RE: No such thing as "no"

RE: No such thing as "no" (Full Version)

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Kana -> RE: No such thing as "no" (6/28/2011 7:44:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Gesh Kana.... chill... I was being a smart ass when I asked! [8D] I was suprised to see someone say they avoided saying it no matter what. Sometimes no is an appropriate response. [:D] It wasn't aimed at just you Tazz-you just happened to ask the question that flicked the switch. I've been mulling this thread( and the previous 10 million that run along similar lines) around for a day or so and found some of the suggestions absurd and non reality based. quote: Kana and Jeff... But you have to figure while you are both very attractive sane members of this world. Yeah, but you know, I always figure that's why she picked me-because I was sane (Note that I make zero claims to being attractive. I try real hard not to lie on the forums :-)) And sure, I know there are chicks(and male subs-let's not forget them) out there who get into bad deals and I hate to sound like a heartless ass but that's on them. We are, theoretically at least, all adults here which means we are all responsible for our own decision making. Get into an unsafe situation with a bad leader, it's on her to do what's right for herself and walk. Now I know that's easier said than done, but heck, people do it all the time, in nilla and kink. In the end, an abusive relationship is an abusive relationship, no matter how one tries to wrap it up and present it and ya know what, you can't play tennis alone. It takes two to tango. And I don't know about anyone else here, but some of the hardest, best and most important life lessons I've learned have come at great cost.

tj444 -> RE: No such thing as "no" (6/28/2011 7:48:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: leadership527 Someone I really respect over at Fet before he bailed once said to me. "He promised to always obey and I promised to never make him say no" The Dom I had was not someone like that, and it was too much for me too fast. I also felt that he did not value all the effort I put in to pleasing him. That is why I have backed off on ever being a 24/7 slave again.

Syrox -> RE: No such thing as "no" (6/28/2011 8:15:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DecadentDesire quote: ORIGINAL: SpiritedRadiance Kana and Jeff... But you have to figure while you are both very attractive sane members of this world. There are men who remove no and make it a huge deal. There are masters who would rather destroy their property then take care of it I know ive seen MORE then my fair share of threads and even met relationships in real life where the Dominant partner doesnt take care, or even consider the S type in the relationship, they ignore their needs, they are down right abusive. I would bet that the reason your submissives stay in your dynamics, is because you arent abusing them. You arent breaking them and you are being the Men you portray yourself as here... I followed my first owner to the ends of the earth and back, and have the scars to prove it. He didnt care about his belonging and it took a lot for me to leave that relationship. Im not stupid or nonsensical or anything other then someone that was deeply devoted and deeply in love with a man who preferred to abuse his partners. I know your response was aimed at Kana and Jeff, but I wanted to throw my two cents in on this. I'm of the opinion that removing "no" in the early stages of a relationship is a red flag. As other people mentioned, it takes years to get to the point with a person where "no" isn't allowed. However, until that point is reached, allowing "no" is a powerful tool in the dominants bag of tricks. Nothing clearly communicates a boundary like directly refusing a command with the word "no". If your goal is to learn and understand a stranger's boundaries and not simply looking for some kind of toy to get off on, then the word "no" is too important to make off limits. Having read that, would you accept the removal of the word "no" if it were replaced by an explanation, i.e. "I would rather not do that because..." therefore training in early that explanation is a good thing and is encouraged?

DecadentDesire -> RE: No such thing as "no" (6/28/2011 8:22:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Syrox Having read that, would you accept the removal of the word "no" if it were replaced by an explanation, i.e. "I would rather not do that because..." therefore training in early that explanation is a good thing and is encouraged? Sure. There is different ways to approach the situation and to be honest, I think the difference is somewhat semantical. Regardless of what tact or style the dominant applies, we are still dealing with the same issue of discovery of boundaries. Based on past mistakes, I've just developed an approach that allows for direct refusal, because by gauging the degree of severity of the refusal, I can tell how strong the boundary is.

DesFIP -> RE: No such thing as "no" (6/28/2011 9:23:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aileen1968 Oh come on now. You know that we're not talking about stuff like that. But if he does tell me to do something that I have no physical reason not to, I better be doing it. Actually, I thought the op was being literal. There are people who are never allowed to say no, even in response to 'do you want pizza". Personally I think dominants who do that are just stupid but they exist. I'm curious if no physical reason not to includes no emotional or mental reason not to. I don't know if you have any triggers or traumas that occasionally flare up, but I do. Additionally he wants me aroused during play, that's a constant. He doesn't want me gritting my teeth to get through it for him. So if for whatever reason that's not going to happen, he'd rather know about it beforehand.

leadership527 -> RE: No such thing as "no" (6/28/2011 8:17:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DecadentDesire Based on past mistakes, I've just developed an approach that allows for direct refusal, because by gauging the degree of severity of the refusal, I can tell how strong the boundary is. chuckles how terribly pragmatic of you. You'll never get approved for your mastercard that way. We have a similar system. Carol, of course, cannot refuse a command. But I actively encourage her to give me open and honest feedback whenever she feels like it. So while she cannot refuse a command she can directly and clearly tell me that she'd like to and how much she'd like to.

DecadentDesire -> RE: No such thing as "no" (6/28/2011 8:30:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: leadership527 You'll never get approved for your mastercard that way. Hey, don't say that. I may have been denied on the first four applications I sent in, but the fifth one is gonna be the winner.

phoenixmoonn13 -> RE: No such thing as "no" (6/29/2011 5:20:44 AM)
i am not allowed to say no but its not so simple and i do say no it jsut depends on what i am saying no to and when. there are times if i want to say no i ahve to phrase it well in a snetence using other words. if he did or sugested somthing i wsnt comfy with and i frooze or got nerrvous eh would know straight away there was an issue nad would discuss it. so in answer ther eis no such thing as no but i can say it i jsutknow when to or not

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