RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor!

RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (Full Version)

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TreasureKY -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 9:58:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady Better yet, why not earmark the money to the local Senior Services so that all those seniors who "lacked self-discipline" and didn't have the ability to make "sufficient" money as laborers (because they lived paycheck to paycheck just meeting living expenses), can benefit from her "oh so wise and wealthy" retirement that doesn't need the money. This way, those Seniors could have money needed for medication, housing, food. Those "silly" things they should have been planning for while they were busting their ass trying to make ends meet. Don't you understand? The money I've contributed over the years has already been spent. It's gone. It is nothing more than a debt on the books at this point. The money I continue to pay in goes the same way. I'm simply not going to ever collect on that debt and ask the next working generation to support me.

defiantbadgirl -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:05:10 PM)
Why aren't any of the politicians talking about ending these free trade deals and bringing decent paying jobs back? Instead they'd rather make cuts that will result in a war between the people and the government. More decent paying jobs means more Americans being able to pay higher taxes and more tax revenue for the government to use to pay off the debt. For some reason they'd rather piss everybody off and create riots.

Marini -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:14:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl Why aren't any of the politicians talking about ending these free trade deals and bringing decent paying jobs back? Instead they'd rather make cuts that will result in a war between the people and the government. More decent paying jobs means more Americans being able to pay higher taxes and more tax revenue for the government to use to pay off the debt. For some reason they'd rather piss everybody off and create riots. I just started a thread about foreign aid, click on the numbers and who gets what. If I start a post tonight about the millions of jobs lost due to outsourcing, and the names of the companies that make the most profits and how they treat they workers, and the amount of profit they are making {on the backs of the unemployed here in America}, you might become so depressed it would be dangerous. Will create the post in the future.

Owner59 -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:16:16 PM)
"ask the next working generation to support me" That`s exactly what is going to happen if your money runs out before you do? What are you going to do if that happens,refuse help? Go hungry? Live under a bridge?Sleep on a friend`s couch until you expire? Say you`re lucky enough not to have most of your money spent,swindled or stolen by the time you lose your health,what about the hardworking World War II generation elderly who aren`t so lucky? What should we do,not support them out of principal? What the GOP are trying to do and have always tried to do historically,is to destroy the thin safety net we have.

popeye1250 -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:17:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: imperatrixx Yeah it's so weird, whenever you try to argue for any social justice issues in the US on these boards, you usually get the same response. I don't care. I don't want that. I do this, therefore everyone should. Is there some sort of GOP training program that teaches you "yes, you really are the center of the world, and everything that doesn't benefit you is worthless"? More like a Dem training program. Have you noticed for the past few decades that some in our govt. wanted us to be the "world leader" (Hillary Clinton still does!) and get involved in wars and provide for third world countries to the tune of $trillions of dollars? When asked why the U.S. was getting involved in Libya her reply was; "Because we have a "unique" capability!" Yeah, that's the problem, military expenditures dwarf all others and have bankrupted us! And look at that fat drunken clown Ted Kennedy and all the taxpayer money he pissed away on foreign allotments over the decades! And yes, Bush 43 pissed a whole bunch of our money away in Iraq and Afganistan and the last I checked the News wires they're still looking for the $20B that has somehow "dissapeared" in Iraq. If we hadn't tried to be "world leader" we wouldn't be having this conversation would we? We wouldn't be in this mess! People would have pensions, there'd be plenty of money for Social Security and 9/11 probably wouldn't have happened. There's an old saying that we all learn from our childhood; "Mind your own business!" And that goes for countries too!

playfulotter -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:22:53 PM)
What she is saying is just that she isn't depending on it...she doesn't have to due to her circumstances but many do and they are the ones going to be in a world of trouble....Save for your retirement and don't expect to get Social Security is what everyone should be doing..hey if you get it you will be that much better off.....enough said.

Marini -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:25:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic What was the average life expectancy when the program was created, and when the age was set at 65? Great point Rich, in the article it explains that the age to recieve social security SHOULD be raised, but gradually!!!! This copied and pasted from the article: " "Modernizing the Retirement Age. When Social Security was enacted, the average life expectancy for men in America was 60 years; for women it was 64. Today, average life expectancy has increased to 75 years for men and 80 years for women. Life expectancies are expected to continue lengthening throughout the century. Given these facts, and the choice among many Americans to work additional years, this proposal extends the gradual increase in the retirement age, from 65 to 67, occurring under existing policies, and speeds it up by 1 year. Once the current-law retirement age reaches 67 in 2026, this proposal continues its progression in line with expected increases in life expectancy. This will have the effect of increasing the retirement age by 1 month every 2 years. The retirement age will gradually increase until it reaches 70 in the next century." from the article "Class Warfare Fix for Social Security" by Andrew Leonard. The age should be raised GRADUALLY, by 1 month every 2 years, and the retirement age will gradually increase to 70.

domiguy -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:33:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TreasureKY quote: ORIGINAL: Marini quote: ORIGINAL: domiguy quote: ORIGINAL: TreasureKY For me, I could care less if I ever receive Social Security. I pay plenty into it, and have done so for over 33 years, but I honestly have never believed it will be around by the time I'm old enough to collect anyway. I've never planned on it, and have never wanted to rely on it. It wasn't ever meant to be anything but a supplement program anyway. then to what charity will you be donating your check? This is more ill conceived utter bullshit and nonsense. your check should be in the vicinity of $20,000 or more annually. I am sure that it has never been a concern. What a dishonest thing to say. ALL the people that say they don't WANT or NEED social security, should send the money back, and help decrease the deficit. Let's hold our breaths, while all the wealthy people donate their monthly checks to help reduce the deficit. Treasure, why dedicate it to charity? Why not use the money to help reduce the deficit? Stop and think for a minute, please. There's no need for me to do anything. The money I've contributed in the past has already been spent by the government. The money I pay in now and the future is currently being used to care for those who collect payments right now. If I never apply to receive benefits, then the charity is that those contributions made by those younger than me can go towards others who need it. You stop and think for a minute, you grandstanding windbag! You ARE going to get a check if you live long enough!!! Got it, sweetpants? What we are asking you is, when you get it will you be donating it to charity or sending it back? Think for a minute and then answer the question! Damn, talk about being obtuse.

playfulotter -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:35:36 PM)
Well I bet she doesn't donate it to charity..but she is right about the major tenants of what might happen! You always have to be so negative Domiguy....

Marini -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:36:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl Why aren't any of the politicians talking about ending these free trade deals and bringing decent paying jobs back? Instead they'd rather make cuts that will result in a war between the people and the government. More decent paying jobs means more Americans being able to pay higher taxes and more tax revenue for the government to use to pay off the debt. For some reason they'd rather piss everybody off and create riots. SSHHH DBG, we don't often talk about the almost 1 million jobs LOST when we signed NAFTA!!! US lost 700000 jobs with NAFTA

Termyn8or -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:38:13 PM)
"What we are asking you is, when you get it will you be donating it to charity or sending it back? " Where the fuck do you get "we" ? T^T

domiguy -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:44:37 PM)
marini asked a similar question, thus "we." Got it, sunshine? Don't make me come over there and trip on your garbage.

domiguy -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 10:49:54 PM)
Look social security is broke, but rest assured treasure will get her check. This is one thing that will not be allowed to be swallowed up or done away when hard decisions have to be made. maybe she won't get all that was promised, or maybe it will be taxed at a higher rate or maybe she will have to wait a bit longer to receive those checks, but they are coming.

Owner59 -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/24/2011 11:09:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: playfulotter What she is saying is just that she isn't depending on it...she doesn't have to due to her circumstances but many do and they are the ones going to be in a world of trouble....Save for your retirement and don't expect to get Social Security is what everyone should be doing..hey if you get it you will be that much better off.....enough said. It doesn`t matter how much money you have,an illness can bankrupt ANYONE.Unless of course you have a string of hospitals or nursing homes,then you`re get`n payed. We have, over a number of centuries decided that letting folks languish on the road-side, who can no longer care for themselves is not moral. If at some point treasure (or anyone who`s out of luck) needs help,by default,the (only) ones who can help care for her will be the able bodied.That`s the social bargain we`ve grown into. Part of the state taxes most people pay go to Medicaid and to hospitals,to compensate them for free care they give.We still don`t ask for insurance or money-up-front when you`re having a heart-attack.........yet.[:D] And after the conservatives put us in this mess in the 1st place, we now all have to suffer losing part or all of the safety net?

willbeurdaddy -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/25/2011 1:12:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Marini This may be breaking news for some, but the average life span for BLACK Americans, these days is 67. 67 is the average life expectancy for ALL BLACK AMERICANS, regardless of their social class. This is extremely deceptive. The primary reasons for the difference is the much higher murder rate for blacks and smoking by blacks. When discussing SS much more relevant statistics are life expectancy for those that reach age 65 and 75, where there are only minor differences.

EternalHoH -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/25/2011 4:52:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TreasureKY For me, I couldn't care less if I ever receive Social Security. I pay plenty into it, and have done so for over 33 years, but I honestly have never believed it will be around by the time I'm old enough to collect anyway. I've never planned on it, and have never wanted to rely on it. It wasn't ever meant to be anything but a supplement program anyway. And in all honesty, SS is not bankrupting the nation. Medicare is. Unless you have bankrolled enough to buy private health insurance until you die (provided you are not cut off as being "too expensive to insure" by the insurance cos), your opportunity to sponge off the government dole is still forthcoming. Lets not crow too soon now.

FirmhandKY -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/25/2011 5:18:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: domiguy Look social security is broke, but rest assured treasure will get her check. This is one thing that will not be allowed to be swallowed up or done away when hard decisions have to be made. maybe she won't get all that was promised, or maybe it will be taxed at a higher rate or maybe she will have to wait a bit longer to receive those checks, but they are coming. You admit that SS is broke, yet claim to have knowledge that she will "get her check" anyway. How do you "know" this? And why has the government the ability to change the terms of the "agreement" about SS? If someone was told for 33 years that if they put "x" into the system, at a certain date they would receive "y", then why is this ok with you? Firm

farglebargle -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/25/2011 5:24:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TreasureKY quote: ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady Better yet, why not earmark the money to the local Senior Services so that all those seniors who "lacked self-discipline" and didn't have the ability to make "sufficient" money as laborers (because they lived paycheck to paycheck just meeting living expenses), can benefit from her "oh so wise and wealthy" retirement that doesn't need the money. This way, those Seniors could have money needed for medication, housing, food. Those "silly" things they should have been planning for while they were busting their ass trying to make ends meet. Don't you understand? The money I've contributed over the years has already been spent. It's gone. It is nothing more than a debt on the books at this point. The money I continue to pay in goes the same way. I'm simply not going to ever collect on that debt and ask the next working generation to support me. You do realize that the Social Security trust is solvent for the next 20 years currently, and by removing the cap on contributions, solvent forever?

FirmhandKY -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/25/2011 5:30:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle You do realize that the Social Security trust is solvent for the next 20 years currently, and by removing the cap on contributions, solvent forever? That may be true ... theoretically. In reality, all the "trust fund" money has been loaned to the Federal Government for other expenses ... and spent. The SS "trust fund" has pretty much nothing but IOUs and the monthly income which is redistributed each month for current payments. In other words, your "solvent" SS is a fiction. Firm

farglebargle -> RE: Raising the age for Social Security? More Class Warfare against poor! (7/25/2011 5:38:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle You do realize that the Social Security trust is solvent for the next 20 years currently, and by removing the cap on contributions, solvent forever? That may be true ... theoretically. In reality, all the "trust fund" money has been loaned to the Federal Government for other expenses ... and spent. The SS "trust fund" has pretty much nothing but IOUs and the monthly income which is redistributed each month for current payments. In other words, your "solvent" SS is a fiction. Firm We call those IOU's "Treasury Bills" or "Treasury Notes" and they're backed by the Full Faith and Credit of the United States. As long as the US pays its debts on time, there's nothing to worry about. Oh, yeah. Boehner's holding the Full Faith and Credit of the United States hostage...

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