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RE: Romance and Domination - 4/10/2004 5:08:22 PM

DommeVivaine

Posts: 11
Joined: 2/9/2004
From: Raleigh, NC
Status: offline

Hello all,

Just to throw another angle on this discussion (who me?) the meaning of the term "romance" has changed in the last fifty years in such a way as to be almost totally out of contact with its original meaning. (I blame Harlequin Books)

A "romance" in its original sense was a fictional story of high and dangerous adventure, usually with a fair measure of tragedy. Pirate tales like Treasure Island and Bluebeard were romances. Adventure tales like King Soloman's Mines (not the movie the book) and Ernest Hemingway's machismo books were romances. The Charge of the Light Brigade, both the poem and the heroic, doomed, bloody real battle, was viewed as extremely romantic at the time it happened.

Take note that NOT ONE of these tales has a female character in it, and there is not one iota of sex involved. Wuthering Heights and Jane Eyre were the first love stories viewed as romantic not because they were love stories, but because the male heros were tragic figures deemed to be "mad, bad and dangerous to know", which in Victorian parlance means "very very bad guys who could get you killed or worse".

The stories are about excitement and danger, and how the people involved deal with both.

Sounds kind of familiar doesn't it?

Smiles, Vivaine

"and the definition of is is..." Feel free to disagree.

_____________________________

The definition of pointless frustration: Calling a deaf cat.

(in reply to Checkers)

Post #: 21

RE: Romance and Domination - 4/12/2004 11:42:53 AM

contentsub

Posts: 2
Joined: 4/12/2004
Status: offline

I believe it goes hand in hand .. it works for us. I am in a 24/7 live-in relationship, My dom is very strict, however he can be very romantic at times, shower me with love, respect, spoils me at times & treats me like a princess, there are rules to follow & if I break a rule or hesitate to obey, there are consequences that I must endure. He tells me each day how much in love with me he is ... & I adore him. The feeling I get when he walks in the room is overwhelming, not knowing if he is coming towards me to kiss my neck or whisper for me to come with him into the next room & lock the door for something I have forgotten to do that he had requested. Although I live to please him ... without the knowing his love, I don't believe I could be a good sub.

(in reply to Checkers)

Post #: 22

RE: Romance and Domination - 4/28/2004 2:39:39 PM

Katmistress

Posts: 33
Joined: 4/27/2004
Status: offline

My sub is my husband. I love him and am in love with him. We were married for 3 years before any of this came into the relationship. There are times when he mistakes my affection for weakness so this is not so easy. I think in the long run this will work out to be a wonderful way of life for both of us so I am going to continue to work with him to show him there is a huge difference between kindness and weakness.

(in reply to contentsub)

Post #: 23

RE: Romance and Domination - 4/29/2004 11:40:15 AM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

Well, from my perspective, what a person needs and wants from the person in their life is more hard-wired behavior they bring with them.

If person A is hard-wired to do Dom behaviors, and person B is hard-wired to sub behaviors, and they find each other and are happy and content and fulfilled in the synergy of their two-some, that to me is what "love" and "romance" are all about.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to Checkers)

Post #: 24

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/1/2004 6:53:02 AM

nysub29

Posts: 12
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

In regards to the initial question i don't believe a Dom/Domme doing something nice for their sub/slave is an indication of Their weakness. i do understand how it could be viewed in that light but i think i would feel the need to recipricate in kind. Rather than viewing it as a way to trample on the Dom/Domme because they have done something kind i would feel more obligated in my duties to the Dom/Domme.
It would strengthen my appreciation for the relationship and for my role in it.

_____________________________

Barnes~ dedicated submissive to Lady Beckett

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 25

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/1/2004 8:06:24 AM

LadyBeckett

Posts: 865
Joined: 2/4/2004
From: Scotland/Tennessee
Status: offline

In a 24/7 relationship there are so so many other factors involved that make the D/s relationship so incredibly rich. Which also brings me to my personal favorite, communication. I am a writer, and I adore those long conversations in the early morning over that warm mug of freshly brewed columbian coffee, or in the evening when there are no interruptions and we can have that meeting of the minds. I value the brilliance of my 24/7 submissive, and all of the many facets of the relationship which is the 24/7 D/s.

I have rules, and I am strict when it comes to those rules. However, while I am not actually affectionate, I do have my way of showing those that I love, that I do. To my knowledge they don't mistake that for weakness.

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_______________________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to contentsub)

Post #: 26

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/1/2004 9:14:54 AM

iwillserveu

Posts: 1633
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

To complete a Beckett trifecta...

If romance is seen as weekness by the sub, that is the subs problem. No one, Dominant, submissive, or Indian Cheif can control how they are seen through other people's eyes.

_____________________________

When the Lady smiles i can't resist her call. As a matter of fact, i don't resist at all. Well that depends if it is a smile or a grimmace.

(in reply to contentsub)

Post #: 27

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/1/2004 10:13:29 AM

slaveofKat

Posts: 24
Joined: 4/27/2004
Status: offline

I think that the domination and submissiveness, in and of itself, in a loving relationship, embodies a unique type of romance, a "different" kind of loving. There is romance sitting at my Mistress's feet, and an ongoing emotional bonding. It's always nice when Mistress does something special to show her love for me, and appreciated, not expected. As Her slave I don't expect to be showered with flowers and candy, a gentle touch from her hand or whispering in my ear is very romantic. We both love chocolate, though.......

(in reply to iwillserveu)

Post #: 28

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/2/2004 6:55:07 AM

Wolfspet

Posts: 143
Joined: 1/11/2004
Status: offline

Wolf opens doors for me, sends me flowers, leaves little notes. In the outside world, as well as home, I am the "pampered pet".

He can be a helpless romantic. After a length of time together, certain behaviors become the norm, your roles are clearly defined with each other, and the softer side of D/s can emerge as frequently *(and sometimes during)* as the harsher side. We have become **for each other** the ideal partner in D/s and because of this, my behavior gets rewarded, and he says he is gratified by the smile or laugh.

For us it is a necessary blend of "life" with the lifestyle.

(in reply to slaveofKat)

Post #: 29

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/2/2004 7:00:17 AM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

I do similar things, Wolfspet. In the model demonstrated by Arthurian Chivalry, the man honors his lady faire with such noble deeds, and I would not be one to consider Arthur (or Lancelot) as being anything but Dominant in those stories.

Besides which, doting on my pet makes me happy, so I really dont care how it appears to anybody else.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to Wolfspet)

Post #: 30

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/3/2004 10:38:38 AM

MistressDREAD

Posts: 2943
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Interesting Wolfspet
because My slave does
pretty much the same
thing your Wolf does
for you and I have
always concidered
a romance or romantic
action to be just that and
can be done by anyone
and not just sumone of
Dominance.I would also
like to add that aside from
My slave I speak of here
being male and I Female
I have also had My female
slaves do much the same
for Me and I to My posessions
as well as towards My Masters
in House when They were
living.The answer to your
question katerina is No for Me,
My perseceptions of Them
have not nor would not change
and only sumone whom seeks
a weakness would have a
changed thought or whom is
not sure of the relationship and
the reason for the thought
and gift Id say. I would think
about the saying: If its not
broke dont try to fix it!!
ENJOY the little simple things.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 31

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/3/2004 5:13:02 PM

lacesundone

Posts: 12
Joined: 4/27/2004
Status: offline

i just wanted to say...that there is a lot to be said for being DOMINEERED! (say, is that a word? and if not, why not!) i have had a lot of fun, a lot of intensity, a lot of love as well as the occasional bad head trip. one thing i think is vital is to learn to keep hold of yourself, even while you hand someone else the keys to your inner kingdom. You are the most important person in the relationship, no matter which side you are on.
at least, that is what i tell myself.....
and look how good I screw up.
laces
(formerly bijou)

(in reply to Checkers)

Post #: 32

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/14/2004 1:56:05 PM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

quote:

DOMINATION IS A SIN AGAINST EVERYONE THAT IS BEING DOMINATED AND IF A PERSON REALLY LOVES YOU THEN THEY WOULD NOT BE THREATENED BY FREEDOM

I personally wonder why so many Christian religious organizations, the Moral Majority, the Neo-Conservative Right Wing are so threatened by freedom. One would think they would stop their "sinful" posturing as they try to dominate the thinking of other people. This sentence would tend to indicate to me that they do not truly "love" me.

There are so many different ways this sentence can be read...

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to Checkers)

Post #: 33

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/14/2004 4:01:32 PM

Estring

Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

I am always amazed at how much power people seem to feel that the Christian Right have in this country. In reality they have very little ( abortion is never going to become illegal all you chicken littles).
Yet our rights have been eroded from the Far Left and nobody says a thing.
Has anyone noticed all the speech codes that are in place in our colleges and universities? And complimenting a woman in the workplace can get you fired for sexual harassment nowadays.
Smoking is becoming harder and harder to do. Here in Los Angeles you can't even smoke at the beach in many places. And no I am not a smoker. But last I checked, cigarettes are a legal product. But the agenda from the Left is to make cigarettes illegal.
Has anyone noticed how powerful the trial lawyers have become in this country? They have been behind the explosion in lawsuits in this country. If something bad happens, well someone must be to blame. That is their belief. And we all know which side of the political spectrum the lawyers reside on.
And now we are seeing lawsuits against fast food companies. Trust me this won't be the end either. No one is responsible for their own actions anymore. It's society or big bad big business that is at fault.
I am no fan of the Christian Right, but just as there are fanatics there, the Left has just as many. And they are much more powerful, because nobody seems to notice them. They are the good guys. They know what's best for all.
And when they talk about diversity, it is always diversity of color, not ideas. They are very tolerant, as long as you agree with them.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 34

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/14/2004 4:51:12 PM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

quote:

I am always amazed at how much power people seem to feel that the Christian Right have in this country. In reality they have very little ( abortion is never going to become illegal all you chicken littles).
Yet our rights have been eroded from the Far Left and nobody says a thing.

Im not sure I posted to claim that the Christian Right has power, simply that the post mentioned Domination being a sin (which is a Christian concept) and yet whether or not they are successful at doing it, their intent is to dominate what other people do.

So it was mostly my argument that Domination being a Sin is fallacious.

While I understand your concern regarding the erosion of personal liberties by the left, the problem really revolves around where person A's personal space ends and mine begins.

I dont care if people smoke. I dont and am not really willing to inhale somebody else's cigarette. It also irritates me that many smokers view the world as their personal ashtray. The easy approach is to make restaurants, offices, beaches, places people gather as cigarette free areas so that others are not subjected to non-consensual acts.

I dont care if people drink and drive, but when they run over and kill a non-consenting person I have issues with it. The easiest solution is make it illegal to drink and drive and apply the law to everybody.

I dont care if a person wears a helmet on a motorcycle, but I take offense to that person expecting me (as a paying taxpayer in our society) to pay to keep that person on life support as a brain-dead person for the next 40 years after they fall off it without wearing one. The easy approach is to require everybody to wear one. A more cruel (and appropriate) solution is for the ambulance to pull up, determine the person has no helmet on, and call dead animal disposal.

I dont care if people own thousands of guns. I dont think their .357 magnum will help them very much when the "government" sends a few A-10 Thunderbolts or M1A1 Abrams tanks their way, but if it helps them sleep at night having one, I figure more power to them. I do have issues with the costs to our society with their abundance.

I dont care if people do drugs. I have issues with the cost to our society of the War On Drugs. Far as Im concerned, they should all be legalized, taxed, drug treatment programs should be set up, the stigma should be erased, and ways to get off them offered to anybody who wishes to do so.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to Estring)

Post #: 35

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/14/2004 6:05:14 PM

iwillserveu

Posts: 1633
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Doing things for Lady's honor? Lifting though your arms are too weary and fighting the unbeatable foe for your Dulcinea is Dominant?

Call me crazy, but is not one who willingly suffers for a woman's convenience submissive?

< Message edited by iwillserveu -- 5/14/2004 9:07:32 PM >

_____________________________

When the Lady smiles i can't resist her call. As a matter of fact, i don't resist at all. Well that depends if it is a smile or a grimmace.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 36

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/14/2004 7:33:14 PM

topcat

Posts: 1675
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Tidewater, VA
Status: offline

My very dear Iwill-

quote:

but is not one who willingly suffers for a woman's convenience submissive?

No, one who willingly suffers for a woman's convenience is a male<g>.

stay warm,

Lawrence

_____________________________

-there is no remission without blood-

(in reply to iwillserveu)

Post #: 37

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/14/2004 11:38:26 PM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

quote:

Doing things for Lady's honor? Lifting though your arms are too weary and fighting the unbeatable foe for your Dulcinea is Dominant?

They are doing it for the Lady's honor in one sense, in another they are doing it because they have bound themselves to a code of behavior and feel that adherence to that code is more important than their personal safety or welfare.

Depends really on how you define Dominance. To me, I am first and foremost Dominant over myself and my behavior. I have a code of ethics and honor which I adhere to rather stringently. I dont have to. I dont expect some eternal reward for it. But it makes me happy and content to know I can face myself in the mirror when Im shaving in the morning.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to topcat)

Post #: 38

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/15/2004 10:25:13 AM

iwillserveu

Posts: 1633
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

topcat,

(I assume that is Rofl o LMAO)

_____________________________

When the Lady smiles i can't resist her call. As a matter of fact, i don't resist at all. Well that depends if it is a smile or a grimmace.

(in reply to topcat)

Post #: 39

RE: Romance and Domination - 5/15/2004 11:47:53 AM

MistressKiss

Posts: 295
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Here...here...I agree with these posts. Romance just makes the relationship even "more better and gooder"...it can intensify and deepen it. There are other ways, but romance is a necessary factor with anyone I enter a lengthy relationship with. Also, I want to know how he is with vanilla sex as much as with BDSM sex. I want a whole, complete, well-rounded relationship. There are many ways to get that, but romance is definitely a prerequisite for me.

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"I assure you, Your Honor, I don't have to practice...I'm very good at them..."
(The Marquis de Sade at one of his trials for the sexual perversities he practiced)

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 40

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