RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped?

RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (Full Version)

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NiceGuyNihilist -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/26/2011 8:08:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer 39% is still a pretty big figure, Arpig - especially given the presumably highly educated nature of the interviewees. TBH, with a new prospective partner, my gut instinct would tell me to stay quiet about any bi fantasies I've had, never mind bi experiences, and I'd absolutely stay quiet about being raped by another man. Me, to be blunt, I expect a certain 'unreconstructedness' amongst women when it comes to their view of men, even if they have the most right-on views about feminism. Sometimes I think women want men to be like rocks to stand on. They'd appreciate their being smoother around the edges, but when all's said and done the last thing they want is for them to move at all. We're supposed to be the devil they know. We shout sometimes, but we don't ever cry. I have the impression (please correct me if I'm wrong) that you are an exclusively submissive man, and that any "new prospective partner" of yours would be a dominant woman. That a submissive man should feel such reticence about disclosing a past rape to a dominant woman is quite telling, assuming your intuition about female nature is right. And I think it probably is. It's a rare woman indeed who wants a fully submissive man, in the way that many dominant men would embrace the chance to protect a truly fragile flower from the buffetings of the world. I'm sure you've come across women whose every word and mannerism seems to say prey. Generally, if these women don't develop a backbone (and I suspect some of them don't have the capacity--go ahead and crucify me), they either end up sheltered and protected by good dominant guys, or abused to shit by bad dominant guys. But a woman who is flotsam on life's river at least has a sporting chance of being picked up by a man who will shelter and cherish rather than abuse her. (Her chances go up along with her beauty, naturally.) A similarly constituted man is pretty well fucked. Women don't like wimps.

dovie -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/26/2011 8:19:37 PM)
What's a Nihilist Nice Guy? dovie

NiceGuyNihilist -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/26/2011 8:22:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dovie What's a Nihilist Nice Guy? dovie Note to self: From now on, only create usernames while sober. ETA: I know I'm a complete dick, but I was feeling nice the night I signed up here. Honest.

LillyBoPeep -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/27/2011 4:40:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer 39% is still a pretty big figure, Arpig - especially given the presumably highly educated nature of the interviewees. TBH, with a new prospective partner, my gut instinct would tell me to stay quiet about any bi fantasies I've had, never mind bi experiences, and I'd absolutely stay quiet about being raped by another man. Me, to be blunt, I expect a certain 'unreconstructedness' amongst women when it comes to their view of men, even if they have the most right-on views about feminism. Sometimes I think women want men to be like rocks to stand on. They'd appreciate their being smoother around the edges, but when all's said and done the last thing they want is for them to move at all. We're supposed to be the devil they know. We shout sometimes, but we don't ever cry. that's an interesting post, Peon, and you're probably right, about some women anyway. as to the OP, if i found out someone had been raped, i'd be very sad. it doesn't change my opinion of a guy if he was beaten up, and if he was raped, i think i would empathize with that, given my own creepy background. something happening against your will is exactly that -- against your will. i wouldn't view someone as being "secretly subby" because of rape. i wouldn't view a Dominant woman who was raped in that way, so why would i view a man that way? my late M cried in front of me at a friend's funeral. he expressed the full range of human emotions, which made me feel like i could relate to him and trust him. he wasn't at all feminine or submissive and i respected every shred of him. i prefer men who can admit to feeling something to the "stoic old-school feel-nothing" types. D/s is about energy and interaction to me, not about things that happened to you, or if you cry or not. =p

DesFIP -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/28/2011 11:22:36 AM)
The most telling comment for me in Peon's post is "with a new partner". I've got to say, if someone revealed all his most intimate secrets on the first date to me, I'd feel he was pretty screwed up. I wouldn't talk about my deepest hurt on a coffee meet, and I wouldn't want some guy to open up to me about it then either. I don't feel it is appropriate to be that revealing to someone you barely know. Too much information, too soon. There's a time and place, but early on isn't it.

Epytropos -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/28/2011 11:29:38 AM)
I'm going to say 39% thinking less of someone for being sexually violated against their will is pretty fucking sufficient to call the human race a cesspool. If 39% of men said they would think less of a woman for being raped 39% of men would be publicly stoned and cast into the wilderness to die.

DesFIP -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/28/2011 5:51:37 PM)
Most people are the same as they were in high school. Poor social skills and no milk of human kindness. I'm encouraged by it being only 39%.

LillyBoPeep -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/29/2011 9:54:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Epytropos I'm going to say 39% thinking less of someone for being sexually violated against their will is pretty fucking sufficient to call the human race a cesspool. If 39% of men said they would think less of a woman for being raped 39% of men would be publicly stoned and cast into the wilderness to die. agreed. [X(]

littlewonder -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/29/2011 10:26:57 AM)
I've had the majority of men I've dated think less of me once I told them I had been raped. It seems once they know this they look at you as a "loose woman". It's unfortunate but a fact of life I've dealt with time and time and time again. For me it seems to be pretty common. You just don't hear about it. It's one of those things that lots think but very few actually proclaim.

NiceGuyNihilist -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/29/2011 10:29:53 AM)
I wonder if Heather's respondents might've responded differently if the interviewer had been male.

PeonForHer -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/29/2011 6:32:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP The most telling comment for me in Peon's post is "with a new partner". I've got to say, if someone revealed all his most intimate secrets on the first date to me, I'd feel he was pretty screwed up. I wouldn't talk about my deepest hurt on a coffee meet, and I wouldn't want some guy to open up to me about it then either. OK - forget the word 'new', then. I'd be the same even with an established partner. So, do you still feel the same about what was the most significant point in my post?

PeonForHer -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/29/2011 6:40:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Epytropos I'm going to say 39% thinking less of someone for being sexually violated against their will is pretty fucking sufficient to call the human race a cesspool. If 39% of men said they would think less of a woman for being raped 39% of men would be publicly stoned and cast into the wilderness to die. Yes, I agree too. Oh dear. This is making the female sex as a whole look quite bad. I can't be reading this right, can I? There must be some way of viewing the matter that demonstrates that it's males at fault that I'm just not seeing.

LadyHibiscus -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/29/2011 6:43:00 PM)
Men look down on women who were raped ALL THE TIME. Why do you think so few are prosecuted? It doesn't matter what the survey says, rape culture is alive and well.

HeatherMcLeather -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/29/2011 7:23:45 PM)
quote: I wonder if Heather's respondents might've responded differently if the interviewer had been male. We will never know. We are NOT going to pay the guys to do it again, sorry, we're just not rich enough to do that for a CM survey, and so far only 1 other person has volunteered to do surveys, and she is a she. <A really hot and yummy one too!>

LillyBoPeep -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/29/2011 7:25:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus Men look down on women who were raped ALL THE TIME. Why do you think so few are prosecuted? It doesn't matter what the survey says, rape culture is alive and well. ann that's quite true really... they do. they trot out all sorts of examples of "see, she deserved it!" to assassinate her character. then we get into the sociological discussion about whether or not your clothes "invite" someone to attack you -- and the victim herself is lost in the discussions of "issues" and the guy generally gets away.

LadyHibiscus -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/30/2011 9:03:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LillyBoPeep quote: ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus Men look down on women who were raped ALL THE TIME. Why do you think so few are prosecuted? It doesn't matter what the survey says, rape culture is alive and well. ann that's quite true really... they do. they trot out all sorts of examples of "see, she deserved it!" to assassinate her character. then we get into the sociological discussion about whether or not your clothes "invite" someone to attack you -- and the victim herself is lost in the discussions of "issues" and the guy generally gets away. That is IF she has the fortitude to even prosecute. I encourage women who have been assaulted to file police reports, and the local scene knows that I am available to drive people to the police to file reports. After that? I don't know if I have what it takes to endure a trial. I don't know any women who were raped---and gosh, I know too many---that actually filed charges.

DesFIP -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/30/2011 12:20:42 PM)
Peon, Do women want men to be rocks? Well, yes and no. It's axiomatic then men marry hoping their wives will never change and women marry hoping to change their partners. At the same time, the half of the human race that goes through major hormonal and emotional changes monthly certainly don't want to have to deal with someone else's hurt feelings at the same time ours are most tender. As far as how to switch it around to be the man's fault, since most men think less of a woman for being raped, you could use that. Obviously all of the above is just my opinion.

LadyHibiscus -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/30/2011 12:44:03 PM)
Regarding rocks: I think that's the box that dominants are stuck in generally. How many times has someone said, "thanks for being my rock, Hib". And I am glad of that, because I do judge myself on how well I take care of my family & friends. Who wants to be a rock all the time, though? I for one would like to have a man that I can rest against for a little while! Because it's fucking tiring being the steadfast one every freakin second! I have always said that you can change your behavior, but you can't change yourself. The slob can learn to be tidy, but the genuinely mean person? Is always going to BE mean, no matter how kindly they learn to act. That's why I mock the notion of "breaking" someone, or making them over into something other. We are who we are, and that can be enhanced, and new skills learned, but the core remains. So, we might have our prejudices and preferences, and they might seem horrible or outlandish, but they ARE a reflection of ourselves.

agirl -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/30/2011 1:54:07 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer Sometimes I think women want men to be like rocks to stand on. They'd appreciate their being smoother around the edges, but when all's said and done the last thing they want is for them to move at all. We're supposed to be the devil they know. We shout sometimes, but we don't ever cry. I do expect M to be my rock because he's responsible for me. I dont expect other men to be rocks though. M has never, ever needed me to be there for him and I've known him for over 10 yrs. No, I don't want M to move.....he IS the devil I know. ( I did see a tear in his eye once........could have been a speck of dust though) agirl

MissToYouRedux -> RE: Would you be less inclined to submit to a man who'd been raped? (9/30/2011 3:31:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer ... Sometimes I think women want men to be like rocks to stand on. They'd appreciate their being smoother around the edges, but when all's said and done the last thing they want is for them to move at all. We're supposed to be the devil they know. We shout sometimes, but we don't ever cry. Really? Personally, I want my men to be open and vulnerable to me, comfortable with telling me absolutely everything and anything without interrogation. Hearing, "I don't why I'm telling you this. I've never told anybody." is absolutely delicious. It's all part of the power exchange.

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