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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/12/2012 7:30:57 AM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I think that every liberal on collarme should go buy a Chevy Volt and do their part in saving the planet.

Why the liberals?
It's the conservatives who spend the most time bitching about al queda and the eevil mooslims.

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/12/2012 8:17:28 AM   
Owner59


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead


quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I think that every liberal on collarme should go buy a Chevy Volt and do their part in saving the planet.

Why the liberals?
It's the conservatives who spend the most time bitching about al queda and the eevil mooslims.

It would seem that some our cons would rather burn the planet up AND fund al-queda terrorists.....just to spite us.


That`s why they call it extremism.

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/12/2012 1:54:30 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

Meh... I`m saying saving oil and not giving money to the House of Saud trumps con-dogma about the role of government in business.



Now if you want to be concerned about that, Owner59, then you are going in completely the wrong direction. Want to stop pouring cash into the House of Saud? Then don't conserve gas. Burn it. Buy a 1-ton, gas powered, dually pick-up, and do jackrabbit starts from every light. Drive around with the windows down, and the a/c on full blast.

The sooner their fucking oil is completely gone, the sooner they stop mattering. Conservation, making every drop last, only prolongs their power.


Why is it that we are charged the same price for domestcally produced oil as the saudi's charge???
Could it be that all the oil producers are sleeping together?

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Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/12/2012 1:56:06 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

so forget panels, that will be obsolete in due course..


Does that mean that the pannels I have been using for the past 25 years wont work any more?

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/12/2012 2:26:58 PM   
RottenJohnny


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Status: offline 		In its current form, the Volt is simply crap...but a good idea. However, it will never apply well to rural areas until we have compact fusion reactors instead of batteries (a very long time away from now). But has anybody here considerd hybrids and our ability to synthesize gasoline (thermal-depolymerization) as a useful stop-gap until the tech has improved?

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/12/2012 4:24:42 PM   
Owner59


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny

In its current form, the Volt is simply crap...but a good idea. However, it will never apply well to rural areas until we have compact fusion reactors instead of batteries (a very long time away from now). But has anybody here considerd hybrids and our ability to synthesize gasoline (thermal-depolymerization) as a useful stop-gap until the tech has improved?

So you own one?

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/12/2012 5:22:16 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

In its current form, the Volt is simply crap...but a good idea. However, it will never apply well to rural areas until we have compact fusion reactors instead of batteries (a very long time away from now).


I smell medical M

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/12/2012 5:32:31 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

So you own one?


I think he is heavily invested in medical M. And I think we're past the point where anybody's gonna be doing any driving.

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/13/2012 12:10:51 PM   
RottenJohnny


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quote:

Owner59
So you own one?


quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper
I think he is heavily invested in medical M. And I think we're past the point where anybody's gonna be doing any driving.


You boys are such sweet talkers. :)

No. I don't own one. Nor would I at this point. I just happen to live in Michigan where the controversy regarding this vehicle never fricking ends. I'm also a car enthusiast and engineer with several friends in the automotive industry. Keeping up with these kinds of technologies is something of a hobby for me.

Bottom line is that electric cars are a great idea but given current technology their useful application is limited. It is simply too impractical to try replacing every gas-burner with a purely electric vehicle. Hybrid vehicles are a much better idea where electric cars fall short.

Disclaimer: No medical M plants were harmed in the writing of this response. The author reserves the right to "flip the bird" to those who have no sense of humor.



_____________________________

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I believe in common sense, not common opinions. - Me

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Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/13/2012 12:18:29 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny

In its current form, the Volt is simply crap...but a good idea. However, it will never apply well to rural areas until we have compact fusion reactors instead of batteries (a very long time away from now). But has anybody here considerd hybrids and our ability to synthesize gasoline (thermal-depolymerization) as a useful stop-gap until the tech has improved?

Actually the Volt is a hybrid.

(in reply to RottenJohnny)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/13/2012 12:34:33 PM   
RottenJohnny


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
Actually the Volt is a hybrid.


...that relies on it's batteries for most of it's power. Basically an electric car. What I'm discussing is gas-over-electric hybrids that don't require a large bank of batteries

< Message edited by RottenJohnny -- 3/13/2012 1:24:35 PM >

_____________________________

"I find your arguments strewn with gaping defects in logic." - Mr. Spock

"Give me liberty or give me death." - Patrick Henry

I believe in common sense, not common opinions. - Me

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Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/13/2012 12:54:07 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny

In its current form, the Volt is simply crap...but a good idea. However, it will never apply well to rural areas until we have compact fusion reactors instead of batteries (a very long time away from now). But has anybody here considerd hybrids and our ability to synthesize gasoline (thermal-depolymerization) as a useful stop-gap until the tech has improved?

Actually the Volt is a hybrid.


...that relies on it's batteries for most of it's power. Basically an electric car. What I'm discussing is gas-over-electric hybrids that don't require a large bank of batteries

?
Do you have any idea what you're talking about?

The Volt as a plug in hybrid is an ideal compromise between a 100% electric vehicle and a traditional auto. When driven normal commuter distances it uses little if any gas, assuming it actually is plugged in overnight each time. However if a longer distance trip is required the Volt can keep going on its gas engine even after the batteries are drained. It has the added benefit, like all hybrids and electrics, of using regenerative braking to recover some energy that would normally be thrown away as heat in the brake pads.

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/13/2012 2:44:44 PM   
RottenJohnny


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Do you have any idea what you're talking about?



Yeah, Ken. I understand how the Volt is designed and how it functions. Because of it's batteries and the need for it to be plugged in, I define it as an electric car. If my definition is out of line with yours then my apologies for the misunderstanding. I don't have a problem with the idea. I just don't think the technology is up to the best standards to make it completely practical. In it's current form, I think the Volt is a bad car. Do I think it will get better? Yes. But I also think a hybrid that doesn't require large batteries or the need to be plugged in may be an easier and cheaper way to go. That's just my opinion based on what I know.

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"I find your arguments strewn with gaping defects in logic." - Mr. Spock

"Give me liberty or give me death." - Patrick Henry

I believe in common sense, not common opinions. - Me

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Profile   Post #: 73
RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/13/2012 3:01:10 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Do you have any idea what you're talking about?



Yeah, Ken. I understand how the Volt is designed and how it functions. Because of it's batteries and the need for it to be plugged in, I define it as an electric car. If my definition is out of line with yours then my apologies for the misunderstanding. I don't have a problem with the idea. I just don't think the technology is up to the best standards to make it completely practical. In it's current form, I think the Volt is a bad car. Do I think it will get better? Yes. But I also think a hybrid that doesn't require large batteries or the need to be plugged in may be an easier and cheaper way to go. That's just my opinion based on what I know.

The Volt doesn't need to be plugged in. It just can be charged that way. You could run it as a standard gas/electric hybrid if you wanted you'd just get much worse mpg.

Just as an aside since my Prius can be plugged in and has batteries do you consider it an electric car not yet practical? The 100+k miles on it would seem to undermine your view.

I think that you should be slower to pass judgement on a vehicle you don't understand.

< Message edited by DomKen -- 3/13/2012 3:02:40 PM >

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/14/2012 5:54:35 AM   
RottenJohnny


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

The Volt doesn't need to be plugged in. It just can be charged that way. You could run it as a standard gas/electric hybrid if you wanted you'd just get much worse mpg.



Then really, what's the point of having a car with all those batteries? You may as well get rid of them and increase your mileage by losing the weight, reduce your repair costs by never needing to replace them, and reduce your stress by never worrying if the the car may burst into flames (not something I actually believe is an issue but some do).

quote:



Just as an aside since my Prius can be plugged in and has batteries do you consider it an electric car not yet practical? The 100+k miles on it would seem to undermine your view.



The one advantage I give to the Prius is that it's had the benefit of a few more years of development. And practicality is relative to the drivers needs. But overall, I still don't think it's the best solution as an economy enhancer.

quote:



I think that you should be slower to pass judgement on a vehicle you don't understand.



I understand the idea and the technology behind cars like the Prius and the Volt just fine. And for certain applications they're a good idea. I just believe that considering all the other factors involved, there's a better way to do hybrids.

< Message edited by RottenJohnny -- 3/14/2012 6:22:42 AM >

_____________________________

"I find your arguments strewn with gaping defects in logic." - Mr. Spock

"Give me liberty or give me death." - Patrick Henry

I believe in common sense, not common opinions. - Me

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/14/2012 6:58:54 AM   
PeonForHer


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Anyone here investigated electric bikes? They're much, much more fuel-efficient than electric cars. In Bristol, no distance is too great for me to deal with either on foot or on my standard pedal-cycle. If I were in London still, though, and commuting ten miles each way to work - one of those babies would be the answer.



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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/14/2012 8:27:51 AM   
Fightdirecto


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Status: offline 		I own a hybrid - to be exact, a 2010 Honda Insight. Just this past weekend, I drove from my home in the suburbs of Boston to New York City (I was performing at a club in Greenwich Village) and then back again using approx. 3/4 of a tank of gas. My previous vehicle, a 2000 Toyoata RAV4, used to burn a tank and a half of gas or more for the same trip.

I'm all in favor of the Volt or at least a hybrid like a Honda Insight or a Toyota Prius.

Actually, the rise in prices at the gass pump in the U.S. is easily explained - the oil companies who drill within the 50 U.S. States (and immediately off-shore) sell the refined gasoline to India and China, rather than sell it within the U.S. because they can get more money from the Indians and the Chinese. The more we

Capitalism and the quest for profit does not respect national boundries - a true capitalist farmer, for example, would let his own brother or sister who live next door starve if he could get a better price selling the food he grows to a hungry person in Europe or Asia.

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/14/2012 10:15:12 AM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

I own a hybrid - to be exact, a 2010 Honda Insight. Just this past weekend, I drove from my home in the suburbs of Boston to New York City (I was performing at a club in Greenwich Village) and then back again using approx. 3/4 of a tank of gas. My previous vehicle, a 2000 Toyoata RAV4, used to burn a tank and a half of gas or more for the same trip.


Those are fantastically different vehicles, beyond the hybrid/gasoline difference.

I drive a 2007 Yaris; it gets 38 mph, close to the Insight (40+ depending).
My 2000 Echo got 40.

For a lot of distance highway driving, electric cars aren't the choice; for a lot of city driving, absolutely.

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/14/2012 10:38:47 AM   
RacerJim


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto

I own a hybrid - to be exact, a 2010 Honda Insight. Just this past weekend, I drove from my home in the suburbs of Boston to New York City (I was performing at a club in Greenwich Village) and then back again using approx. 3/4 of a tank of gas. My previous vehicle, a 2000 Toyoata RAV4, used to burn a tank and a half of gas or more for the same trip.

I'm all in favor of the Volt or at least a hybrid like a Honda Insight or a Toyota Prius.

Actually, the rise in prices at the gass pump in the U.S. is easily explained - the oil companies who drill within the 50 U.S. States (and immediately off-shore) sell the refined gasoline to India and China, rather than sell it within the U.S. because they can get more money from the Indians and the Chinese. The more we

Capitalism and the quest for profit does not respect national boundries - a true capitalist farmer, for example, would let his own brother or sister who live next door starve if he could get a better price selling the food he grows to a hungry person in Europe or Asia.

Nothing like comparing an apple to an orange to make a point. :-(

Anyone who is all in favor of the Volt is all in favor of Socialism.

Actually, the rise in prices at the gas pump in the U.S. is indeed easily explained -- during his 2008 campaign Obama repeatedly stated that his energy policies would necessarily make the cost of energy skyrocket and Obama appointed as Secretary of Energy a man who said the U.S. should persue energy policies which would increase the cost of gas at the pump to that of Europe ($10/gal and up).

Capitalism and the quest for profit indeed does not respect national boundries - America's capitalist farmers, for example, have for decade after decade provided many times over FREE food to devasted (by natural disaster) and/or starving (due to their communist/socialist governments) countries all over the world than all the communist/socialist farmers of the world COMBINED.

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RE: Electric car growing pains - 3/14/2012 1:05:04 PM   
Musicmystery


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