RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (Full Version)

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MrRodgers -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/7/2011 8:58:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

FR

Anybody who says that nothing should be done because its GWB but would do something if it were Blowboy is an idiot. Drones are as much against international law as waterboarding.

You would be correct and points out the intellectually and morally repugnant, undisputed claim of international diplomatic hypocrisy. War between nations offer collateral damage that well...happens in war.

It has helped create the concept that to blow up a mosque and kill dozens of otherwise faith-abiding and innocent citizens (even children) is an act for some variety of religious liberation yet technology used to kill specific escapees from their own terrorism...is illegal.

People, seriously, look at was has NOT changed. They, meaning 'they'...have no choice.



hlen5 -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/7/2011 9:03:26 PM)

GWB admitted to ordering waterboarding. Does the Int'l Court say drones are illegal? If so, Obama shouldn't be having any long range travel plans.



Sanity -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/7/2011 9:06:03 PM)


Whether or not Obamas drone attacks are war crimes doesnt depend on which party the president is in, thats ridiculous.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
It all depends on what party the president is in.



SternSkipper -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/7/2011 9:16:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto

I kind of like the "Sending in a SEAL team to break him out of jail" option.

I think Chuck Norris is presently unemployed. He can be team leader.


doesnt he make out like a bandit flogging those total gym machines?..






InvisibleBlack -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/7/2011 9:41:58 PM)

"War Crimes" is a very broad category and it takes into account the multiple Hague and Geneva Conventions as well as determinations made at the Nuremberg Trials (and others as well). It includes hundreds of actions which are "war crimes". Regarding drone attacks, however, I believe the issue falls under wanton destruction and/or civilian casualties. The laws of war forbid the wanton destruction of cities, towns and villages, and any devastation not justified by military necessity and, as I recall from the military ethics class I took back in the dim misty past, any military action which causes undue civilian casualties is a "war crime".

The clear examples I recall are an officer ordering his unit to call mortar fire on a hotel where a sniper is operating from is a war cime. The level of civilain casualties (hundreds) is not commensurate with the military effort (killing one sniper). Conversely, if two civilian cooks are killed in a bombing run on a military base, that is *not* a war crime - the target was a military target, the civilian personnel on the base should be well aware that they are on a military target and the military objective (an entire base) is clearly far more substantial than the civilian casualties.

Unfortunately, life does not offer such clear-cut examples. As it was explained to me, the basic rule which will be used to judge an action is if the level of civilian casualites/destruction is commensurate with the military objective achieved.

Using a robot-controlled bomb to blow up twenty civilians to kill one terrorist would then be a war crime. A drone war using inaccurate drones which hit more civilian targets than terrorists would likewise be a war crime. Then again, the Allied bombing of Dresden during WW II would be a war crime and so would Truman's ordering the atomic bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

The sad reality is - it's only a war crime if you lose. If you win it's a "military necessity".



Owner59 -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/7/2011 9:52:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto

I kind of like the "Sending in a SEAL team to break him out of jail" option.

I think Chuck Norris is presently unemployed. He can be team leader.


doesnt he make out like a bandit flogging those total gym machines?..





Chuck Norris doesn`t sleep...................he waits.....[:D]



tweakabelle -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 1:02:02 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59


quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto
I think Chuck Norris is presently unemployed. He can be team leader.
doesnt he make out like a bandit flogging those total gym machines?..



Chuck Norris doesn`t sleep...................he waits.....[:D]


So sorry guys, Chuck Norris is no longer available for the position.

Newt has him pencilled in as his Under-Secretary of State under John Bolton* - just in case Bolton wimps out in front of those foreigner hordes at the UN again.

This appointment has genius written all over it - who else could negotiate with the Taliban and survive? [:D]


* thanks to Owner59 for the original link here



popeye1250 -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 1:31:13 AM)

If they're an "Ex" then they're private citizens again and the govt. shouldn't "do" anything.
They can hire private attys. in that country just like everyone else.



Fetters4U -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 6:10:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto
If former President Bush, or former Vice-President Cheney, were arrested in a neutral country such as Switzerland and indicted, tried and convicted for crimes against humanity, what actions should the United States government take?

* Do nothing and let him serve out his time in prison?
* Sending a strong diplomatic note of protest to the country where he is imprisoned?
* Severing diplomatic ties with the country where he is imprisoned?
* Sending in a SEAL team to break him out of jail?
* Invade the country where he is imprisoned?


Personally, I think the real issue is why he has not been arrested here. Cheney committed treason in a time of war. Shouldn't he be shot?




Sanity -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 6:23:12 AM)


Yet curiously, leftists cry foul if Obama isnt given respect worthy of a god

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fetters4U
Personally, I think the real issue is why he has not been arrested here. Cheney committed treason in a time of war. Shouldn't he be shot?





popeye1250 -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 7:55:24 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


Yet curiously, leftists cry foul if Obama isnt given respect worthy of a god

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fetters4U
Personally, I think the real issue is why he has not been arrested here. Cheney committed treason in a time of war. Shouldn't he be shot?






Yes, isn't that odd?
It's always the leftists. Why they think that Democrats are "with them" is a mystery.
And everyday there's more and more Dems who are against Oblunder.
Now he's off on *another* vacation, only 17 days this time.



mnottertail -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 7:59:26 AM)

Yeah, probably because he is not lawless like the lawless republican goons and thugs who trample our constitution and destroy our country are is why they aren't focusing on him at the level of the treasonous W and Cheney.

But just about anything like that is going to be a mystery to you and the other teabaggers and neo-cons there. 



RacerJim -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 8:06:32 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

No way.  No ****ing way.

If anything WERE to happen (extremely unlikely), it would go down like this:

1. Bush placed under house arrest, with a watch over him.
2. The US sends a letter (in Harry Potter terms, a Howler), demanding his instant release.  I would expect some saber rattling, such as fortification of nearby US bases as a warning.
3. At that point, Bush would be released since the incarceration would have been for symbolic purposes only.
4. In the unthinkable event that Bush was not released, rapid UN sanctions.  If that didn't work, invasion.





What do you think would be the world reaction to the u.s. invading switzerland?

I could care less what the world reaction would be.



Owner59 -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 8:10:15 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

If they're an "Ex" then they're private citizens again and the govt. shouldn't "do" anything.
They can hire private attys. in that country just like everyone else.

For cons,that`s only half of it.

The other half.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejvyDn1TPr8



Sanity -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 8:20:29 AM)


Did you catch that he gave another speech on "shared sacrifice" just before heading out on this latest fabulous island retreat vacation [:D]

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Yes, isn't that odd?
It's always the leftists. Why they think that Democrats are "with them" is a mystery.
And everyday there's more and more Dems who are against Oblunder.
Now he's off on *another* vacation, only 17 days this time.



Owner59 -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 8:22:55 AM)

It`s congress people are pissed at, for being on vacation.



thompsonx -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 9:40:40 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

FR

Anybody who says that nothing should be done because its GWB but would do something if it were Blowboy is an idiot. Drones are as much against international law as waterboarding.



Are you in favor of drones and waterboarding?

It all depends on what party the president is in.


No moron, youre the hypocrite not me. My answer is yes and yes.


This would seem to indicate that you support the current president in his use of drones.
Will you be voting for him in november?



thompsonx -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 9:44:52 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

No way.  No ****ing way.

If anything WERE to happen (extremely unlikely), it would go down like this:

1. Bush placed under house arrest, with a watch over him.
2. The US sends a letter (in Harry Potter terms, a Howler), demanding his instant release.  I would expect some saber rattling, such as fortification of nearby US bases as a warning.
3. At that point, Bush would be released since the incarceration would have been for symbolic purposes only.
4. In the unthinkable event that Bush was not released, rapid UN sanctions.  If that didn't work, invasion.





What do you think would be the world reaction to the u.s. invading switzerland?

I could care less what the world reaction would be.


Do you believe that the u.s.could stand off the whole world?



DarkSteven -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 10:03:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

No way.  No ****ing way.

If anything WERE to happen (extremely unlikely), it would go down like this:

1. Bush placed under house arrest, with a watch over him.
2. The US sends a letter (in Harry Potter terms, a Howler), demanding his instant release.  I would expect some saber rattling, such as fortification of nearby US bases as a warning.
3. At that point, Bush would be released since the incarceration would have been for symbolic purposes only.
4. In the unthinkable event that Bush was not released, rapid UN sanctions.  If that didn't work, invasion.



What do you think would be the world reaction to the u.s. invading switzerland?


You're not following.  This would be the reaction to a series of unthinkable events.

1. Bush getting arrested.
2. Switzerland ignoring a letter demanding instant release.
3. Switzerland ignoring UN sanctions.

With the UN sanctions, the world will have given notice that Bush was to be released should Switzerland ignore that, the UN would have essentially authorized action through the sanctions.

I get the feeling that you're envisioning a scenario in which the UN refused to sanction Switzerland.  That simply won't happen.



PatrickG38 -> RE: If ex-Pres. Bush got arrested in another country, what action should U.S. take? (12/8/2011 10:17:32 AM)

How on earth would the UN sanction switzerland?



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