and a sense of duty; to which such people as you and I, just wish to give a hand up--not a hand out.
 
I've seen people, that should know better, give presentations and lectures preach on anti-abuse and, behind closed doors do exactly as they preached was wrong, sometimes worse. 
 
Individuals will be on their best behavior in public.  In private, they are not watched and that is when those who do not practice what they preach on, anti-abuse, anti-rape, anti-plunder the loudest are the ones behind closed doors who do the very same thing they preach against in a most fantanic manner.  I remember the 'fire and brimstone' preachers taking a 'holier then thou' stand; these same sort were romping around committing the very thing they preached against; e.g. J.  Baker, James Fallwell, Jessie Jackson, Al Sharpton, etc.
 
When a Master friend of mine was on his death bed, his slave and I at his side; had an un-collaring ceremony among ourselves.  The Master before this ceremony began, said his piece with his slave and his slave was so upset and so lost, emotions understood.  The Master gifted his slave to me.  Now, this could be a "transfer" of ownership, protection and or any meaning but, it is the intent of such an act that has meaning.  The slave knew me and was fond of me but; he would not have ever chosen me as his Master on his own.  I knew my ownership was a temporary one until we found a new Master for the slave.  The dying Master knew this "intent" and "purpose."  However, the slave would be slave to me until that time.  The Master un-collared his slave. His slave bare neck.  But, he was "transfered" to me.  Now, days it could be considered as a "protection" collar but, in my mind's eye and of the time this took place; it was a slave collar period.  To see some of the responses, one would think it was a thing of ugliness instead of the beauty of continuity.  This makes me truly sad.
 
There is an emotional feeling, when a collar is placed on a slave and or submissive's neck.  Just as much as there is to the one who places it on the neck.
 
I do see how the "protection" collar works, the "training" collar works.  Each collaring situation should be respected as an individual case-by-case basis.  If it works for them--wonderful.  If it doesn't, at least they gave it a try and have learned from it.  But, it is of a concern how some have become disrespectful of the rainbow variety of opinions.  There is no right or wrong--Who are we to judge, unless we be judged.  The whole thought on community, is that our goals are to seek our happiness in a safe, consensual manner that is respectful of the whole relationship.  As a dominant woman, a member in good standing--my only wish and or desire, is to share my experiences to which I found my happiness for many years at a time.  I would enjoy seeing others being just as successful and happy. That said, it would be unrealistic if I didn't share all the sadness also.
 
But, as you have written, as have others-- There are so many good individuals then bad.  Again, it is the few bad actors that give the good of the lifestyle a "black eye."
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs
 




CrappyDom -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 4:21:26 PM)

I think collars of protection serve a very valuable service in that they clearly identify a certain sort and I guess just like those who announce they are seeking a true submissive, it will just be another red flag in my book.

To those glorious women who laugh in the face of danger and dare to attend a group without a collar, risking death and dismemberment, I salute you.




xLilithx -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 4:53:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom

I think collars of protection serve a very valuable service in that they clearly identify a certain sort and I guess just like those who announce they are seeking a true submissive, it will just be another red flag in my book.

To those glorious women who laugh in the face of danger and dare to attend a group without a collar, risking death and dismemberment, I salute you.


lol.. Thanks Crappy, you made me laugh.




gooddogbenji -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 5:14:00 PM)

So wait, that collar of protection I'm wearing doesn't give my online Domme the right to access my bank accounts, take possession of my house, online-assrape me with a phone book, and sell my children on eBay??????? 

FUCK!  Couldn't someone have started this thread a few weeks ago?  It would have spared me a lot of trouble!

And by the way, why do I find myself agreeing with Loki, and finding others somewhat....  ummmm....  petty, perhaps?

Yours,


benji




Wulfchyld -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 5:19:58 PM)

I suppose I should at least add that I offer no illusions. Any girl I collar as a slave will be plunder.




Najakcharmer -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 5:20:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: gooddogbenji

So wait, that collar of protection I'm wearing doesn't give my online Domme the right to access my bank accounts, take possession of my house, online-assrape me with a phone book, and sell my children on eBay??????? 


Oooh.  That would be a fucking hot scene.  Let's do it. 




Wulfchyld -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 5:25:07 PM)

Because your a good dog and the forums would suck without you... well, blow... sucking is a good thing.




Najakcharmer -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 5:28:37 PM)

Okay, but seriously now.  There have been times when I have offered to be a newbie's mentor, friend and "protector" in the sense of being available for safe calls and making sure that any prospective partner of theirs knew that an experienced domme would be providing her friend a solid reality check.  Would this constitute a "collar of protection"?  Possibly, but I wouldn't necessarily use that phrase or hand out an actual collar.   I suppose I just might, if I were really convinced that it would make the newbie feel safer and better for their first introduction, and if the newbie was well enough behaved that I did not mind staking my name and reputation to their behavior at an event.  But I don't see it as being really necessary for most people under most circumstances. 

These situations I've personally been in with newbies really have been free of ulterior motive.  I wanted them as friends, not subs, and I just wanted to be sure that they were okay and playing safe.   This isn't always the case; a lot of people apparently use "protection collars" as a hidden agenda to get into somebody's pants.  That would not be me.  If I want to get into somebody's pants, I'll simply ask them to take them off.  LOL




gooddogbenji -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 5:38:07 PM)

Actually, in a way, I'm kinda in that situation.  I met some people (Prodomme and daughter) at a munch, and have now spent a few days at their house, talking about the lifestyle, learning, actually got into the dungeon and got double-Dommed, (YAY) will be attending a play party with the daughter and her sub next week, etc etc.....

She tells me, openly, she wants to make me her bitch.  (My words, her meaning)
I tell her I'm not interested, as she already has a sub.
She accepts this.
There's no subterfuge, no using, nothing going on.  It's all about some nice people trying to keep a newbie out of trouble, and letting him find his kinks.  I'm not wearing a collar, but if they offered me something like a collar of protection, in a similar form to what it is now, I would accept.

And hey, turns out I'm more of a pain slut than I thought!

Yours,


benji




gooddogbenji -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 5:43:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Najakcharmer

Oooh.  That would be a fucking hot scene.  Let's do it. 



It's only hot when it hasn't already happened, and your children have been Fed-Exed to Latvia.

Oh, and all 14 "Smith" pages are still up my ass.

Yours,


benji




Wulfchyld -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 5:44:04 PM)

benji you are just to loveable for words. If I had a use for a male sub right now... you would be wondering if you would ever be getting out of the trunk. lol




gooddogbenji -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 5:46:44 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wulfchyld

benji you are just to loveable for words. If I had a use for a male sub right now... you would be wondering if you would ever be getting out of the trunk. lol



If I had a use for a Dom right now....  But that wytchy of yours would not know what had hit her!

(it was you.  I don't hit people, I pee on them)

Yours,


benji




Najakcharmer -> RE: protection collar? (5/16/2006 6:14:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: gooddogbenji
It's only hot when it hasn't already happened, and your children have been Fed-Exed to Latvia.


Since my "children" are some pretty wild critters....literally....whoever opens that particular package is in for a wee bit of a surprise.  Ask to see the rest of my profile picture sometime.  [8D]

quote:

Oh, and all 14 "Smith" pages are still up my ass.


You know it was a really hot play party when....




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