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RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:23:55 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: housesub4you

This is one of the most BS lines the GOP pushes, they state 48% of the population does not pay taxes,.  Plain and complete BS

First the 48% they are talking about pay no Federal Taxes..Why???? because their income falls below the poverty level Bullshit. 50% pay no taxes, only 15% or so are below the poverty level.

But that does not mean they pay NO TAXES as you claim, they pay STATE income taxes, mostly incorrect, but a strawman anyway. Nobody ever said they pay NO taxes. If you want to talk about "fair share" and include all of the other taxes/fees etc then the wealthy are paying nearly 60% of what they make in taxes. You cant have it both ways.

county taxes, and they pay taxes on food, gas, bills, heating and  every other dam thing you can purchase in his country, they pay taxes on their phone bills, internet bills,

SO stop the BS idea they pay NO taxes, the tax rates in this country are at the lowest level for millionairess since 1958, every body else is paying a hell of alot more


Plus the tax increase they are talking about will effect less than 2% of small businesses in this country...here read for your self http://www.cbpp.org/files/8-29-08tax.pdf Its a bullshit statistic, crafted to minimize the contribution of small businesses. The 1.9% includes everyone who makes a few dollars in Amway sales, MLM etc. The vast majority of tax dollars from small businesses come from thousands of professional corporations, LLCs and LLPs. and hire a shitload of support staff.





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Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:32:39 PM   
Aylee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Aylee you do understand that the student has to meet certain criteria to qualify for that Pell Grant...right?


Yes. And that STILL does not make higher education a 'right.'

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RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:35:08 PM   
farglebargle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Aylee you do understand that the student has to meet certain criteria to qualify for that Pell Grant...right?


Yes. And that STILL does not make higher education a 'right.'


No one is saying it's a 'right'. A tax credit to support higher education is a privilege of citizenship ( or acceptable resident status ).

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RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:35:08 PM   
Lucylastic


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On Saturday, the Obama administration unveiled the "Buffett Rule," a proposed tax on millionaires and billionaires named after celebrity investor Warren Buffett, who has long argued that the federal government should demand more of the wealthy. The millionaires tax is certain to become a major point of contention in the 2012 presidential campaign, and Republicans have wasted no time in heaping it with calumnies. Here are the six most popular conservative arguments against a progressive tax code, and why they're wrong:

It's class warfare!
Yeah right. Three decades of laissez-faire economic polices have allowed the rich to double their share of the national income while paying tax rates a fifth lower than before. The result, notes Kevin Drum, was "wage stagnation for everyone else, a massive financial collapse that ravaged the middle class, an enormous deficits that they'll be asked to pay off eventually." If the millionaires tax is the only blowback, the wealthy should count their blessings.

It's a tax on small business
"Don't forget that most small businesses file taxes as individuals," House Budget Committee Chairman Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) said on Fox News Sunday. "So when you are raising top tax rates, you are raising taxes on these job creators." Except when you aren't. ThinkProgress's Pat Garofalo points out that fewer than 2 percent of the nation's small businesses fall into either of the top two tax brackets. Plus, many of the small business filers in the upper brackets are merely investors who have nothing to do with running the business. And if small businesses don't want to pay taxes as individuals, they can file always as corporations.

It reduces incentives to work and invest
Experience shows otherwise. As Nancy Folbre points out over at Economix, "average annual rates of growth in gross domestic product in the high tax era between 1950 and 1980 exceeded those of the last 30 years. Increases in the top tax rate under President Bill Clinton were followed by robust economic expansion."

It's an unstable source of revenue
A recent essay in the Wall Street Journal argued that the high volatility of upper-level income makes it impractical to rely on taxing it. But this concern is vastly overblown and can be easily dealt with by establishing rainy day funds.

It's unfair
In the libertarian view, the rich are entitled to their gains because they worked for them. But this ignores how structural changes in the economy such as globalization, financial deregulation, and the rise of the knowledge-based economy has disproportionately rewarded the wealthy. At the same time, we've failed to reinvest in government programs that once leveled the playing field, such as financing for community colleges and public universities.

The rich will leave the country
Good riddance, writes Don Peck in a recent Atlantic essay on how to save the middle class: "America remains a magnet for talent, for reasons that go beyond the tax code; and by international standards, none of the tax changes recommended here would create an excessive tax burden on high earners. If a few financiers choose to decamp for some small island-state in search of the smallest possible tax bill, we should wish them good luck."
http://motherjones.com/mojo/2011/09/6-dumb-arguments-against-taxing-rich-explained

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Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:35:39 PM   
Aylee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: YSG


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: YSG


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: YSG

I find it funny that the class warfare label is given to rasing taxes on people who can afford it, but not to the GOP cutting Pell Grant funding...


I find it funny that libs think the Federal government should be involved in things like Pell Grants.

I find it funny that you think the average person doesnt have a right to an education


Every State Constitution provides for universal public schooling up to 12th grade. Most places have kindergarten as well.

No. Higher education is NOT a right.

and THAT, children, is why America has fallen behind the rest of the world


Yes. Because slackers like you want college degrees handed out like candy instead of being based on merit.

Does the term "Higher Education Bubble" mean ANYTHING to you?

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Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:36:11 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

Too bad they are not historicallly disproven. Quite the opposite. After all of the Bush tax cuts were in place tax revenues grew until the largely Dem inspired financial crisis hit. Every single tax cut, since Kennedy's at least, has led to more economic activity.


Democrat inspired ... what a load of shit... now you're claiming republican banksters were driven or 'inspired' to create rackets like derivatives and the other bank scams that are at the very heart of the VAST JOB LOSS when the Bush Era came to a crashing halt.



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Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:39:37 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: YSG


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: YSG


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: YSG

I find it funny that the class warfare label is given to rasing taxes on people who can afford it, but not to the GOP cutting Pell Grant funding...


I find it funny that libs think the Federal government should be involved in things like Pell Grants.

I find it funny that you think the average person doesnt have a right to an education


Every State Constitution provides for universal public schooling up to 12th grade. Most places have kindergarten as well.

No. Higher education is NOT a right.

and THAT, children, is why America has fallen behind the rest of the world


America has fallen behind the rest of the world because of bad parenting. Period. You can throw as much money as you want into "infrastucture", grants, curricula etc, and it wont do a fucking thing until parents instill and support educational values in their kids. Kids from families with cultures that have supported education do just fine.

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Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:40:22 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

Every single tax cut, since Kennedy's at least, has led to more economic activity.


The Bush Administration Bled jobs like a cut jugular vein... so much so that the nest the last stimulus act could do was stop SOME OF THE BLLEDING.
The fact is that all your fucking tax cuts are in place and these fucking captains of industry whose ass you kiss so readily are creating no jobs.



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Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:41:03 PM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


America has fallen behind the rest of the world because of bad parenting. Period. You can throw as much money as you want into "infrastucture", grants, curricula etc, and it wont do a fucking thing until parents instill and support educational values in their kids. Kids from families with cultures that have supported education do just fine.

DAMN, now Im agreeing with wilbur.

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Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:41:08 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper

quote:

Too bad they are not historicallly disproven. Quite the opposite. After all of the Bush tax cuts were in place tax revenues grew until the largely Dem inspired financial crisis hit. Every single tax cut, since Kennedy's at least, has led to more economic activity.


Democrat inspired ... what a load of shit... now you're claiming republican banksters were driven or 'inspired' to create rackets like derivatives and the other bank scams that are at the very heart of the VAST JOB LOSS when the Bush Era came to a crashing halt.




"Banksters" is not synonymous with "Republicans". Democrats is vitually synonymous with Fannie Mae. Stick with fishing, economics is way above your sea level.

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Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:49:38 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

America has fallen behind the rest of the world because of bad parenting. Period. You can throw as much money as you want into "infrastucture", grants, curricula etc, and it wont do a fucking thing until parents instill and support educational values in their kids. Kids from families with cultures that have supported education do just fine.


That's wild... probably more kids in this region go to college than any other region of the US and mass in among the highest unemployment states. I probably know about 100 parents right now (conservatively) whom I know well enough to be able to say what they pitch to their kids. And I think I've heard maybe two who don't emphasize education both as a goal and daily practice.
   So I guess your point is it's the parents from your state who are wrecking the post college job market? Good ... Correct it and get back to us with some good news for a change.




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Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:52:56 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper

quote:

America has fallen behind the rest of the world because of bad parenting. Period. You can throw as much money as you want into "infrastucture", grants, curricula etc, and it wont do a fucking thing until parents instill and support educational values in their kids. Kids from families with cultures that have supported education do just fine.


That's wild... probably more kids in this region go to college than any other region of the US and mass in among the highest unemployment states. I probably know about 100 parents right now (conservatively) whom I know well enough to be able to say what they pitch to their kids. And I think I've heard maybe two who don't emphasize education both as a goal and daily practice.
   So I guess your point is it's the parents from your state who are wrecking the post college job market? Good ... Correct it and get back to us with some good news for a change.





Im talking about K-12 (and by extension all of the unqualified students who are wedged into college). Your non sequiter about "post college job market" is in your addled mind, not my post.

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RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:54:13 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

"Banksters" is not synonymous with "Republicans". Democrats is vitually synonymous with Fannie Mae.


BOY, is that ever a matter of opinion.
Most people think that Bankster is definitely synonymous with Republican and their beloved DE-REGULATION. Which never mind being a republican invention, IT'S A CORNER STONE OF THEIR PLATFORM.



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RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 1:57:01 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

He always says that everyone should pay their fair share. That never includes the 50% of the population that pays NO federal income tax. Wouldn't it be fair for everyone to contribute something ?


In order for the 51% of the population, that bottom part you state pays no taxes but holds only 2.5% of the wealth in this country, to meet the increase in taxes for the rich would have to give up 50% of their wealth.

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RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 2:02:16 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper

quote:

"Banksters" is not synonymous with "Republicans".


BOY, is that ever a matter of opinion.






No, its a matter of fact, and the facts don't support your claim. Take a look at where campaign contributions went in 2008...more than half to Democrat candidates. Over the last 12 years campaign contributions and lobbyng expenditures were right about 50/50.

< Message edited by willbeurdaddy -- 9/19/2011 2:03:13 PM >


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RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 2:03:39 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

Im talking about K-12 (and by extension all of the unqualified students who are wedged into college). Your non sequiter about "post college job market" is in your addled mind, not my post.


We all got that you'd apparently realized you'd lost the argument approaching grants and switched to yet another metaphoric cheeseball.... I love your talent for creating the illusion that everyone else is derailing a thread... Virtually ALWAYS after you've dragged it so far afield it's a different topic.
Good work.
  BTW when you dragged it to parenting... I thought it fair to cite my VERY CONTEMPORARY experience in this area (wherein I am raising kids right now) ... if anyone's creating non sequitur here ... it's this constant business of making sure things don't follow.

btw - they taught latin at Portsmouth Abbey... even how to spell it.



< Message edited by SternSkipper -- 9/19/2011 2:04:31 PM >


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Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 2:08:42 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper

quote:

Im talking about K-12 (and by extension all of the unqualified students who are wedged into college). Your non sequiter about "post college job market" is in your addled mind, not my post.


We all got that you'd apparently realized you'd lost the argument approaching grants and switched to yet another metaphoric cheeseball.... I love your talent for creating the illusion that everyone else is derailing a thread... Virtually ALWAYS after you've dragged it so far afield it's a different topic.
Good work.
  BTW when you dragged it to parenting... I thought it fair to cite my VERY CONTEMPORARY experience in this area (wherein I am raising kids right now) ... if anyone's creating non sequitur here ... it's this constant business of making sure things don't follow.

btw - they taught latin at Portsmouth Abbey... even how to spell it.




Your anecdotal experience is great (to the extent that its true), but has nothing to do with the general state of education in the US. Nice try though. And I didnt lose anything. If you dont understand the relationship between Federal grants and ill prepared college students, then maybe your parents should have spent more time with your education.

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Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 2:10:11 PM   
ArizonaBossMan


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It IS class warfare. This is all Dear Leader has... he's given up appealing to the middle. So he's going after his base. Isn't he just like an annoying mosquito with his drivel buzz? Does anybody pay attention to the man/child?

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Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 2:11:33 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

No, its a matter of fact, and the facts don't support your claim. Take a look at where campaign contributions went in 2008...more than half to Democrat candidates. Over the last 12 years campaign contributions and lobbyng expenditures were right about 50/50.


Here's what Wall Street Does ... I mean so you know... they hedge all their bets with campaign contributions to both candidates and when they have projected a winner in their own minds.
   Still doesn't offer a shred of support for your claims about your bankster confederates


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Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Millionaire tax called 'class warfare' but..... - 9/19/2011 2:13:44 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

Does anybody pay attention to the man/child?


Odd how much you can cover up a meaning with a slash vs a hyphen.


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Profile   Post #: 60
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