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New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:08:10 AM   
DaddySatyr


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I have seen many posts on here, referring to our President as "The Kenyan" and other derrogatory terms. I've seen a fair amount of posts that use similar (or worse) invective aimed at "Birthers".

The words in our Constitution upon which the "Birthers" base their objections are simple; "Native born". Unfortunately, the founders didn't really define this for us so all any of us have left to do is interpret; each to our political bent.

One of the objections to President Obama's eligibility to hold office is the assertion that he was not born on American soil (which I tend to believe because of the delay in producing a birth certificate) and the fact that one of his parents was not an American citizen. The story goes: had his father been an American citizen and he had been born in Kenya, he would have met eligibility requirements.

That's not how I interpret "native born" but, that is my mind-set and I would have to agree that it is only my interpretation of the Constitution. Let's suppose that I concede that argument - that President Obama would meet eligibility requirements had his father been a citizen.

but there's a new wrinkle headed this way ...

How many have heard news rumors about a possibly strong name for the Vice Presidential slot; Marco Rubio?

I have done some research into into Senator Rubio and the news ain't good (for "Birthers" that wish to be consistent).

Sen. Rubio's parents came over from Cuba, in either 1956 or 1959, depending upon whose tale one wishes to believe. In the former version, they came because they saw mounting pressures and felt the winds of change in the air and got out, while the gettin' was good.

In the latter version, his parents, oppressed by a dictatorial regime, "escaped" from Cuba to find a life of Freedom in America. This is the version that Sen. Rubio prefers to relate while people that have known his parents since their time together in Cuba, prefer the former time-table.

There is an important distinction. Before The Beard took over, we had a very "cool and groovy" relationship with Cuba and to our way of thinking, life was pretty good for the people down there. It wasn't the same standard that we enjoyed but there was no despotic dictatorship and the people had relative freedom.

After Castro's successful revolution, we viewed the Cubans differently and saw any that made it to our shores as "refugees" to whom we extended every form of welcome and empathy we could muster (and rightly so).

Once Cubans were officially declared a "refugee class" there was a difference in how immigration was handled. If we assume that Sen. Rubio's parents were in this country legally, then we are forced to question why, 12-15 years after their exodus, at the time of the birth of their son, were they not yet American citizens? That's right, The Rubios would not become American citizens until 4 years after Marco's birth.

"But, he was born on American soil!" Yes, he was, to parents who were not American citizens and who may or may not have even been living in this country, legally. I should point out that even if they came over as "refugees", they would still need to complete the proper paperwork in order to stay. That being said; "the proper paperwork" consists of either filing for naturalization or for permenant residence (Green card) which can be obtained through an employer or family member sponsor.

So, now we have a couple of other choices, if they were, indeed, refugees:

1) Were they permenant residents (which means they didn't forfeit their citizenship in or allegience to their mother country)?

2) Were they trying to become US Citizens?

Well, either of those situations is problematic in this case but, let's take the easier one, first:

They were trying to become US citizens; a process which still, in these days after the horrid attacks of 2,001 doesn't take more than 7 years and is generally accelerated in the case of refugees. So, in this scenario: They "escaped" from Cuba in 1959 and did not become citizens until almost 16 years later (1975), which was four years after their son's birth. Were they not willing to become Americans? We can't know what was in their hearts but we can reasonably assume that becoming a citizen was not a priority for them.

The tougher option, to which I already alluded, is that they were permenant residents with no desire to forfeit their Cuban citizenship. If that is the case, surely a person with two parents that have no desire to become American citizens is even less eligible to be a "heart-beat away" from the presidency than a person who had one parent that was a natural-born citizen has to already hold that position?

Am I being silly or mean-spirited, here? Not really. If we are willing to acknowledge that the spirit of the "native-born" requirement was to make sure that a president (or vice president) had no allegience to another country, then we must acknowledge that Mr. Rubio - by the "Birthers'" own definition is not native-born to our land but to Cuba. By "Birther" logic, he's a natural-born Cuban citizen.

I have a love affair with consistency and if "Birthers" wish to be consistent, we need to acknowledge that there is, at the very least, an issue here that bears investigation.

Don't get too happy Obamians! If you wish to hold "Birthers" to consistency, you must not object to Sen. Rubios eligibility, based upon the fact that he was born on American soil.



Peace and comfort,



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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:16:56 AM   
erieangel


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Oh, but I do object to Rubio's eligibility...based upon the fact that he's an idiot!!


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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:23:57 AM   
DaddySatyr


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Not a subjective argument, at all. Well-played, young lady. Well-played.



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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:24:55 AM   
Moonhead


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It's a more reasonable argument than any of that birther nonsense your crew has been laying on teh Kenyan, at least.

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:28:15 AM   
erieangel


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I try.

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:30:16 AM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

Don't get too happy Obamians! If you wish to hold "Birthers" to consistency, you must not object to Sen. Rubios eligibility, based upon the fact that he was born on American soil.


Ummmmm .... Thanks ior the tip ... My bet is Liberals don't give a fuck. If Rubio is ineligible, he should simply keep himself off everyone's list by saying so to the principals. I've got a shocker for you. Liberals don't use their grey matter for a doorstop and won't join the circus. No matter how much you wish that would happen.
And knock off the name calling.



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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:30:41 AM   
Moonhead


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You have your thread title wrong btw: it should be New Birther "Controversy"...

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:33:32 AM   
DomKen


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There is no reasonabe doubt that Obama was born in Hawaii. There is no reasonable doubt that Rubio was born in Florida. Both are eligible to hold the office of President.

It's just that one does hold that office and the other never will.

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:35:32 AM   
Owner59


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It`ll be interesting to see how the cons handle this "controversy".......considering the amount of energy and credibility they`ve wasted on their bigoty-birthery.

The birth issue that will make Mark unelectable was THIS.

WASHINGTON -- Sen. Marco Rubio (R-Fla.) introduced a bill on Monday that would override the Obama administration's new rule on birth control coverage and allow religious hospitals, universities, and other organizations that morally oppose contraception to refuse to cover it for their employees.

Churches and other places of worship are already exempt from the Department of Health and Human Services' mandate, which requires that most health plans cover contraception without a co-pay beginning on Aug. 1, 2013. The Religious Freedom Restoration Act, S. 2043, would expand the refusal clause to include any employer who opposes contraception "on the basis of religious belief."


< Message edited by Owner59 -- 3/11/2012 11:42:15 AM >


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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:36:22 AM   
Moonhead


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Really?
I thought it was more that one was elected despite being a Democrat while the other's a member of God's Own Party...

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:37:18 AM   
LoreBook


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quote:

The words in our Constitution upon which the "Birthers" base their objections are simple; "Native born".
That's not quite right, the actual words are "natural born citizen", which isn't the same thing at all.

The preceding statement represents the views and opinions of the author and the author alone, and should in no way be considered an attempt by the author to define or determine anything for anybody but herself. Except that this time she is, because she knows she's right - she looked it up.


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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:38:13 AM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

It`ll be interesting to see how the cons handle this "controversy".......considering the amount of energy and credibility they`ve wasted on their bigoty-birthery.

Yes, but it's only going to be hypocrisy if a member of teh Kenyan's party votes against Rubio, not if a mad birther on an invalid scooter the taxpayer bought them votes for a hispanic.

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:38:47 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Really?
I thought it was more that one was elected despite being a Democrat while the other's a member of God's Own Party...

Rubio's political career is over after the Blunt-Rubio denial of contraceptives amendment.

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:40:59 AM   
Moonhead


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Right. That'll gloss over any amount of neocon lunatic fringe inconsistency, then.

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:53:55 AM   
DaddySatyr


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Really?
I thought it was more that one was elected despite being a Democrat while the other's a member of God's Own Party...

Rubio's political career is over after the Blunt-Rubio denial of contraceptives amendment.


Marco Rubio will continue to win elections until Florida runs out of old people. They have no dog in the fight when it comes to birth control and will look at how he handles issues important to Floridians.

Now, if you meant to say he's through in national politics, you may be right but, if he continues to represent Florida residents in way in which they agree, he could have a long career ahead of him. Witness: Ted Kennedy who, after spending an entire night praying for the soul of a girl that died in his car due to him being intoxicated, continued to get re-elected for another 30 years in Mass.

Oh! That's right. It was PPLs, voting for him. I forgot.



Peace and comfort,



Michael


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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:55:44 AM   
TheHeretic


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Birthers are idiots

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 11:56:25 AM   
erieangel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Really?
I thought it was more that one was elected despite being a Democrat while the other's a member of God's Own Party...

Rubio's political career is over after the Blunt-Rubio denial of contraceptives amendment.



Which is exactly why he's an idiot. I swear. Some of these politicians can't see the forest for the trees.


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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 1:20:14 PM   
Lucylastic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Birthers are idiots

When you are right, you ARE right:)


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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 1:37:57 PM   
fucktoyprincess


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DaddySatyr, forgive me if I'm wrong, but you are asking the extreme right NOT to be hypocritical and investigate Rubio's birth? Fat chance....they can only be what they are, and that is hypocritical.

For the record, I don't think liberals care about Rubio's birth history. I know I don't. I care about what policies people support and what vision they have for society going forward.

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RE: New "Birther" Controversy - 3/11/2012 2:08:31 PM   
kalikshama


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Perhaps the saddest part about Kennedy's passing is that he has been both one of the most senior members of the Senate and one that worked to pass some of the most important legislation that has made America great. Without him, I fear that the legislative work on behalf of those most in need will suffer without him.

We've gathered a sampling of the work he has done for women and minorities. He accomplished much in his lifetime, but some of the work he started remains unfinished. The list is by no means comprehensive, but is meant to serve as a tribute to his work in public service.

Gender Equity: Kennedy saw the Senate of the Equal Rights Amendment in 1972, which aimed to make men and women equal in the constitution. He reintroduced the legislation again this congressional session, but it has yet to make it into the constitution.

Kennnedy championed Title IX of the Civil Rights Act in 1972, which prevented educational institutions from discriminating against women (afterward, colleges and universities integrated, paving the way for women like Sonia Sotomayor and Hillary Clinton to attend Ivy League institutions), as well as requiring equitable athletic opportunities.

Civil Rights: Kennedy saw the passage of the Civil Rights Restoration Act of 1988 as committee chairman, which strengthened the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Afterward, then-executive director of the Leadership Council on Civil Rights Ralph Neas said, "Now you see what happens when you have a civil rights champion in charge of the committee."

He was also chief sponsor on the Civil Rights Act of 1991, which addressed intentional discrimination and harassment in the workplace. He was also a key sponsor of legislation by the same name in 2008, which sought to restore civil rights protections stripped by Supreme Court rulings in recent years (like the Lilly Ledbetter case).

Pay Equity: Kennedy worked on the Fair Pay Restoration Act, which sought to restore the rights of women to sue with each discriminatory paycheck, overturning the Supreme Court ruling in Ledbetter v. Goodyear.

Voting Rights: Kennedy worked on the Voting Rights Act of 1965, which allowed equal access to voting as part of the Civil Rights movement. He also worked to add amendments in 1982 that expanded voting access to Native Americans, Latinos, and others who required language assistance.

Affirmative Action: Kennedy helped defeat legislation that would have ended federal affirmative action in 1998 and joined his colleagues in the Senate in filing a brief urging the Supreme Court to uphold affirmative action in 2003.

LGBT Rights: Kennedy has been the chief sponsor of the Employment Non-Discrimination Act since 1994, which would make it illegal to discriminate on the basis of sexual orientation in the workplace. The bill has yet to pass.

Hate Crimes: Kennedy worked on the Matthew Shepard Local Law Enforcement Hate Crimes Prevention Act in 2007, which would implement more severe penalties for crimes against women, gays, lesbians, and transgender persons. The bill was vetoed by President Bush in 2007, but the legislation has been reintroduced in the 110th Congress.

HIV/AIDS: Kennedy introduced what became the Ryan White CARE Act, which addressed thirteen cities hit hardest by the HIV/AIDS crisis in 1990. When it was up for reauthorization in 2000, it provided nearly $9 billion in HIV/AIDS services over the following five years.

Domestic Violence: Kennedy worked with Vice President Joe Biden on the 1994 Violence Against Women Act. He also worked on its reauthorization in 2000, which allowed immigrant women to apply for permanent status in the United States without their abusive partners.

Disability Equity: Kennedy worked to pass the Americans with Disabilities Act in 1990, which provided much-needed accommodations for those with disabilities.

Minimum Wage: Kennedy worked with Congress in 2007 to pass the first hike in the minimum wage in more than a decade. Women disproportionately make up the population low-wage hourly workers.

Women in Combat: Kennedy championed the repeal a ban of women in combat in 1991. Women are still technically barred from fighting on the "front lines," such stipulations are meaningless in modern combat. By working for legislation that repealed archaic legislation, Kennedy helped women achieve more equality in the military.

Military Child Care
: In 1989, Kennedy saw the passage of the National Military Child Care Act, which established the Department of Defense's child care program. This allowed working spouses of military members and women who were enlisted themselves to have access to high-quality, federally funded child care.

Health Insurance for Children and Pregnant Women: In 1997, Kennedy co-sponsored the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP), allowing families to have access to health care that previously didn't. Kennedy also introduced legislation that has yet to pass, Affordable Health Care Act, which would expand Medicaid and SCHIP coverage for children, pregnant women, and the disabled.

He saw the passage of the Pregnancy Discrimination Act in 1978, which made it illegal for employers to fire women for leave taken due to pregnancy. We still don't require employers to provide paid maternity leave.

Minority Health Care: Kennedy championed the The Minority Health and Health Disparities Research and Education Act in 2000, which provided funding for research for how to reduce disparities in cancer, heart disease, HIV/AIDS, diabetes, and other severe health problems that are found to be significantly higher in minority populations. In 2006, he introduced the Minority Health Improvement and Health Disparity Elimination Act, which would address inequalities in health care access and treatment if passed.

The Inclusion of Women in Scientific and Medical Research: Kennedy co-sponsored the NIH Revitalization Act of 1993, legislation that called for the inclusion of women and minorities in federally funded clinical research.

http://jezebel.com/5345863/the-lion-sleeps-tonight-ted-kennedy-leaves-long-impressive-legacy

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