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Masochist Dom/me? - 5/18/2006 9:03:52 PM   
losttreasure


Posts: 875
Joined: 12/17/2005
Status: offline 		During a discussion with FirmhandyKY today, an odd question occurred to me... are there Dominants who are masochists?  As it is generally accepted, sado/masochistic proclivities are a separate phenomenon from that of dominant/submissive tendencies; yet it appears that among those dominants who profess leanings one way or another, it tends to always be toward the sadistic side.

While our own suppositions were thought provoking, we felt it might be interesting to see if anyone else might be able to shed some light, or at least provide addition input.  FirmhandKY mused that perhaps dominants who are masochistic, may in fact be switches.  Thoughts?

On a personal note, our thanks to Gooddogbenji for being the catalyst for this post.  

~*~

LostTreasure
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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/18/2006 9:11:04 PM   
LadyHugs


Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Dear losttreasure, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
I do identify as a Sadist.  My early days I was subjected to masochism.
However in the capacity as dominant, I have not 'switched' to receive masochism, unless taking care of a parent that can't stop talking, bitching, forever needy, complaining and would most likely be considered inhumane treatment if loaned to the CIA for torture tools count.
 
Respectfully submitted,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to losttreasure)
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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/18/2006 9:45:33 PM   
ZenDragoness


Posts: 372
Joined: 1/21/2006
From: Berlin/Germany
Status: offline 		Good Morning losttreasure,

I am a Sadist and and a Masochist. For me go both hand in hand. I am also a switch, and there is passive pain i get, when submitting which is on the one hand the most difficult (a controlfreak letting control go) but although the spaciest time for me (i lay resposibility on another human being). And there is active pain, when i fight with a partner and each of us is trying to win. Actice pain is a whole different experience. I learned, that my beloved (onesider dominant sadist), thrives on active pain when we fight, my resistance and the kicks, bites or whatever he get in the procress are good for him, much like KnightofMists explained, some threads ago; passive pain on the other hand is not possible for him, because he is only a sadist and dominant.

Problems arise with him, when i due to whatever reason can not switch to the passive mindset, because even without words, i try to direct the kind of places and kind of pain i get and than he gets dominantly royally unnerved by my behaviour.

 Because i am the same, when dominating, i can understand him and we start par example playing backgammon or go for a walk:

Hope this helps and i could make myself understandable in my second language.

ZD

< Message edited by ZenDragoness -- 5/18/2006 9:48:07 PM >

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/18/2006 9:46:50 PM   
ZenDragoness


Posts: 372
Joined: 1/21/2006
From: Berlin/Germany
Status: offline 		OT

Dear Lady Hugs,

my heartfelt sympathy parentwise. I had for a very long time a parent like this.

ZD

Edited as above due to spelling errors and i am sure, i make a lot of grammatical errors, i can not even identify.


< Message edited by ZenDragoness -- 5/18/2006 9:50:00 PM >

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/18/2006 10:36:59 PM   
Slipstreme


Posts: 817
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

are there Dominants who are masochists


I am a Dominant SadoMasochist with a strong leaning to the masochistic side at least in some respects (especially flogging), although this may change if I get to experiment with more masochistic people.

It was actually my early belief that the fact that I craved the pleasure inflicted through pain that I was a switch. Recent growth and knowledge into the separation between sadomasochism and Dominance/submission has proven otherwise. I am not submissive in any way. Yes there is some times I have to shove my own desire for dominance and control to recieve pain, which is often a battle for me, because I don't like the fact I have to temporarily give up control. But at the same time, I can't really whip myself well enough on my own.

< Message edited by Slipstreme -- 5/18/2006 10:40:38 PM >

_____________________________

Living the Dichotomy

Painslut? How about "Endorphin Junkie"?

For information about "the furry thing" please check out my profile journal entry for: 1/17/2006

Alpha of a leather family of four. Master to the slave z.

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/18/2006 10:56:20 PM   
HarryVanWinkle


Posts: 1720
Joined: 5/8/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: losttreasure

During a discussion with FirmhandyKY today, an odd question occurred to me... are there Dominants who are masochists?  As it is generally accepted, sado/masochistic proclivities are a separate phenomenon from that of dominant/submissive tendencies; yet it appears that among those dominants who profess leanings one way or another, it tends to always be toward the sadistic side.

While our own suppositions were thought provoking, we felt it might be interesting to see if anyone else might be able to shed some light, or at least provide addition input.  FirmhandKY mused that perhaps dominants who are masochistic, may in fact be switches.  Thoughts?

On a personal note, our thanks to Gooddogbenji for being the catalyst for this post.  

~*~

LostTreasure



There are dominant masochists, submissive sadists (where's Celeste?) and every other variation you can imagine.  And probably more than a few that you can't.

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/18/2006 11:06:21 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline 		::waves at Harry:: Here I am!  

S/m switch, full bodied slave and I know a lot of S/m switch full bodied Dominants to boot.

Celeste

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Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/18/2006 11:08:29 PM   
becca333


Posts: 1050
Joined: 4/11/2006
Status: offline 		Ah, the endless variety!

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/18/2006 11:13:44 PM   
LadyHugs


Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Dear ZenDragoness, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
As to Alzheimer's -- I am learning to be a better sadist watching how my surviving parent 'works' per se.   Oh my--poor masochists will have a new level of misery. [Chuckles]
 
Still think the CIA should have used my mother in searching for terrorist... She would talk to those terrorists and drive 'em batty and plead her go and give up the terrorists. [Chuckles]
 
Submitted with humor,
Lady Hugs

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 5:41:47 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		Remember that S&M orientation is completely dependent from D/s orientation.  Many Ds relationships have NO S&M as part of them, many dominants are masochists, many submissives are sadists.

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Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 6:43:00 AM   
MsSonnetMarwood


Posts: 1898
Joined: 2/10/2005
From: Eastern Shore, Maryland
Status: offline 		Reminds me of a rather hot scene I saw at a club once....a submissive was spanking her Mistress.   After each spank, she asked "Thank you Ma'am, would you like another?"

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Deja Moo: The feeling you've heard this bull somewhere before.

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 9:04:22 AM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline 		Ok, So ... how does a dominant reconcil their desire for pain inflicted upon them, with what I consider a dominant's inherent basic characteristic - that of having and maintaining control?

It seems to me to be a receipe for internal conflict.  How does such a person label themselves, or explain themselves?

I can see a sub talking to such a potential dom: "And you want me to ... do what?!" [sub runs].

Intellectually, I can see and agree that D/s orientation and S&M orientation can be different - but emotionally, I'm not sure how a masochist dom/me can really be classified as anything other than a "switch".  Not that I've got a real good handle on what a "switch" is, but it just seems to me, if I were wired as a masochist dom, that I'd say something like "I'm a dominant switch.  I've a strong streak of the desire for control, but do like an occasional flogging."

I've read several threads about submissives who had "doms" or even "masters", who ended up turning the relationship around 180 degrees.  My initial conclusion has always been a dom or master who was deceptive, but perhaps it wasn't that (or not totally that, anyway).

Perhaps this thread should be in the "Ask a Switch" category?

FHky


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Some people are just idiots.

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 9:11:15 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
Ok, So ... how does a dominant reconcil their desire for pain inflicted upon them, with what I consider a dominant's inherent basic characteristic - that of having and maintaining control?

For me it's about maintaining authority.

The dom can either find someone else to top them, or order their slave to do what they want to them.

It's not about actions- a dom isn't being submissive because he's letting his slave give him a great blow job any more than when he's letting his slave give him a great flogging. 

It's about authority- who decides what's going on.
quote:


It seems to me to be a receipe for internal conflict.  How does such a person label themselves, or explain themselves?

However they want.  As do we all.
quote:


I can see a sub talking to such a potential dom: "And you want me to ... do what?!" [sub runs].

Sure, plenty of subs do.   Some won't.  So?

quote:

 Perhaps this thread should be in the "Ask a Switch" category?

FHky

Fraid not.  They aren't S&M switches unless they are sadists AND masochists. And being an S&M switch isn't the same as being a D/s switch. 

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 9:35:34 AM   
HarryVanWinkle


Posts: 1720
Joined: 5/8/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
Ok, So ... how does a dominant reconcil their desire for pain inflicted upon them, with what I consider a dominant's inherent basic characteristic - that of having and maintaining control?

For me it's about maintaining authority.

The dom can either find someone else to top them, or order their slave to do what they want to them.

It's not about actions- a dom isn't being submissive because he's letting his slave give him a great blow job any more than when he's letting his slave give him a great flogging. 

It's about authority- who decides what's going on.
quote:


It seems to me to be a receipe for internal conflict.  How does such a person label themselves, or explain themselves?

However they want.  As do we all.
quote:


I can see a sub talking to such a potential dom: "And you want me to ... do what?!" [sub runs].

Sure, plenty of subs do.   Some won't.  So?

quote:

 Perhaps this thread should be in the "Ask a Switch" category?

FHky

Fraid not.  They aren't S&M switches unless they are sadists AND masochists. And being an S&M switch isn't the same as being a D/s switch. 


I was going to answer this post in some detail, but then I saw that, as frequently happens, LA had already said everything I was going to say, only in considerably fewer word.

What I do find amazing is how on websites such as this people tend to use the word "switch" like people forty years ago used the word "queer," as if those described by it are somehow shameful and dirty.  On the other hand, in the real life groups with which I'm familiar a very large percentage, if not an outright majority, of the membership define themselves as some variation of "switch." 

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 10:27:14 AM   
Slipstreme


Posts: 817
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

It seems to me to be a receipe for internal conflict.  How does such a person label themselves, or explain themselves?



I am an S&M switch only. I do both sadism and masochism, with a strong masochistic leaning.

However as a Dominant, it is a hard internal conflict for me to handle because there is that voice inside that keeps saying "You shouldn't be doing this...... You're giving up control....."  but at the same time you have the masochist inside going "Beat me, flog me, hurt me dammit! Shove it and do it!" It usually comes down to giving up and giving into one of the two sides. Recently I've been avoiding masochistic play because of the voice inside talking about control, that and I have a lot of work to get done for a trip up north. I have found though, that the point where I can really give up control and let myself ride masochism to its fullest, usually happens mid scene, not before, because there is always still that initial contempt of doing it in the first place.

The people I bottom to, usually friends of mine, know full well that the depth of my "submission" goes as far as scene and scene only. I'm in it for the pain, nothing more, nothing less. 

Again, my initial reason for deciding that I was a switch was because I didn't know the separation between S&M and D/s when I first joined collarme.

_____________________________

Living the Dichotomy

Painslut? How about "Endorphin Junkie"?

For information about "the furry thing" please check out my profile journal entry for: 1/17/2006

Alpha of a leather family of four. Master to the slave z.

(in reply to HarryVanWinkle)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 10:34:59 AM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
Ok, So ... how does a dominant reconcil their desire for pain inflicted upon them, with what I consider a dominant's inherent basic characteristic - that of having and maintaining control?

For me it's about maintaining authority.

The dom can either find someone else to top them, or order their slave to do what they want to them.

It's not about actions- a dom isn't being submissive because he's letting his slave give him a great blow job any more than when he's letting his slave give him a great flogging. 

It's about authority- who decides what's going on.
quote:


It seems to me to be a receipe for internal conflict.  How does such a person label themselves, or explain themselves?

However they want.  As do we all.
quote:


I can see a sub talking to such a potential dom: "And you want me to ... do what?!" [sub runs].

Sure, plenty of subs do.   Some won't.  So?

quote:

 Perhaps this thread should be in the "Ask a Switch" category?

FHky

Fraid not.  They aren't S&M switches unless they are sadists AND masochists. And being an S&M switch isn't the same as being a D/s switch. 


This grasshopper bows before the great and illustrious Albatross [bows down]

Authority vs control.  Great distinction.  Truly, the only thing an individual can "control" is themselves.  Having authority over another, however, is a whole 'nother kettle of fish.

Thank you, LA.  It's a distinction that I've operated on, but never actually verbalized in this context.

FHky


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Some people are just idiots.

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 5:07:55 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

Ok, So ... how does a dominant reconcil their desire for pain inflicted upon them, with what I consider a dominant's inherent basic characteristic - that of having and maintaining control?

The dominant likes being spanked. The dominant has someone spank them. They are still in control. Not much different than having someone rub your neck.

It seems to me to be a receipe for internal conflict.  How does such a person label themselves, or explain themselves?

I can only speak for myself, I'm a dominant that enjoys bottoming at times; a switch. Internal conflict only arises if one is not certain of what they are.

I can see a sub talking to such a potential dom: "And you want me to ... do what?!" [sub runs].

LOL Kentucky... often true. Personally, I would never allow a submissive to top me. I'd go elsewhere for that, if at all. And by the way, I'm not a masochist.
quote]

< Message edited by Level -- 5/19/2006 5:09:16 PM >

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 5:58:17 PM   
ZenDragoness


Posts: 372
Joined: 1/21/2006
From: Berlin/Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HarryVanWinkle


What I do find amazing is how on websites such as this people tend to use the word "switch" like people forty years ago used the word "queer," as if those described by it are somehow shameful and dirty.  On the other hand, in the real life groups with which I'm familiar a very large percentage, if not an outright majority, of the membership define themselves as some variation of "switch." 


Harry, thank you very much for your words. I had the same experience with your words, as you had with LA*s.

ZD

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Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 6:23:47 PM   
losttreasure


Posts: 875
Joined: 12/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HarryVanWinkle

What I do find amazing is how on websites such as this people tend to use the word "switch" like people forty years ago used the word "queer," as if those described by it are somehow shameful and dirty.  


Please don't misunderstand, HVW.  Switch is being used here as someone who sometimes is dominant, and sometimes submissive.  No denegration is intended whatsoever.  I'm just guessing here, of course, but I would think that perhaps those who are strictly dominant have more of a hard time understanding switches than those who are strictly submissive. 

From what I understand, dominants are typically dominant in all aspects of their lives, never having the need to be submissive with regard to anything.  Submissives, however, often have to live a "dual life", being more dominant in their behavior in the "vanilla" world, and only being submissive when it is safe for them to do so.  Perhaps that gives submissives a keener understanding of how it can be possible to possess two diametrically opposed mindsets.

< Message edited by losttreasure -- 5/19/2006 6:26:13 PM >

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RE: Masochist Dom/me? - 5/19/2006 7:36:58 PM   
beenwhipped


Posts: 191
Joined: 5/14/2006
Status: offline 		i started to skip over this thread, but it has been quite informative. I had my first masochistic encounter less than a month ago, and throughly enjoyed it. since that time i have logged quite a few hours looking for the why, how, and when can i do it again. upon joining this site i began to understand that Ds and SM where seperate entities and it took this thread to realy hammer that fact home. I knew that i was a masochist as soon as the whip crossed my back, and i thought i was a sub. this thread has made me question that. i am not giving up on the idea of atleast experimenting as a sub, but i believe that particular couriosity in me has been turned down a bit

thats all i got. not informative at all, but i felt like i should say something considering what i learned here

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