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Submitting to Religion - 7/31/2011 3:53:56 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline 		Consider the following Douglas Adams quote:
Religion…has certain ideas at the heart of it which we call sacred or holy or whatever. That’s an idea we’re so familiar with, whether we subscribe to it or not, that it’s kind of odd to think what it actually means, because really what it means is ‘Here is an idea or a notion that you’re not allowed to say anything bad about; you’re just not. Why not? — because you’re not!


This would imply that o be religious, one must submit to the religion, or at the very least, it's dogma. Thoughts?

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 7/31/2011 3:59:33 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		God is my ultimate Dom.
I submit to God just as I submit to my Dom.

When I agreed to be one of God's "servants" I agreed to obey him, his "dogma", his "law".

If I didn't agree with to this I would no longer be his servant.

Kinda like my relationship with Master...I can either agree to obey or leave.
God has the same rule..don't want to submit and obey? Fine. No one is forcing you to stay.

Then again I don't have that view that you can't say anything bad at all. There are times I have bad things to say...about both God and Master. But ya know, then something happens in my life that makes me realize how wrong I was...and I picture God all smirking and stuff saying "this is why I have this rule" and me saying "oh yeah..duh".




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RE: Submitting to Religion - 7/31/2011 4:35:42 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline 		Ok, but do you just believe in a god, or do you have a religion as well? This post is more about submission to a religion than a god.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 7/31/2011 7:40:37 PM   
littlewonder


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

Ok, but do you just believe in a god, or do you have a religion as well? This post is more about submission to a religion than a god.


That's a loaded question. I used to submit to the Bretheren church in which I grew up. Did I submit to every single law and rule? I tried my best. Sometimes i failed and when I did I did what I could to fix it and I prayed for forgiveness and mercy.

For the most part I still follow the basic precepts and tenents even though i no longer attend church but I"m seriously thinking of returning now that I've moved and I'm finally getting settled. It's been waaay too long.

So yes I guess you could say I still submit. I do everything in my power to be a good person and a good servant within my religion.

I don't think God asks that much of us and imo it's the least I can do for Him.


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RE: Submitting to Religion - 7/31/2011 8:26:22 PM   
LadyAngelika


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Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline 		Thank you for answering so candidly, littlewonder. I do hope we get other perspectives on this topic.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 7/31/2011 9:22:27 PM   
Tantriqu


Posts: 2026
Joined: 12/29/2006
Status: offline 		I love Douglas Adams, whom I first read several years after leaving church at 13, which is when both my hormones and my atheism began to percolate.
Coincidence? I think not. Chafing under arbitrary millenia-old rules written by cranky old desert dudes was no longer for me, and the inherent racism of religion [my unproveable beliefs are better than yours, nyah nyah], and the realisation that unlike science, religion takes centuries to accept inalienable truths [the persecution of Copernicus] and the sexism of thinking women are the root of damnation ended any idealisation of a paternal godhead. Science welcomes change and new knowledge: religion abhors and aborts it.
Then to read Adams was a revelation! How silly some of our rules are! The airplane that won't take off because it doesn't have enough wet-wipes! That we have inter-galactic travel, but our shoes don't fit! Who's smarter, we, or dolphins who get to swim, eat and fuck all day! Brilliant!
Unlike the bible: isn't it hilarious when god makes Isaac almost kill his own son! or lets us enslave our neighbour's neighbours! or stone a woman to death who wears cotton and wool: not my sense of humour to excuse sociopathic behaviour with 'it's god's will and my right'.

So, submitting to a moody anachronistic phantasm is untenable for me, and atheism is the fastest growing belief system. Thank god.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 7/31/2011 9:32:25 PM   
SimplySubmissive


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Joined: 1/2/2004
Status: offline 		Tantriqu.. stoning is so old testament.. ignore.. follow "new testament"!!!

religion is something i have struggled with for all of my life. I don't think you can pick and chose what parts of the bible to obey.. or beleive.

so then, is it really all or nothing?

there is an inherent goodness.. a basic human morality that has nothing to do with god or religion.

i'm good with that. but not when it conflicts with the bible.. and that is my biggest issue with "religion".

ymmv

SS


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RE: Submitting to Religion - 7/31/2011 10:29:06 PM   
Kirata


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From: USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tantriqu

isn't it hilarious when...

Isn't it hilarious when people elevate their former religion to the position of such a supreme exemplar that if it was crap and nonsense then all religion must be, along with belief in God, and therefore 'nyah nyah' to the whole business.

K.




< Message edited by Kirata -- 7/31/2011 11:05:24 PM >

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 1:40:24 AM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline 		Submitting to religion in one's life is the admittance that one needs religious order in their life, whatever order that may be. I also see submitting to religion as being the need to belong, ( in effect; owned) and negating a person's own freedom of thought. I would also venture the submission to religion as means of giving up on the future development of humanity in favour of the past. Perhaps the responsibility of moving forward is too great to bare, so seeking protection from that responsibilty in the arms of a religion is the path many take.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 1:43:12 AM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tantriqu

isn't it hilarious when...

Isn't it hilarious when people elevate their former religion to the position of such a supreme exemplar that if it was crap and nonsense then all religion must be, along with belief in God, and therefore 'nyah nyah' to the whole business.

K.




You'd rather that they restricted their argument to religions that they've never practised, then?

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 5:22:31 AM   
DomYngBlk


Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

Consider the following Douglas Adams quote:

Religion…has certain ideas at the heart of it which we call sacred or holy or whatever. That’s an idea we’re so familiar with, whether we subscribe to it or not, that it’s kind of odd to think what it actually means, because really what it means is ‘Here is an idea or a notion that you’re not allowed to say anything bad about; you’re just not. Why not? — because you’re not!



This would imply that o be religious, one must submit to the religion, or at the very least, it's dogma. Thoughts?



One would think most Brits since they first must submit to the Monarchy would have no problems with submitting to a religion.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 5:57:35 AM   
Fellow


Posts: 1486
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		I have seen people who literally submit to religion ("accepting Jesus" for example). This aspect of organized religion is perhaps most hated by the atheists. I would argue in sense of wider philosophical world view this is not what religion is about. I am also anti-atheist. I think their world is narrow, building self-imposed constraints. So, submitting to atheism could make the case as well.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 6:00:09 AM   
HannahLynHeather


Posts: 2950
Joined: 4/4/2011
From: where it's at
Status: offline 		how the fuck do you reconcile this
quote:

Tantriqu.. stoning is so old testament.. ignore.. follow "new testament"!!!


with this
quote:

I don't think you can pick and chose what parts of the bible to obey.. or beleive.


what the fucking fuck? and you wonder why i doubt the sanity of a person the moment they espouse a belief in god.

deists are weak minded, cowards who require their delusional invisible, incorporeal floating fire breathing dragon to enable them to face the reality of the world and their own mortality.

and if, on the off chance i'm wrong, and there is a god, well then the asshole-in-the-sky is a cold-hearted, sadistic mass murdering, evil motherfucker and a homicidal maniac. and i wouldn't worship him even if he materialized in front of me.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 8:16:55 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

Consider the following Douglas Adams quote:
Religion…has certain ideas at the heart of it which we call sacred or holy or whatever. That’s an idea we’re so familiar with, whether we subscribe to it or not, that it’s kind of odd to think what it actually means, because really what it means is ‘Here is an idea or a notion that you’re not allowed to say anything bad about; you’re just not. Why not? — because you’re not!


This would imply that o be religious, one must submit to the religion, or at the very least, it's dogma. Thoughts?


I've never had anyone tell me I couldn't say anything bad about religion. In fact our pastor encourages people to ask questions.  What church are you talking about?


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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 8:32:06 AM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather

how the fuck do you reconcile this
quote:

Tantriqu.. stoning is so old testament.. ignore.. follow "new testament"!!!


with this
quote:

I don't think you can pick and chose what parts of the bible to obey.. or beleive.


what the fucking fuck? and you wonder why i doubt the sanity of a person the moment they espouse a belief in god.

deists are weak minded, cowards who require their delusional invisible, incorporeal floating fire breathing dragon to enable them to face the reality of the world and their own mortality.

and if, on the off chance i'm wrong, and there is a god, well then the asshole-in-the-sky is a cold-hearted, sadistic mass murdering, evil motherfucker and a homicidal maniac. and i wouldn't worship him even if he materialized in front of me.


Religious post of the Century! But please dont hold back, tell us what you really feel.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 8:43:05 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

Consider the following Douglas Adams quote:
Religion…has certain ideas at the heart of it which we call sacred or holy or whatever. That’s an idea we’re so familiar with, whether we subscribe to it or not, that it’s kind of odd to think what it actually means, because really what it means is ‘Here is an idea or a notion that you’re not allowed to say anything bad about; you’re just not. Why not? — because you’re not!


This would imply that o be religious, one must submit to the religion, or at the very least, it's dogma. Thoughts?


I've never had anyone tell me I couldn't say anything bad about religion. In fact our pastor encourages people to ask questions.  What church are you talking about?


He's a rarity. better keep him.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 9:42:02 AM   
paulmcuk


Posts: 80
Joined: 4/16/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

This would imply that o be religious, one must submit to the religion, or at the very least, it's dogma. Thoughts?



Of course. Organised religion is all about power - the power to control the masses. And, of course, the wealth that comes from power. Religious leaders throughout history, whether shamen or popes, have enjoyed priviliged status in their societies. Ancient rulers cloaked themselves in religion, even casting themselves as gods in order to enhance their power and validate their rules.

Popes and kings (both claiming to be divinely appointed of course) battled for centuries in Europe over who had the greater power. Even today (in the US at least) politicians compete to have the best religious credentials in order to secure power. And (again in the US) religious leaders still accrue massive wealth through their positions.

And I haven't even started on the recently revived trend for using religion to drum up people willing to kill and die on your behalf.

Religion is a collar around the collective necks of believers by which those with the right charisma can lead them around. What's more submissive than that?

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 11:10:22 AM   
OrionTheWolf


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Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		~FR~

Wonder what other Taoist think of these statements under the term "religion" being used in such a broad sense, but with narrow comments.

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 11:16:06 AM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if-UzXIQ5vw&ob=av2e

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RE: Submitting to Religion - 8/1/2011 3:34:26 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
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quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

~FR~

Wonder what other Taoist think of these statements under the term "religion" being used in such a broad sense, but with narrow comments.


or pagans (since it seems a large portion on cm are such) or buddhists or shintoists or animists or hell...even atheists even though they don't see themselves as a religion lol.


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