RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (Full Version)

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SternSkipper -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/20/2011 2:29:45 PM)

quote:

And Tony Villar's broom frantically trying to recapture them.


He saw em first... lets face it both parties have done a better job objectifying them than any of the Doms in this community could have




Aneirin -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/20/2011 4:12:50 PM)

The business world drives the need for the importation of foreign workers, and that, because they will work for less than the average national. You see capitalism is to blame, for profit always has to be made and if goods aren't selling, then that is lay off the workforce and go bust, or use cheap labour and survive.

But we all have an expected standard of living to maintain, our forefathers made that possible, that meaning we expect a minimum wage to service that expected standard of living at least, but what if employers can't or are not prepared to pay for what maintains our expected least standard of living...? But the show must go on to enable profit, so what is the alternative, go bust, use cheap immigrant labour or outsource ?

The business owners here I ask again, what is more important your profit or the employment of your countrymen ?

The bottom line as I see it, is we are fighting a losing battle, our empires have gone overseas, someone else's turn now, and as it it seems, that other else appears to be the far east; China and other emerging nations.

So, what's left, all this talk of rekindling national industry, is it but a pipe dream, and I say that because resources still have to be purchased to create what was created before, unless that is we learn to think outside the box. Remember the thing about resources, the highest bidder usually wins unless protectionism is in place, but protectionism is often a double edged sword, for it can tear an unbearable chunk out of our ass as well ! But as we know the far east has much lower labour rates than much of the west, so higher prices paid to obtain resources is offset by the paid wage, that being the highest bidder still wins and more so, because of the strength of their workforce, they can flood the marketplace, and by the action of flooding, reduce the price demanded, take a loss to gain a market.

As I see it, if there are no jobs to be had, then there is no point importing cheap foreign labour, but if there are jobs to be had and the nationals won't take them through the wage offered, then for business to at least survive, then it is cheap foreign labour, the immigrant, or outsource overseas. You see, the businessman controls all aspects, and many a government are in the pockets of the businessman, so governments do as they are told to satisfy the businessman, for profit is the great motivator.

But a personal idea for us in the declining west to at least survive, is the workers co-operative initiative, the good of the many as opposed to the good of the one, work to make a sustainable living, not a get rich quick scenario and with that, all the people fucked over in the process. Build for the future, so the children do not inherit what we have fucked up, for get rich quick is the mother of all fucked up presents and futures for the majority.

Aye, but that edges on socialism and I know that is anethema to many in the US.




Politesub53 -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/20/2011 4:34:12 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jack45

Whose Country Is It, Anyway?

[quote Politics is one reason. Democrats see illegal aliens and their children as future Democratic voters. Republicans are terrified of being called racists and alienating the ethnic lobbies.




I'm going to agree wholeheartedly with the first part of this. Democrats DO see illegal aliens as potential future voters.

The second part is a bunch of crap.

Republicans see illegal aliens as someone that will work all day for damn near no money and therefore an increase in profit for the agribusiness that pays so much of their campaign expenses.

Combine the 2 and that's why we are in so much trouble. Illegal immigrants were winked at for decades because BOTH sides saw an advantage in looking the other way.


I guess you missed the third part of the post then:


quote:

Crass commercial interest is another reason.

U.S. companies see immigrants, legal or illegal, as an endless source of cheap labor to keep wage costs down. And they are right. But who is looking out for the national interest, for all of the members of the American family, especially the unemployed?




You could import me to show you how to use something as simple as the quote feature. [8D] hey it was just an idea.....lol




willbeurdaddy -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/20/2011 6:09:56 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jack45

Whose Country Is It, Anyway?

quote:

Politics is one reason. Democrats see illegal aliens and their children as future Democratic voters. Republicans are terrified of being called racists and alienating the ethnic lobbies.




I'm going to agree wholeheartedly with the first part of this. Democrats DO see illegal aliens as potential future voters.

The second part is a bunch of crap.

Republicans see illegal aliens as someone that will work all day for damn near no money and therefore an increase in profit for the agribusiness that pays so much of their campaign expenses.

Combine the 2 and that's why we are in so much trouble. Illegal immigrants were winked at for decades because BOTH sides saw an advantage in looking the other way.


I guess you missed the third part of the post then:


quote:

Crass commercial interest is another reason.

U.S. companies see immigrants, legal or illegal, as an endless source of cheap labor to keep wage costs down. And they are right. But who is looking out for the national interest, for all of the members of the American family, especially the unemployed?




You could import me to show you how to use something as simple as the quote feature. [8D] hey it was just an idea.....lol



Hey, just an idea...post something with content once in a while.




SternSkipper -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/20/2011 9:09:07 PM)

quote:

The business world drives the need for the importation of foreign workers, and that, because they will work for less than the average national. You see capitalism is to blame, for profit always has to be made and if goods aren't selling, then that is lay off the workforce and go bust, or use cheap labour and survive.


Separate thing Aneirin we're now talking (WillBe and I) about the parties and how they've been harvesting their votes.
    There are MANY of those imported legit who naturalize




SternSkipper -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/20/2011 9:10:25 PM)

quote:


You could import me to show you how to use something as simple as the quote feature. hey it was just an idea.....lol

Hey, just an idea...post something with content once in a while.


He'd rather hire a republican think tank




slvemike4u -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 5:47:30 AM)

I can't get all worked up over illegals...or foreign born folks who want to come here,whether legally or not....the way I see it it is still better to live in a country that people want to come to.....than to be living in a country where folks risk everything to get the hell out of.




popeye1250 -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 11:26:16 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jack45

Whose Country Is It, Anyway?

quote:

What prevents our politicians from putting Americans first, deporting illegal aliens and suspending the importation of foreign labor until our own workers are back on the job?

Politics is one reason. Democrats see illegal aliens and their children as future Democratic voters. Republicans are terrified of being called racists and alienating the ethnic lobbies.

Crass commercial interest is another reason.

U.S. companies see immigrants, legal or illegal, as an endless source of cheap labor to keep wage costs down. And they are right. But who is looking out for the national interest, for all of the members of the American family, especially the unemployed?





That's what happens when we don't strictly enforce our laws.
As I've said before in here if we tried to import 200,000 lawyers from India to drop the billable hours rate all the lawyers, law firms and legal associations in Washington would put a stop to it the next morning.




Hillwilliam -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 11:27:28 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jack45

Whose Country Is It, Anyway?

quote:

What prevents our politicians from putting Americans first, deporting illegal aliens and suspending the importation of foreign labor until our own workers are back on the job?

Politics is one reason. Democrats see illegal aliens and their children as future Democratic voters. Republicans are terrified of being called racists and alienating the ethnic lobbies.

Crass commercial interest is another reason.

U.S. companies see immigrants, legal or illegal, as an endless source of cheap labor to keep wage costs down. And they are right. But who is looking out for the national interest, for all of the members of the American family, especially the unemployed?





That's what happens when we don't strictly enforce our laws.
As I've said before in here if we tried to import 200,000 lawyers from India to drop the billable hours rate all the lawyers, law firms and legal associations in Washington would put a stop to it the next morning.

Do they even have 200,000 lawyers in India?

By the way pops, I agree there.




popeye1250 -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 11:33:03 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jack45

Whose Country Is It, Anyway?

quote:

What prevents our politicians from putting Americans first, deporting illegal aliens and suspending the importation of foreign labor until our own workers are back on the job?

Politics is one reason. Democrats see illegal aliens and their children as future Democratic voters. Republicans are terrified of being called racists and alienating the ethnic lobbies.

Crass commercial interest is another reason.

U.S. companies see immigrants, legal or illegal, as an endless source of cheap labor to keep wage costs down. And they are right. But who is looking out for the national interest, for all of the members of the American family, especially the unemployed?





That's what happens when we don't strictly enforce our laws.
As I've said before in here if we tried to import 200,000 lawyers from India to drop the billable hours rate all the lawyers, law firms and legal associations in Washington would put a stop to it the next morning.

Do they even have 200,000 lawyers in India?

By the way pops, I agree there.



Hill, yes, lawyers, engineers and doctors (M.D.'s) and others.
My doctor at the V.A. is from India and she said that the uni's there graduate professionals, "by the hundreds of thousands."
You have to figure that India has what, a billion people?




tazzygirl -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 11:51:02 AM)

http://www.thesunnews.com/2010/08/15/1635669/far-from-home.html

In this economy, why are they importing people to do hospitality work?




Politesub53 -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 3:20:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

Hey, just an idea...post something with content once in a while.



What do you suggest ? I have tried asking you for links backing up your sham figures, but to no avail.





tj444 -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 5:08:36 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Hill, yes, lawyers, engineers and doctors (M.D.'s) and others.
My doctor at the V.A. is from India and she said that the uni's there graduate professionals, "by the hundreds of thousands."
You have to figure that India has what, a billion people?

that depends on if the credentials of those lawyers, engineers, doctors, etc is recongnized in the US or not. Many people that were professionals such as that end up driving taxis in the US/west cuz they went to the wrong schools and their training and experience count for squat. They would also have to speak dam good english.




tj444 -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 5:13:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

http://www.thesunnews.com/2010/08/15/1635669/far-from-home.html

In this economy, why are they importing people to do hospitality work?

The answer is in the article itself-
"Even with unemployment above 10 percent in the state, most jobless want year-round employment, not seasonal hospitality jobs, she said.

"Are they taking Americans' jobs? Not if you're thinking of someone who wants to take a job for a livelihood," Kline said. "Could Americans easily do the jobs they do? Yes, but people just don't want to wait tables, or they don't want to clean rooms.""




tazzygirl -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 5:22:22 PM)

Im sorry, dear. I lived in that area. People there are wanting work so badly they are willing to take anything. And waiting tables in MB is rather profitable. Kline is using that as an excuse. These are people who are hired from firms that provide employees at base rate, then charge an amount for room and board... typical housing is 6 people to an apartment, which the firm pays for.

Whats the pay off? The employer gets employees who cant quit until the contract ends. Good way to ensure at least someone to work till teh end of the season, no complaints, no reports.

The emploment agency gets a nice little sum from both ends.

The people of MB looking for such work are screwed. June 2011 unemployment in MB was 10.5%. Maybe you are willing to believe none of those people would have waited tables seasonally.... I know better.




Aneirin -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 5:24:37 PM)

And that is a problem the medical profession say is happening in the UK, the importation of foreign medical staff poses a risk to life and that because no matter what a person's professional creditations say, they are no use to anyone if they fail in basic communication. Language barriers are a real problem, but if cheap or even affordable medical care means these people, then that is the way it will have to be if one wants affordable medical care, bear it or not, because money talks.

As it is, my dentist is from Eastern Europe and though she does try to communicate, the practice employs an interpreter to convey basic information.




Masta808 -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 5:24:56 PM)

This is why we need to outsource. That way Illegal Immigrants or Immigrants in this case no longer come to America to steal American Jobs instead we bring the jobs to them. 




tj444 -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 5:42:10 PM)

I somehow doubt that exchange students are all that the restaurants and hotels hired. Sure there are benefits to hiring exchange students but disadvantages too. But imo, if the businesses got what they needed as empolyees from the local population, then they wouldnt be hiring outside the US in the first place.




tazzygirl -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 5:45:49 PM)

Never heard of kick backs, huh. There is so much beneath that surface. You may want to research that a bit more. If you really care to know instead of assuming.




willbeurdaddy -> RE: Importation Of Foreign Workers Must Halt (9/21/2011 5:47:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

I somehow doubt that exchange students are all that the restaurants and hotels hired. Sure there are benefits to hiring exchange students but disadvantages too. But imo, if the businesses got what they needed as empolyees from the local population, then they wouldnt be hiring outside the US in the first place.


Most of the summer hiring of foreign nationals at the NJ shore resorts, Vegas and Hawaii is not primarily exchange students. They are kids who want to experience the US and work here to pay for their "vacation" and return home at the end of the summer. Ive probably met a dozen or so in LV this summer, ranging from France to Eastern Europe.




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