"Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law...

"Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (Full Version)

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farglebargle -> "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 7:49:47 AM)
And whenever the crazy religious fundamentalists try to impose their religious law on everyone else, I get concerned. quote: In Mississippi last week, the state Supreme Court rejected a lawsuit to stop a ballot measure (Amendment 26) defining a person as the moment of fertilization. The implications of the ballot measure are that abortion, contraception, in vitro fertilization, and stem cell research could be rendered illegal if the initiative passes. Mississippi’s highest court ruled 7-2 against stopping the initiative and said it did not have the power to review ballot initiatives before the vote takes place. However, in refusing to stop the ballot measure, the court revealed that it will uphold the proposed constitutional amendment when it passes. There is little doubt the ballot initiative will pass because Mississippi has the largest percentage (82%) of Christians in the country. Not surprising is that of 9 justices, 7 profess Christianity as their religion on the MSS official website. http://www.politicususa.com/en/personhood-democracy

tazzygirl -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 8:14:59 AM)
quote: However, in refusing to stop the ballot measure, the court revealed that it will uphold the proposed constitutional amendment when it passes. Im curious as to how their ruling lead to the belief that they would support the measure. Care to expand?

MileHighM -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 8:20:49 AM)
Do you ever post anything that is less than some inflamatory Troll ass shit?

farglebargle -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 8:22:33 AM)
I think the telling part is that 7 of the 9 justices are Christian. Now, that's not saying they're extremists, but shouldn't more of them come down on the side of "Prima-Facie Violation of Federal First Amendment"?

farglebargle -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 8:24:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MileHighM Do you ever post anything that is less than some inflamatory Troll ass shit? It's inflammatory because it's a pretty bald-faced attempt to impose their extremist religious beliefs on everyone else. I'm a Jew. Life begins at the quickening. You don't see ME trying to pass laws to get everyone to go along with that belief, do you?

tazzygirl -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 8:28:05 AM)
I think, from what I read, the were following the letter of the law in that they could not stop the ballot... only how the ballot was presented. The Mississippi Supreme Court on Thursday cleared the way for an amendment to the state constitution granting “personhood” to fetuses to go to voters in November though the court did not render a position on the measure’s constitutionality, should it pass. “Our law provides that this court cannot interfere with the legislative act of the people, just as this court cannot interfere with the attempt of the Legislature to pass a law,” Associate Justice Randy G. Pierce said in the 7-2 majority opinion. Before an election, only the “form” of a citizen-driven constitutional amendment can be challenged, the court said. The “substance” of an amendment, including its constitutionality, can be challenged only after an election, it said, adding, “It is not within the province of this court to render advisory opinions.” http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/sep/8/granting-personhood-to-fetuses-will-be-on-the-ball/

MileHighM -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 8:33:27 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: MileHighM Do you ever post anything that is less than some inflamatory Troll ass shit? It's inflammatory because it's a pretty bald-faced attempt to impose their extremist religious beliefs on everyone else. I'm a Jew. Life begins at the quickening. You don't see ME trying to pass laws to get everyone to go along with that belief, do you? Hey why don't we just go by a scientific definition of life. I am down with that. That will piss off nearly everyone including you. It is inflamatory to compare this to Sharia, because sharia sanctions the beating and raping your wife. At least this is an attempt to protect life, it may be misguided, but good intentioned. Also, they aren't imposing by fiat. they are putting it on the ballot. At the end of the day, the SCOTUS can still execute it for you. So, take toke and xanex and rub one out before you have a stroke.

tolovetolaugh -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 8:57:19 AM)
Ick. Considering the fast growing trend of teenage girls, and women who are not ready who pop out babies and expect the rest of us to take care of them, I think we need to start popping IUD's in teenagers. I also think we should put them in women going on welfare, especially those who already have children they cannot support and for some reason plan on having more. But aren't these the same people who think we shouldn't be taking care of the poor? SO by all means force them to pop them out, so they can have a shitty life where their parents didn't want them, and they can't eat or live right because the same people that forced their birth don't care about them once they are "safe" from being aborted. The idea of religious nuts being in any office scares me, and I am very happy I live far away from Mississippi(who else still does the song in their head to spell this?[:D]).

HeatherMcLeather -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 9:08:02 AM)
quote: who else still does the song in their head to spell this? [sm=hello.gif]

MileHighM -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 9:10:50 AM)
The issue of abortion is so much more a morally complicated an issue than whether or not you support it. I personally feel it should be legal, but what distgusts me is how political it has become. Cramming IUDs in people is no less a violation of their rights than forbidding them to abort a baby. This is so complicated. On the one, hand I love the jokes that claim you should have to get a license to have a kid, but how fundementally wrong is that? This Partisan obfuscation has to stop if we are going to make any sense out of it in the end.

tolovetolaugh -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 9:16:42 AM)
I have worked with several women on welfare, who had children, and wanted more. Some of them purposely got pregnant while ON welfare, and then when the baby popped out just got them covered as well. The whole time the growing family is either still living with the parents, or in a crummy apartment with another family, with the children never dressed right, nor given proper nutrition, and the mom is always going out and spending their welfare money on luxury items and complaining she doesn't have money for school supplies. I also don't believe that a 14 yo can make a well informed decision that is not solely based on emotion to have a child. And mistakes while they will come to be loved, are also so easy to prevent, allowing that same teenager to grow up, go to school, and when ready have a child.. This is where my stance comes from. ETA fixed a typo

farglebargle -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 9:26:27 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MileHighM quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: MileHighM Do you ever post anything that is less than some inflamatory Troll ass shit? It's inflammatory because it's a pretty bald-faced attempt to impose their extremist religious beliefs on everyone else. I'm a Jew. Life begins at the quickening. You don't see ME trying to pass laws to get everyone to go along with that belief, do you? Hey why don't we just go by a scientific definition of life. I am down with that. That will piss off nearly everyone including you. It is inflamatory to compare this to Sharia, because sharia sanctions the beating and raping your wife. At least this is an attempt to protect life, it may be misguided, but good intentioned. Also, they aren't imposing by fiat. they are putting it on the ballot. At the end of the day, the SCOTUS can still execute it for you. So, take toke and xanex and rub one out before you have a stroke. The problem with YOUR definition of this issue, which is really "When do you get a soul?", is that by using your definition, you can't fight cancer.

outhere69 -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 9:58:59 AM)
Are they going to give Social Security cards and benefits to embryos? Will they jail the mother if they have a menstrual period? How are they going to prove there is a conception? The only thing those laws are good for is making election fodder. It's an old technique much loved by Jesse Helms, where you sponsor crazy, unenforceable, and unconstitutional laws just so you can point at the folks who voted against them and go "Look! There goes a baby killer!!!" Likewise, someone who "supports the evil, perfidious Gay Agenda!!!!"

mnottertail -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 10:01:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: outhere69 Are they going to give Social Security cards and benefits to embryos? Will they jail the mother if they have a menstrual period? How are they going to prove there is a conception? The only thing those laws are good for is making election fodder. It's an old technique much loved by Jesse Helms, where you sponsor crazy, unenforceable, and unconstitutional laws just so you can point at the folks who voted against them and go "Look! There goes a baby killer!!!" Likewise, someone who "supports the evil, perfidious Gay Agenda!!!!" They bloody well ought to. (The limey in me) (GAWD. I crack meself oop.)

MileHighM -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 10:10:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: MileHighM quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: MileHighM Do you ever post anything that is less than some inflamatory Troll ass shit? It's inflammatory because it's a pretty bald-faced attempt to impose their extremist religious beliefs on everyone else. I'm a Jew. Life begins at the quickening. You don't see ME trying to pass laws to get everyone to go along with that belief, do you? Hey why don't we just go by a scientific definition of life. I am down with that. That will piss off nearly everyone including you. It is inflamatory to compare this to Sharia, because sharia sanctions the beating and raping your wife. At least this is an attempt to protect life, it may be misguided, but good intentioned. Also, they aren't imposing by fiat. they are putting it on the ballot. At the end of the day, the SCOTUS can still execute it for you. So, take toke and xanex and rub one out before you have a stroke. The problem with YOUR definition of this issue, which is really "When do you get a soul?", is that by using your definition, you can't fight cancer. My definition? Soul? WTF did I say soul? Cancer? you are reaching... You are as bad as the bible thumpers in Mississippi trying to use your own religious hogwash as rational absolute in your arguement. Maybe I should claim you are the sharia idealist of the jewish left.

MileHighM -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 10:16:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tolovetolaugh I have worked with several women on welfare, who had children, and wanted more. Some of them purposely got pregnant while ON welfare, and then when the baby popped out just got them covered as well. The whole time the growing family is either still living with the parents, or in a crummy apartment with another family, with the children never dressed right, nor given proper nutrition, and the mom is always going out and spending their welfare money on luxury items and complaining she doesn't have money for school supplies. I also don't believe that a 14 yo can make a well informed decision that is not solely based on emotion to have a child. And mistakes while they will come to be loved, are also so easy to prevent, allowing that same teenager to grow up, go to school, and when ready have a child.. This is where my stance comes from. ETA fixed a typo I hear you. That is a serious concern considering some women make having welfare babies a means of earning a living. That is more of a question to the welfare state than it is to the morality of forced birth control and legal abortion. True a 14yo can rarely make an informed decision on having a child. However, there are 30yos who are less capable than some teenagers to make that decision. I have a dear friend who had a child at 16. They are doing quite well and that 12 yo is quite well adjusted and never went on welfare. Now, I know that is neither normal nor an exeption. At the end of the day we need a society that places great value on personal responsibility and good parenting. No amount of regulation will ever substitute for those things.

Lucylastic -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 10:25:19 AM)
Popping IUD into teenagers? WTFlaming F? you have to be kidding me, why not just rip them open and cut out their tubes. in my opinion that is far worse than restricting abortion. Yeah thats freeedom and a country I want to live in Freedom for all unless you are poor. then we force things into your cunt at 13....so we dont have to pay for your biology working properly NASTY

tolovetolaugh -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 10:42:17 AM)
Don't worry Lucy, I have no delusions as to how realistic such an approach is, considering the controversy and as is stated human rights violations. But if the pro-lifers can start a movement just as bloody unrealistic and composed of forcing their ideals on others, than dammit I get to keep my picture of what it takes to make an ideal world as well! ETA : You have to admit, to those who argue education is the way- it's not working. My idea would work. [:D]

MileHighM -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 10:56:50 AM)
lol

farglebargle -> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... (9/14/2011 11:01:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MileHighM quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: MileHighM quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: MileHighM Do you ever post anything that is less than some inflamatory Troll ass shit? It's inflammatory because it's a pretty bald-faced attempt to impose their extremist religious beliefs on everyone else. I'm a Jew. Life begins at the quickening. You don't see ME trying to pass laws to get everyone to go along with that belief, do you? Hey why don't we just go by a scientific definition of life. I am down with that. That will piss off nearly everyone including you. It is inflamatory to compare this to Sharia, because sharia sanctions the beating and raping your wife. At least this is an attempt to protect life, it may be misguided, but good intentioned. Also, they aren't imposing by fiat. they are putting it on the ballot. At the end of the day, the SCOTUS can still execute it for you. So, take toke and xanex and rub one out before you have a stroke. The problem with YOUR definition of this issue, which is really "When do you get a soul?", is that by using your definition, you can't fight cancer. My definition? Soul? WTF did I say soul? Cancer? you are reaching... You are as bad as the bible thumpers in Mississippi trying to use your own religious hogwash as rational absolute in your arguement. Maybe I should claim you are the sharia idealist of the jewish left. You might be able to make that claim. IF and only if I was using it to create a law for everyone else to obey Which, of course, I am not.

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