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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 3:40:48 PM

MrBukani

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PUSSY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tell your friend the real down and dirty truth.
I love a bit of drama.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 3:43:13 PM

kalikshama

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quote:

Unfortunately what I've learned with friends, sometimes they don't actually want to hear your advice. They just want you to listen. Which, is totally fine. But I'd wish they'd be more upfront about it ._.

Ya, I like to problem solve so will ask - "Do you just want to vent? Let me know if you'd like me to problem solve."

When I just want people to listen to me vent I let them know. Interestingly, this is most often an issue with my mother. (Her problem solving when I want to vent.)

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 3:46:11 PM

kalikshama

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quote:

From what she has told me her partner has lied to her consistantly over all the time they have been together which is for about 15 years. Some of the lies have stemmed from their first contact and others have been small things during the time of their relationship. Some of the things she has told me about were really serious things that have knocked me for six. It has made me view him in a whole new light.

Because of that ^

Her only option is leave him or this:

quote:

I would tell her, though, that someone who has been lying to her for 15 years straight is not going to quit lying to her. That's not going to happen. This is something she must accept with equanimity, or not.

He's not going to change.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 4:17:01 PM

myrgth

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My friends come to me only when they are ready to hear exactly what I have to say. I'm good with that.

When a friend has come to me in the past with a situation that is similar to the one you describe, my first words are, "Why is this a problem now when it hasn't been for the previous 15 years?"
Then it would go, "You must enjoy some aspect of the unhappiness it brings to you to continue in a relationship that fails to bring you joy."
Likely followed with, "Unless you plan to do something drastic and change the situation, I don't want to hear about it again."

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 4:27:06 PM

NuevaVida

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No one can make her decisions for her. As much as you believe she should walk away, it has to come from her to do this. If they are both willing to go to counseling together, they probably should. If she is willing to go but he is not, she should go alone.

Other than that, you can tell her what you would do, but do not insist that she makes the same decisions you would (not implying you're doing this, btw). Then tell her you love her, and that you're here for her if and when she needs you.

Having been in a long term, emotionally unhealthy relationship, I had to see and feel the need to leave, when I finally decided to leave. Everyone insisting that I do (before I could see it and before I was ready) so just made me feel more alone.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 6:13:35 PM

StrongSpirit

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I am going to pretend you are the person dating them (it makes pronouns easier)

1. Every person has flaws.
2. "Lies" fall on a spectrum. Almost everyone lies to some extent. Make-up is a form of deception, although I personally don't consider using it to be wrong in any way shape or form.
3. If you can not live with the lie level of this particular person dump them.
4. If you can live with lies, there are far worse flaws. Cheating for example is not synonymous with lies.
5. Under NO circumstances should anyone expect a confirmed liar to stop lying. It won't happen.
6. Most importantly, once you know that you can't stand a liar, make that a PRIMARY constraint. That is, make sure they tell the truth most of the time before you get serious, not after. Honestly, it isn't that hard - you just need the ethics to ignore your old primary constraint (Most commonly: men = beauty, women = height)

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 7:30:45 PM

slaverachel2Him

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quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

I have a friend that I have known from the age of about 5 or 6. She is in a relationship that was originally M/s but this seems to have tailed off over the last couple of years. She has now come to me for some advice and I am struggling with what to say. We have always been able to discuss anything but I am finding it so hard to help her right now.

From what she has told me her partner has lied to her consistantly over all the time they have been together which is for about 15 years. Some of the lies have stemmed from their first contact and others have been small things during the time of their relationship. Some of the things she has told me about were really serious things that have knocked me for six. It has made me view him in a whole new light.

I am finding it so hard to give her advice as my gut instinct would be to tell her to walk away from him. From what I know she loves him totally. She says he loves her too but how can he if he lies to her all the time. The worst part for me is that he seems to leave clues around that she finds which proves he has lied.

To me there is no choice but to walk away but I don't want to give her that advice. I am at a bit of a loss right now as to how to help her.

Any ideas?

i would say what i would do in that situation. You might state some general reminders of what is problematic in relationships and why. Let her know you are with her no matter what, and that you wouldn't want to try to "break them up" (though with so much lying were they ever together- she doesn't really know 'who' he is) and you would LIKE it to work out but also..... Whatever she needs to do.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 7:48:53 PM

MistressDarkArt

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My father had a saying: when you've had enough you'll quit.

As a young woman I used to vent and vent and vent to Dad about my rotten ex-husband. He'd listen patiently, then say again, "when you've had enough, you'll quit." Coming from a psychologist I thought he greatly oversimplified my 'complex' situation.

Not so. One morning I woke up and said, "I've had enough. I quit." And life got dramatically better with that one simple sentence.

Feel free to tell your friend this story. I wish her well.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 9:20:19 PM

tiggerspoohbear

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I've listened to many a friend vent. I've learned the hard way that telling them the truth is not always what they want to hear. So I now listen, offer a shoulder and tell them that whatever they decide, I'm behind them 100%. If this turns into a constant litany over months, then it's make your own choice but I can't help you unless you're willing to tell yourself the truth. And that's where it ends, when she tells herself the truth, she'll make the decision she has to make.

I was with someone for 7 yrs, he constantly lied and cheated. I finally had enough and left. That's when I'd had,as MDA put it, "I've had enough. I quit." And I did what I had to do, as hard a decision as it was for me to make. Good luck with your friend.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 9:32:23 PM

tj444

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressDarkArt
My father had a saying: when you've had enough you'll quit.

As a young woman I used to vent and vent and vent to Dad about my rotten ex-husband. He'd listen patiently, then say again, "when you've had enough, you'll quit." Coming from a psychologist I thought he greatly oversimplified my 'complex' situation.

Not so. One morning I woke up and said, "I've had enough. I quit." And life got dramatically better with that one simple sentence.

Feel free to tell your friend this story. I wish her well.

I've always called it hitting bottom.. until the pain from not changing is greater than the pain of change.. the person hasnt hit bottom yet..

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 9:53:25 PM

SAMHAIN09

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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

If she was my friend I'd tell her they need to talk first. They need to sit down and have a heart to heart talk and if they find they still can't work it out alone but want to then to seek counseling.

After that I'd walk away and tell her to do what she feels is in her best interest. I for one would not want to be the one to tell them to leave or stay and then be blamed for whatever fallout occurs.

Thread should have ended here. Now for my two cents since he leaves clus it's possible he wants to be caught in the lies maybe getting busted and being called out on his lies turns him on. If so she really needs to talk to him first.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/9/2012 10:13:28 PM

SAMHAIN09

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quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

I am going to pretend you are the person dating them (it makes pronouns easier)

1. Every person has flaws.
2. "Lies" fall on a spectrum. Almost everyone lies to some extent. Make-up is a form of deception, although I personally don't consider using it to be wrong in any way shape or form.
3. If you can not live with the lie level of this particular person dump them.
4. If you can live with lies, there are far worse flaws. Cheating for example is not synonymous with lies.
5. Under NO circumstances should anyone expect a confirmed liar to stop lying. It won't happen.
6. Most importantly, once you know that you can't stand a liar, make that a PRIMARY constraint. That is, make sure they tell the truth most of the time before you get serious, not after. Honestly, it isn't that hard - you just need the ethics to ignore your old primary constraint (Most commonly: men = beauty, women = height)

Well said.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/10/2012 12:42:54 AM

MasterSlaveLA

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quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

To me there is no choice but to walk away but I don't want to give her that advice.

I don't know the details of said "lies", but if they're as egregious as you've implied, then I'd have ZERO problem telling a friend to "walk" -- and would also offer my home as a place to stay in the interim, should they need it.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/10/2012 4:13:31 AM

DivineDemise

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Gut instinct is usually the best there is. If he loved her there would have never been any lies period is how I see it. Maybe what she needs to do is take a break from him at least a week or two & find herself. During that time have no contact with him just think if she wants to be with him. Weigh out the pros & cons. I personaly wouldnt be able to be woth a liar. Once trust is broken it may never be fixed. I hope shes able to find peace again I wish all the best.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/10/2012 5:07:18 AM

Buzzzz

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Like most said. be there for her. Try to help her out the best you can and don't judge. Try to stay very neutral and don't say "I told you so or Iknew>>>>>" when/if she comes to her conclusions (hopefully she will).

She needs to figure it out pretty much by herself , and your support could be helping her.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/10/2012 5:41:39 AM

fucktoyprincess

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I think you have to be honest with your friend. You're not judging by one incident alone, but by what you've seen and heard over the length of her relationship. It's not a conclusion you've come to either quickly or irrationally. But I would also tell her what you've shared with us. That you are loathe to give her this advice, and that you hope she can understand why you feel that you need to share this with her. You must be prepared for her being upset with you in the short term - but in the long term, if things are really as you describe - she will thank you for being upfront and honest with her.

If your friend were addicted to drugs, but claimed not to be, would you do an intervention to save her from herself? A bad relationship can be as bad or worse to the soul than drug addiction. Just my two cents.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/10/2012 8:57:27 AM

SailingBum

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ehhh I have a strict policy of not getting involved in others drama. I had a wife that would talk about this or that. I explained to her that she needs to work that out with the person that you have a issue with. nuff said

BadOne

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/10/2012 6:41:45 PM

agirl

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Is her partner your friend as well? If not, then no matter what , you are going to have a bias not matter how slight.

Bow out.......I would. Direct her toward her partner, toward them jointly sorting things out. Be pro *them* because that's very likely what she wants. Once she has that, she'll be more able to keep things straight and make her own decisions.

Generally, people that have made the decision to leave just want a bit of support.

agirl

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/11/2012 1:03:46 AM

susie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressDarkArt

My father had a saying: when you've had enough you'll quit.

As a young woman I used to vent and vent and vent to Dad about my rotten ex-husband. He'd listen patiently, then say again, "when you've had enough, you'll quit." Coming from a psychologist I thought he greatly oversimplified my 'complex' situation.

Not so. One morning I woke up and said, "I've had enough. I quit." And life got dramatically better with that one simple sentence.

Feel free to tell your friend this story. I wish her well.

I think she may well have got to the "had enough". We met for a chat and it seems that the latest lie is about his relationship with a female "friend". She also told me about 2 lies that he told when they first met. Huge huge lies about his previous life which means he not only lied to her but all of us that met him at that time.

I will be there for her no matter what but given what those 2 lies were I will have nothing to do with him ever again.

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RE: Lies and more Lies - 1/11/2012 8:40:04 AM

DesFIP

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I think you need to tell her that. That you're still her friend but you will not join them because you cannot tolerate being around him. If she loses the option of seeing her friends because he wants to go along, then it might make her realize how much else she's losing by remaining with him.

Beyond that, I would just tell her that she knows now, she has always known, that she can't ever believe what he says and she has to make her own decisions in every situation based only on what she knows, ignoring his input. If she can be happy while disbelieving him, while ignoring what he tells her, then she should stay. If she can't be happy doing that, then she needs to think about moving on.

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