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RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 12:52:05 PM   
FirstQuaker


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
Curious how there always seems to be some rather contrived but pious and noble reason the EUropeans can point to that justifies them invading and then robbing or enslaving someone in Asia, Africa, or the Americas.

Actually, we've left that to your lot since 1993.



Yes, Libya, Serbia,  Iraq, and Afghanistan are fine examples of this EUropean change in thinking.

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 161
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 12:53:35 PM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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Are you suggesting that you believe that Obama is going to send sufficient troops to nation build in Libya, taz?

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

How many times are you willing to be wrong today, Sanity?


< Message edited by Sanity -- 10/25/2011 12:55:08 PM >

_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 162
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:00:07 PM   
FirstQuaker


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Joined: 3/19/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker


He should have called it "The White Man's Burden."

Curious how there always seems to be some rather contrived but pious and noble reason the EUropeans can point to that justifies them invading and then robbing or enslaving someone in Asia, Africa, or the Americas.

Amazing how the possibility of wealth always fills the mouths of those doing the plundering with noble or religious platitudes and false expressions of brotherly love for the unfortunate victims of these affections.




Like I told you before, take a look at history. No one is guilt free down the ages. From your stance I am guessing you would rather we let Gadaffi kill thousands, as he had promised to do.



That doubtlessly justified the EUropeans flying around the place shooting up several thousand people.

So what is the difference between your jets killing a couple thousand people with airstrikes and KDaffy doing it with rifles? At leat he was not firing rockets off  from ten thousand feet, and hoping for the best.

Maybe the next time the British have riots, or Northern Ireland riots, the Russians or the Chinese should fly around England "protecting civilians" in such a manner.

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 163
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:12:49 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
If you wish to lie and indicate I was pining for Saddam then feel free. I was just pointing out you had swapped like for like.

Thats not accurate, you were an extremely loyal supporter of Saddams bloody regime, the archives here prove that out


Yeah, like Reagan in the Iran-Iraq war, right there we have a picture of the British Special Envoy, Donald Rumsfeld, later our secretary of defense shaking his hand, and telling him how great him and St. Wrinklemeat were gonna get along....
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
And in Iraqs case the coalition shepherded the Iraqi people to the point they were truly self governing


Forced the government and rigged the elections, but who gives a fuck, they are at risk from Iran in ways they never were. I do not see that government holding out.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
In Libyas case weve only introduced chaos, and without a vote its been announced that strict Shariah law shall be enforced


Well when the chaos is real instead of imagined I expect we will hear about it. You may not know...WTF am I talking about, you don't know for example that assassination attempts against Khadfy have been happening internally for about 15 years off and on now. We know who the guys lining up to handle that government are and have known for some time. And oh, they don't need a vote, since thats their constitution anyhow sharia law....what they SAID was, they will remove laws that are not sharia based. You know, like deregulation....

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
The big difference is there was UN support to intervene in Libya but not in Iraq.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Again, thats not accurate - Saddam had multiple UN resolutions against him, and he was in direct violation of the cease fire after his rape of Kuwait




But that is not accurate Sanity, Polite is right, there was no UN support for this.



< Message edited by mnottertail -- 10/25/2011 1:28:08 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 164
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:15:00 PM   
FirstQuaker


Posts: 787
Joined: 3/19/2011
Status: offline 		And as signs of things to come, while the Eygyptians have been seeing a strong Muslim fundementalist element in their political mix since their revolt, Tunisia has had its first elections -Tunisian elections set to empower Islamists. How moderate will they be?

And the Islamic faction appears top have won.

More interesting, an Islamistic ally of the deposed dictator and his group also did surprisingly well -

quote:

A political grouping backed by a London-based millionaire with close ties to Tunisia's ousted dictator made a surprise entrance on the political stage in early election results released Tuesday. Lists of independent candidates grouped under the Popular Petition for Liberty, Justice and Development backed by Hechmi Haamdi, won five out of 39 seats in five domestic polling districts whose provisional tallies were announced by the ISIE electoral body in Tunis.


quote:


"This is the worse surprise of these results. A pro-Ben Ali on the political scene. It is shameful. He will never do anything for Tunisia," Houda Trabelsi of the Magharebia information site told AFP.


Surprise Tunisian poll success for London-based millionaire
It will be interesting to see what else goes on in North Africa, but if the whole strip from Egypt on westward is politically dominated by Muslim conservatives, things will be getting real interesting. There is also talk of these countries joining into a Muslim federation too. Not that I see anything wrong with that but the EUropeans will be having way too much fun in the Mediterranean if that occurs.


(in reply to FirstQuaker)
Profile   Post #: 165
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:15:52 PM   
susie


Posts: 1699
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker


So what is the difference between your jets killing a couple thousand people with airstrikes and KDaffy doing it with rifles? At leat he was not firing rockets off  from ten thousand feet, and hoping for the best.



Who is this KDaffy person? A relative of Daffy Duck maybe.

Anyone that cannot be bothered to make any attempt at spelling someones name correctly should not be taken seriously in anything they say.

(in reply to FirstQuaker)
Profile   Post #: 166
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:20:57 PM   
mnottertail


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
It will be interesting to see what else goes on in North Africa, but if the whole strip from Egypt on westward is politically dominated by Muslim conservatives, things will be getting real interesting. There is also talk of these countries joining into a Muslim federation too. Not that I see anything wrong with that but the EUropeans will be having way too much fun in the Mediterranean if that occurs.


Jesus, how can this be? What were these countries run by for the last 2000 years right up until the US and Russia (and Brits and France and so on) jumped in there and started fucking with them?

Perhaps it was Shinto Radicals!!!!!!!!!!



< Message edited by mnottertail -- 10/25/2011 1:24:01 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to FirstQuaker)
Profile   Post #: 167
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:21:16 PM   
FirstQuaker


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quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker


So what is the difference between your jets killing a couple thousand people with airstrikes and KDaffy doing it with rifles? At leat he was not firing rockets off  from ten thousand feet, and hoping for the best.



Who is this KDaffy person? A relative of Daffy Duck maybe.

Anyone that cannot be bothered to make any attempt at spelling someones name correctly should not be taken seriously in anything they say.



Dunno, my spelling of his name is as good as the five or six different ones the various press reports use on him to spell his name. I cannot properly spell my name with this thing, so you have to suffer with the English translation of it for instance.

Perhaps you can convince the computer world to put Arabic script up as a standard so I can spell KDaffy the Libyan way.

< Message edited by FirstQuaker -- 10/25/2011 1:22:07 PM >

(in reply to susie)
Profile   Post #: 168
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:35:30 PM   
susie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker


So what is the difference between your jets killing a couple thousand people with airstrikes and KDaffy doing it with rifles? At leat he was not firing rockets off  from ten thousand feet, and hoping for the best.



Who is this KDaffy person? A relative of Daffy Duck maybe.

Anyone that cannot be bothered to make any attempt at spelling someones name correctly should not be taken seriously in anything they say.



Dunno, my spelling of his name is as good as the five or six different ones the various press reports use on him to spell his name. I cannot properly spell my name with this thing, so you have to suffer with the English translation of it for instance.

Perhaps you can convince the computer world to put Arabic script up as a standard so I can spell KDaffy the Libyan way.


Then why not just use the accepted spelling of his name GADDAFI that is in general use in the press? Or is that too difficult for you

(in reply to FirstQuaker)
Profile   Post #: 169
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:41:58 PM   
FirstQuaker


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Joined: 3/19/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
It will be interesting to see what else goes on in North Africa, but if the whole strip from Egypt on westward is politically dominated by Muslim conservatives, things will be getting real interesting. There is also talk of these countries joining into a Muslim federation too. Not that I see anything wrong with that but the EUropeans will be having way too much fun in the Mediterranean if that occurs.


Jesus, how can this be? What were these countries run by for the last 2000 years right up until the US and Russia (and Brits and France and so on) jumped in there and started fucking with them?

Perhaps it was Shinto Radicals!!!!!!!!!!




Many of them were republics or part of or tributary too the Roman republic/empire 2000 years ago. I think the Brish were earing blue pain at the time. And nobody form North America or any other part of the Americas need to help them at the time, either, not that the Maya or the Peruvians or any of the other civilizations here would have likely considered such a silly thing. "Lets sail over to Africa and do some regime changes."

(in reply to mnottertail)
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RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:47:53 PM   
FirstQuaker


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quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker


So what is the difference between your jets killing a couple thousand people with airstrikes and KDaffy doing it with rifles? At leat he was not firing rockets off  from ten thousand feet, and hoping for the best.



Who is this KDaffy person? A relative of Daffy Duck maybe.

Anyone that cannot be bothered to make any attempt at spelling someones name correctly should not be taken seriously in anything they say.



Dunno, my spelling of his name is as good as the five or six different ones the various press reports use on him to spell his name. I cannot properly spell my name with this thing, so you have to suffer with the English translation of it for instance.

Perhaps you can convince the computer world to put Arabic script up as a standard so I can spell KDaffy the Libyan way.


Then why not just use the accepted spelling of his name GADDAFI that is in general use in the press? Or is that too difficult for you



Why don't you worry about your own spelling?

And use the proper spelling of his name yourslef since you are such a spelling nazi. -
  مُعَمَّر القَذَّافِي‎



(in reply to susie)
Profile   Post #: 171
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 1:53:28 PM   
mnottertail


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Joined: 11/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
It will be interesting to see what else goes on in North Africa, but if the whole strip from Egypt on westward is politically dominated by Muslim conservatives, things will be getting real interesting. There is also talk of these countries joining into a Muslim federation too. Not that I see anything wrong with that but the EUropeans will be having way too much fun in the Mediterranean if that occurs.


Jesus, how can this be? What were these countries run by for the last 2000 years right up until the US and Russia (and Brits and France and so on) jumped in there and started fucking with them?

Perhaps it was Shinto Radicals!!!!!!!!!!




Many of them were republics or part of or tributary too the Roman republic/empire 2000 years ago. I think the Brish were earing blue pain at the time. And nobody form North America or any other part of the Americas need to help them at the time, either, not that the Maya or the Peruvians or any of the other civilizations here would have likely considered such a silly thing. "Lets sail over to Africa and do some regime changes."




Right. Another one tips over and shorts out into his own tinfoil.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 10/25/2011 1:54:37 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to FirstQuaker)
Profile   Post #: 172
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 2:02:15 PM   
FirstQuaker


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Joined: 3/19/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
It will be interesting to see what else goes on in North Africa, but if the whole strip from Egypt on westward is politically dominated by Muslim conservatives, things will be getting real interesting. There is also talk of these countries joining into a Muslim federation too. Not that I see anything wrong with that but the EUropeans will be having way too much fun in the Mediterranean if that occurs.


Jesus, how can this be? What were these countries run by for the last 2000 years right up until the US and Russia (and Brits and France and so on) jumped in there and started fucking with them?

Perhaps it was Shinto Radicals!!!!!!!!!!




Many of them were republics or part of or tributary too the Roman republic/empire 2000 years ago. I think the Brish were earing blue pain at the time. And nobody form North America or any other part of the Americas need to help them at the time, either, not that the Maya or the Peruvians or any of the other civilizations here would have likely considered such a silly thing. "Lets sail over to Africa and do some regime changes."




Right. Another one tips over and shorts out into his own tinfoil.


Oh, I suppose you have some other history of the Med ~2000 years ago. Do tell?

Here is a map of the place a few years later -



The purple is republican turf.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 173
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 2:05:39 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		I asked for the last 2000 years, not 2000 years ago. If you are in an english speaking country it is going to behoove you at some point to have a fucking go at understanding it. You wanna try at King Idris et al, or back to Sulieman or just anyoldfuckingplace in there?

Your canard is an Epic Fail of the first order. Go back and lay down in your tinfoil.

Hint: the backstage is readying your parting gifts and frankly, they are coming off the low shelves.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 10/25/2011 2:07:30 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 174
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 2:14:29 PM   
FirstQuaker


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

I asked for the last 2000 years, not 2000 years ago. If you are in an english speaking country it is going to behoove you at some point to have a fucking go at understanding it. You wanna try at King Idris et al, or back to Sulieman or just anyoldfuckingplace in there?

Your canard is an Epic Fail of the first order. Go back and lay down in your tinfoil.

Hint: the backstage is readying your parting gifts and frankly, they are coming off the low shelves.



So you admit there was a republic there then. Would you like to tell us what happened since then in the area, and how monarchs and feudal rule have improved the place since the Romans were running it as a set provinces in their republic?

So far it appears the only time the place calms down is when either they are ruled by a complete satrap and tyrant or when the lot are republics, the halfway measures appear to lead to trouble.


(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 175
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 2:29:53 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		moving into empty space there. They have been under conservative muslim rule in one form or another since around the 3th century, no matter who was their 'owner' and one of the reasons they had their own way to go in the third century was that the Roman-Persians were constantly at war, it wasn't them. Then the Turks come running thru in the 7th century.

Then came the crusades.....11th century 12th century. Then the Ottomons in the 15th.

Throughout this time they were still under local muslim conservative rule. Then came the british empire..........and since 1900 they have been revolting for their own rule again.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 176
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 3:53:10 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

That doubtlessly justified the EUropeans flying around the place shooting up several thousand people.

So what is the difference between your jets killing a couple thousand people with airstrikes and KDaffy doing it with rifles? At leat he was not firing rockets off  from ten thousand feet, and hoping for the best.

Maybe the next time the British have riots, or Northern Ireland riots, the Russians or the Chinese should fly around England "protecting civilians" in such a manner.



Dont you even understand how the UN works ?

(in reply to FirstQuaker)
Profile   Post #: 177
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 3:54:25 PM   
FirstQuaker


Posts: 787
Joined: 3/19/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

moving into empty space there. They have been under conservative muslim rule in one form or another since around the 3th century, no matter who was their 'owner' and one of the reasons they had their own way to go in the third century was that the Roman-Persians were constantly at war, it wasn't them. Then the Turks come running thru in the 7th century.

Then came the crusades.....11th century 12th century. Then the Ottomons in the 15th.

Throughout this time they were still under local muslim conservative rule. Then came the british empire..........and since 1900 they have been revolting for their own rule again.


I see. So the history books are incorrect if they state the Koran was written in the early 600s?

And the Greek Muslims had an interesting empire ruled by a hereditary tyrant situated the former capital of the Eastern Roman Empire. A culture which still exists today as a slightly "Islamic" republic, and which usually manages to stay out of trouble in that form. Nobody seemed to like the Turks when they were run by the Big Turk and his Christian mercenary's, but they normally kept order in his lands, albeit with a very heavy hand.

But you kinda skipped over other significant groups like the Moors,

The amount of blood shed in the place since then, when they are not ruled with an iron rod is staggering, and it is not a coincidence that the various sects, cults, and religions of the desert god of the Sinai, and their beliefs and thinking, along with their ideas on government for themselves and others, have had a hand in the greatest part of it.

But do go on.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 178
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 4:10:41 PM   
isoLadyOwner


Posts: 221
Joined: 4/22/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Do we have the right to tell them how to govern themselves?


Of course not, but we have the right not to do business with them.
And last week in Yahoo they said they'd reimburse Nato for all it's expenses.
So that's what, $90 - $120 billion to us?
And wait until they start stoning women and doing "honor killings", the left will be screaming at us to "do something!!!"
"Sorry, we don't have the right to tell them how to govern themselves!"
"Look, they're sharpening up those big curvy swords!" Beheadings on You Tube?"


So what exactly was it about gadhafi-law, that you prefered over Sharia?


Pre Obama's Libyan NTC and enabling sharia law, women had a number of rights denied them under other arab Governments:

Libyan women weren't required to have male chaperone in pre sharia Libya.

Women were allowed to drive in pre sharia Libya.

Unlike many arab Nations Libyan women were allowed to hold their own passports (the husband keeps her passport usually).

Marriage rights are routinely denied to women in arab nations. Some women under sharia law must marry the choice of their parents or risk jail until they agree to the marriage. Pre the sharia takeover in Libya, women were never legally forced into marriages.

Women even were allowed to choose their own spouse prior to Obama's "kinetic action". Polygamy was illegal too, now its 4 wives to one male.

Libyan women, pre Obama's NTC, were allowed to sue for divorce, a right generally denied to women under sharia law. Husbands under sharia have the right to choose divorce. The husband says "I divorce you, I divorce you, I divorce you", the marriage is over.

Libyan women did not need to get their husband's permission to obtain a job in pre sharia Libya.

Libyan women were allowed to get an education pre Obama's NTC. There were female Doctors, Lawyers, even soldiers prior to Obama enabling a sharia Libya.

Obama's backing of the NTC and sharia law in Libya will allow Libyan NTC men to roll back women's rights to the stone age.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

As far as I recalll, no one mentioned that libya was/is a islamic republic, just that its been under sharia law since 73 and 97 % of the population are sunni muslim.....
something some are still ignoring, what a surprise



Ghaddafi was considered an Infidel by islamists and had a Fatwa issued against him for granting women some of the rights listed above.

Libya wasn't enough of an islamic Republic to satisfy the islamo fascists in Iran, the muslim brotherhood, or jihadists around the world.

We'll see if Obama's Libya is sharia enough for mohammedans soon enough.



(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 179
RE: New govt. in Libya based on sharia law. - 10/25/2011 4:12:31 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker


So what is the difference between your jets killing a couple thousand people with airstrikes and KDaffy doing it with rifles? At leat he was not firing rockets off  from ten thousand feet, and hoping for the best.



Who is this KDaffy person? A relative of Daffy Duck maybe.

Anyone that cannot be bothered to make any attempt at spelling someones name correctly should not be taken seriously in anything they say.



Susie, I spell  his name "Ga-Daffy" or "Qua-Daffy" to make fun of him. So don't take anything I say "seriously."
I don't think dictators should get any respect from me.
Now, would you children please stop poking each other with sticks and "she said, he said" B.S. and get back on topic?


_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to susie)
Profile   Post #: 180
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