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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 6:39:52 AM   
DomImus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
Apparently, this couple had a rather nasty-breakup. Whatever may have brought them to this, I think the question of whether free speech trumps privacy, is a good one.


I know the Constitution guarantees freedom of speech but I've yet to find the right to privacy guaranteed anywhere in it.


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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 6:41:52 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

The sign on Alamogordo's main thoroughfare shows 35-year-old Greg Fultz holding the outline of an infant. The text reads, "This Would Have Been A Picture Of My 2-Month Old Baby If The Mother Had Decided To Not KILL Our Child!"

Fultz's ex-girlfriend has taken him to court for harassment and violation of privacy. A domestic court official has recommended the billboard be removed.

But Fultz's attorney argues the order violates his client's free speech rights.

"As distasteful and offensive as the sign may be to some, for over 200 years in this country the First Amendment protects distasteful and offensive speech," Todd Holmes said.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110606/ap_on_re_us/us_abortion_billboard


Apparently, this couple had a rather nasty-breakup. Whatever may have brought them to this, I think the question of whether free speech trumps privacy, is a good one.



No way should the government force him to take the sign down and when he loses the civil case the woman can take everything he owns.

What if he's flat broke, lives in his mom's basement and gets around in an '85 honda to his job at McBurger?

Then how did he pay to put up a billboard?

Billboards are just a few hundred bucks. At least they were last time I looked into getting one.
Also, look at the post above yours. He MIGHT have had financial help. It is a stretch tho.

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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 6:42:55 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: EternalHoH

She needs to take out a bigger ad on a bigger billboard.  But then again, the anti-abortion fundies are probably funding his billboard anyway. He threads some narrow legal pathways here, and the average Joe doesn't do that unassisted.  Follow the money.





I am for the bigger ad and the bigger billboard. If I were her I would seek financial help for the billboard from the pro choice groups.
If this individual seeks to air their dirty laundry my guess is that his shorts have skid marks on them also.

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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 6:44:46 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomImus

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
Apparently, this couple had a rather nasty-breakup. Whatever may have brought them to this, I think the question of whether free speech trumps privacy, is a good one.


I know the Constitution guarantees freedom of speech but I've yet to find the right to privacy guaranteed anywhere in it.


The Right To Privacy

The Constitution does not specifically mention a right to privacy. However, Supreme Court decisions over the years have established that the right to privacy is a basic human right, and as such is protected by virtue of the 9th Amendment. The right to privacy has come to the public's attention via several controversial Supreme Court rulings, including several dealing with contraception (the Griswold and Eisenstadt cases), interracial marriage (the Loving case), and abortion (the well-known Roe v Wade case). In addition, it is said that a right to privacy is inherent in many of the amendments in the Bill of Rights, such as the 3rd, the 4th's search and seizure limits, and the 5th's self-incrimination limit.

You are at least partially right there DomImus. It's more of a Supreme court thing.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to DomImus)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 6:45:06 AM   
thompsonx


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< Message edited by thompsonx -- 6/7/2011 6:49:18 AM >

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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 6:46:07 AM   
EternalHoH


Posts: 791
Joined: 5/30/2010
Status: offline 		He is behaving just like the Westboro creeps, btw, who put free speech ahead of privacy at funerals. Where is the call for vigilantism here, like we always see surrounding Westboro's activities?

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 6:46:55 AM   
Hillwilliam


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Status: offline 		I dunno about a bigger billboard. It's one of those times when you have to ask "Am I willing to stoop to their level?"

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 7:05:49 AM   
cyn32


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam
Billboards are just a few hundred bucks. At least they were last time I looked into getting one.
Also, look at the post above yours. He MIGHT have had financial help. It is a stretch tho.


He has to have some money, he has a lawyer and they dont usually work for free.

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 7:17:04 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline 		Usually, (99.9% of the time) they don't cyn. In this case the notoriety might make one willing to do a bit of politically motivated pro bono work.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 7:23:45 AM   
tj444


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
Apparently, this couple had a rather nasty-breakup. Whatever may have brought them to this, I think the question of whether free speech trumps privacy, is a good one.


If i were her i would want to know who told the guy she was pregnant in the first place. She chose not to tell him for a reason, now obvious to all.

I wonder if its really about the potential baby at all. I dont really see what the purpose of the billboard is, its about 8? months after she miscarried/aborted. Whatever is done, it cant be changed. But he wants revenge, to embarass and harass her still? Whats he gonna do next, I wonder.


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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 7:30:30 AM   
tj444


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
There`s a guy in the next town with a hand painted billboard on his lawn, decrying the court system for taking his kids and making him pay child support.


lol Another winner, brilliant that he is advertising that he is a dead beat dad.
That must really impress his neigbors, and lower real estate values. lol

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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 7:40:40 AM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

...she has no case.


I agree, while offensive, it's protected speech. Her name for one is not on the sign. He's relying on his own fame to identify her.

It's like someone from Scranton making out they're a seafaring type bullshit, but not actionable.

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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 7:43:05 AM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

There`s a guy in the next town with a hand painted billboard on his lawn, decrying the court system for taking his kids and making him pay child support.


lemme guess ... Harley owner

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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 7:56:32 AM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

I know the Constitution guarantees freedom of speech but I've yet to find the right to privacy guaranteed anywhere in it.


No guarantees in the Constitution, however the 1st 3rd, 4th, 5th and to some degree 9th amendments to the Bill of Rights provide protection of privacy. But I'd say that unless her privacy was EXPLICITLY violated, there isn't a case.

(in reply to DomImus)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 8:04:38 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Amazing how many immediately believe the guy is telling the truth about the "abortion".

Better to take a wait and see attitude on this one. If it was a miscarriage, this is completely wrong AND an invasion into her privacy, accusing her of murder to the nation.... a libel case if its known, even just in that town, who the "mother" is that he refers too.

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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 8:05:37 AM   
DomImus


Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomImus

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
Apparently, this couple had a rather nasty-breakup. Whatever may have brought them to this, I think the question of whether free speech trumps privacy, is a good one.


I know the Constitution guarantees freedom of speech but I've yet to find the right to privacy guaranteed anywhere in it.


The Right To Privacy

The Constitution does not specifically mention a right to privacy. However, Supreme Court decisions over the years have established that the right to privacy is a basic human right, and as such is protected by virtue of the 9th Amendment. The right to privacy has come to the public's attention via several controversial Supreme Court rulings, including several dealing with contraception (the Griswold and Eisenstadt cases), interracial marriage (the Loving case), and abortion (the well-known Roe v Wade case). In addition, it is said that a right to privacy is inherent in many of the amendments in the Bill of Rights, such as the 3rd, the 4th's search and seizure limits, and the 5th's self-incrimination limit.

You are at least partially right there DomImus. It's more of a Supreme court thing.


True enough that various courts have interpreted a right to privacy within various amendments. It doesn't appear that any of those decisions involved a direct conflict with the first amendment. I think that one would be tough to sell to The Supremes.

Edited to add: For the record - while I do believe The Constitution backs this guy's right to post that billboard over her right to any privacy in the matter I don't support his actions. I think he needs to get a grip and get with the program. These decisions are the prerogative of the woman. They bear the child - that's the way nature works. He needs to man up, shut up and keep his dick in his pants if he does not like the way nature deals the cards.





< Message edited by DomImus -- 6/7/2011 8:13:56 AM >

_____________________________

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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 8:07:12 AM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		As in, ain't no mountain high enough;
ain't no valley low?

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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 10:02:09 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline 		If there is a chance she could get him on libel, why isn't the lawyer asking her client about it?

"The woman's lawyer said she had not discussed the pregnancy with her client. But for Ellen Jessen, whether her client had a miscarriage or an abortion is not the point. The central issue is her client's privacy and the fact that the billboard has caused severe emotional distress, Jessen said."


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RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 10:06:41 AM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Well, obviously he'll never get a date again.  Idiot.

As I understood it, "privacy" is part of the relationship between an individual and the government, not between private parties.  But the harassment claim is legit, and I'd expect something about being a public nuisance, etc.  Interestingly, because abortion is legal, he is not liable for libel.  If it were illegal, he would be.




Libel would be valid if she miscarried.


From what I saw he never named her. Libel isnt even close to being a winning case if he didnt.

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Free Speech vs. Privacy Rights - 6/7/2011 10:08:40 AM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: EternalHoH

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow

She would have a case if her name was mentioned.  "The Mother" is anonymous statement.




But when his picture is up there, who else fits the role of 'mother'? They don't have to say her name to single her out.



He doesnt necessarily have to single her out, but for her to prove any damages there would have to be a reasonable expectation that she could be identified and that the information actually harmed her. Highly unlikely.


_____________________________

Hear the lark
and harken
to the barking of the dogfox,
gone to ground.

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Profile   Post #: 40
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