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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 4:19:51 PM   
LoreBook


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quote:

The reason is fairly simple: no one can honestly say that abortion is not an emotionally gut-wrenching experience for the woman undergoing the procedure. It may not be that day or two weeks later but, at some point, the woman is going to experience some kind of emotional agony over her decision.
So your solution is to make it even harder for her. That makes loads of sense. 

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 4:30:35 PM   
JanahX


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I would be money you would find some of these GOPs over in the FET Breeders groups. (under some SOCK of course) If it were up to them - every female would be pregnant every year of her life until she was menopausal.

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 4:33:35 PM   
LoreBook


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And they'd probably pass some law making that (menopause) as onerous as possible too.

< Message edited by LoreBook -- 3/22/2012 4:34:05 PM >


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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 4:51:15 PM   
Iamsemisweet


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The problem isn't that your position is "far from popular".  The problem is that your position is breathtakingly ignorant.

I am going to go out on a limb here, and assume that you have never had an abortion.  What is the basis for your knowledge that the procedure is not explained in some detail?  I had an abortion when I was younger, and I remember the process being described in excruciating detail.  In these days of informed consent laws, I seriously doubt that has changed.  But, if you have info to the contrary, let's hear it.  While you are at it, perhaps you can explain how an ultrasound contributes to "knowledge of the procedure."

Unlike you, apparently, I don't believe I can speak for all women, or even all women who have had abortions.  I can assure you that I did not "experience some kind of emotional agony" about the decision, EXCEPT for the agony of pushing my way through anti abortion protesters waiving pictures of dead fetuses in my face.  Just because you say something is true, doesn't make it so, you know.  So, since you are obviously all knowing about both women and mental health, perhaps you can explain the basis for your rather extraordinary statement that "the woman is going to experience some kind of emotional agony over her decision."

Since you seem to believe that only a woman has never undergone an abortion needs to have the procedure explained to them in some detail, do I get a bye on that, since I have already had an abortion?  What if the woman is basically not interested in the information, and just wants to get the damn thing out of her?  Does she have to sit through a tutorial also?

I forgot, you are all knowing in the medical field also.  Perhaps you could explain the basis for your statement regarding the "pain sensory ability of the un-born life."

Since you believe that the father should have a veto power in the decision to abort, do you also support my idea that in doing so, he needs to post a bond or similar proof of his financial ability to support a child?  I don't know about you, but particularly when I was younger, I would have had better things to do with my time than chasing down some deadbeat every month for a child support check.  If I was forced to carry a child and then raise it because I couldn't get "permission", I would want my money up front.  Agreed?

quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

I know my position is far from popular but a woman/girl who has never undergone an abortion should, at least, have the abortion explained to them in some detail; as people undergoing just about any other procedure seem to insist upon. This seems to be the one area where a patient wants to hear less from their doctor instead of more. I wonder if there's a reason for that. Of course there is.

The reason is fairly simple: no one can honestly say that abortion is not an emotionally gut-wrenching experience for the woman undergoing the procedure. It may not be that day or two weeks later but, at some point, the woman is going to experience some kind of emotional agony over her decision.

If we removed the word "abortion" from the argument and described the heartbreak and damage done by this action and then, explained that doctors should give less information to the patients about to undergo it, there'd be all kinds of out-cry. Instead, we have people who disregard the humanity and pain sensory ability of the un-born life in question because it helps them sleep better at night.



Peace and comfort,



Michael




< Message edited by Iamsemisweet -- 3/22/2012 4:54:03 PM >


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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 6:13:58 PM   
DaddySatyr


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

at home tests can run up to 10 dollars in some areas. plan b costs up to 50 dollars



I wasn't going to address this, initially but, I did some research. I am assuming that you would be willing to accept Planned Parenthood as an authority on the subject so, here are just a couple of facts from their website:

Morning After Pill/Plan B

quote:

ORIGINAL: From the above link

Morning-After Pill (Emergency Contraception) at a Glance

Birth control you can use to prevent pregnancy up to five days (120 hours) after unprotected sex
Two kinds of emergency contraception — morning-after pill and IUD insertion
Safe and effective
Available at health centers and drugstores
Costs vary from $10 to $70 for the morning-after pill and up to $500 for IUD insertion



So, "Plan B" can actually run up to $70 and it is effective much longer than I thought (I thought it was 48-72 hours with a decreasing effectiveness after 48 hours)

Abortion costs

quote:

ORIGINAL: From the above link

In-Clinic Abortion Procedures at a Glance

Medical procedures that end pregnancy
Safe and effective
Available from many Planned Parenthood health centers
Costs about $300–$950 in the first trimester



If we are to base the argument strictly on economics, "Plan B" is much cheaper than abortion. I would further add that while this is fairly new and the jury is still out, it has been my experience that this doesn't cause the same emotional damage to ladies that opt for it. Obviously, I think it has to do with the lady not knowing for sure and I am all for offering that comfort to a lady that faces this life-changing decision.

I do not discredit the fact that "Plan B" might not be an option for everyone (allergies to the medicine, etc.) but arguing cost-effectiveness doesn't hold up.



Peace and comfort,



Michael


< Message edited by DaddySatyr -- 3/22/2012 6:14:52 PM >


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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 6:16:02 PM   
tj444


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I had one when i was younger also but unlike you, i lived in Canada and there was none of what you describe. No protesters, no detailed description other than we will put you to sleep and when you wake up you will feel groggy and need someone to drive you home.. And I have also not felt emotional agony in the years since.. it was the best decision as i would not marry the father even if he wanted to, in fact, i never asked for his opinion on it and he never gave it.. He was someone i was with for a long time but I believed at that time kids needed a 2 parent home and that wasnt going to happen with him. He accepted it was my decision alone.. Honestly, I find certain things that go on in the US are barbaric (in comparison to Canada).. I would never have a child of mine born in this country, I would see to it that any/all kids of mine are born in Canada.

I wonder how many of these men that are so against women having control of their body were busy sowing their wild oats without condoms or birth control or casual sex not thinking about possible consequences in their younger years..

quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet
The problem isn't that your position is "far from popular".  The problem is that your position is breathtakingly ignorant.

I am going to go out on a limb here, and assume that you have never had an abortion.  What is the basis for your knowledge that the procedure is not explained in some detail?  I had an abortion when I was younger, and I remember the process being described in excruciating detail.  In these days of informed consent laws, I seriously doubt that has changed.  But, if you have info to the contrary, let's hear it.  While you are at it, perhaps you can explain how an ultrasound contributes to "knowledge of the procedure."

Unlike you, apparently, I don't believe I can speak for all women, or even all women who have had abortions.  I can assure you that I did not "experience some kind of emotional agony" about the decision, EXCEPT for the agony of pushing my way through anti abortion protesters waiving pictures of dead fetuses in my face.  Just because you say something is true, doesn't make it so, you know.  So, since you are obviously all knowing about both women and mental health, perhaps you can explain the basis for your rather extraordinary statement that "the woman is going to experience some kind of emotional agony over her decision."

Since you seem to believe that only a woman has never undergone an abortion needs to have the procedure explained to them in some detail, do I get a bye on that, since I have already had an abortion?  What if the woman is basically not interested in the information, and just wants to get the damn thing out of her?  Does she have to sit through a tutorial also?

I forgot, you are all knowing in the medical field also.  Perhaps you could explain the basis for your statement regarding the "pain sensory ability of the un-born life."

Since you believe that the father should have a veto power in the decision to abort, do you also support my idea that in doing so, he needs to post a bond or similar proof of his financial ability to support a child?  I don't know about you, but particularly when I was younger, I would have had better things to do with my time than chasing down some deadbeat every month for a child support check.  If I was forced to carry a child and then raise it because I couldn't get "permission", I would want my money up front.  Agreed?

quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

I know my position is far from popular but a woman/girl who has never undergone an abortion should, at least, have the abortion explained to them in some detail; as people undergoing just about any other procedure seem to insist upon. This seems to be the one area where a patient wants to hear less from their doctor instead of more. I wonder if there's a reason for that. Of course there is.

The reason is fairly simple: no one can honestly say that abortion is not an emotionally gut-wrenching experience for the woman undergoing the procedure. It may not be that day or two weeks later but, at some point, the woman is going to experience some kind of emotional agony over her decision.

If we removed the word "abortion" from the argument and described the heartbreak and damage done by this action and then, explained that doctors should give less information to the patients about to undergo it, there'd be all kinds of out-cry. Instead, we have people who disregard the humanity and pain sensory ability of the un-born life in question because it helps them sleep better at night.



Peace and comfort,



Michael






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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 6:42:40 PM   
JanahX


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No theyre not. Nice generalizing. Well done.

quote:

It may not be that day or two weeks later but, at some point, the woman is going to experience some kind of emotional agony over her decision.


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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 8:18:49 PM   
SpiritedRadiance


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Its a shame that men like you think its completely okay to force a woman to carry a child to term even if they do not wish..

Its because of people like you that i question the sanity of a man when it comes to my own uterus. You already are for Shoving something in someones uterus with out their consent per the trans-vaginal ultrasound (That cannot be considered rape, because i mean the woman is consenting to having an abortion, I mean she should be just fine with having a 6 to 10 inch probe shoved in her cunt as well...) , and making it consensual, for god knows what else. How would I know if someone like you wouldnt force a woman like me, who pregnancy is unhealthy for to say the least, where its nearly 100% likely i will die from it, to carry a child to term.

The thing you call an infant, that thing you can an unborn innocent life, isnt as such. It isnt until it tears its way out of the womans vagina usually destroying it in the process. Until then its nothing more then a parasite that cannot live on its own. And if someone wishes to treat it like they would a tapeworm or parasite, then they should be allowed.

Its their life being risked not yours
Its their bodies being destroyed not yours
its their careers that suffer not yours
its their everything thats being fucked up not yours..

But you don't care.. as long as you... force her to carry your baby to term.. Shove something non consensually in her vagina via a transvaginal ultrasound.... because you know sooooo much about women and thier bodies and safety...


By the way:

Rape is defined:
to Force (another person) to have sexual intercourse with them, or by use of an object against a persons consent, esp. by the threat or use of violence against them.

I think Forcing a woman to have a prop between 6 inches to 10 inches in length shoved in ones cunt, with out ones consent is rape.. There for someone whos for such a procedure to be done, is condoning and accepting the rape of another person




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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 8:46:43 PM   
LoreBook


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I don't suppose it crossed your mind that for the most part, the emotional damage and trauma that a woman goes through as a result of deciding to have an abortion is directly, and quite deliberately, caused by opponents of abortion rather than by the procedure itself.

This new law, and others like it, is simply a continuation of that practice.



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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 9:40:59 PM   
SpiritedRadiance


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LB its torture, I took a friend to a PP to get a sonogram, the only time they do those services are on Tuesdays which is also the only day they do abortions, I had someone ask my friend and myself how it feels, knowing i killed my baby, if i got off on being a whore, what my rates were. I had things thrown at my car, i was spit on, I was tripped.

All because my friend wanted to make sure her baby was healthy, and she didnt have insurance.

This was on top of the photos of fetus's aborted after 25 weeks, or from miscarriages.



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"Theres nothing in life like the feeling of cool leather sliding over your skin, the tears that fill your eyes as you realize someone else thinks you deserve it even if you havent reached that conclusion yet"- Forever to remember 11/5/11

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 9:49:28 PM   
ShibsStories


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Where was that at SR?
I've never been to a protest.
Do they hold pro choice protests outside PP's at the same time as well? Could be fun, instigating the anti-choice folks.
I could hand out aborted baby jello shots while dressed in a slutty nurses outfit.
(jello shots with a sourpatch kid inside)

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 9:54:41 PM   
SpiritedRadiance


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The Planned Parenthood in West Chester PA,

And its only Pro lifers, and Planned parenthood has to pay 200 dollars per security person they have to hire to keep their patients safe.

I wouldnt add to it only because it would require more security staff and possibly police escorts, most of the people who are going to planned parenthood really dont want everything known..

I know they take pictures of the people who go in, and post them on posters talking about child killers...

Its really sickening

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 10:00:40 PM   
ShibsStories


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That is not to far to check out.
The PP I go to has never had any protests I know of.
A part of me is a bit in denial that there can really be so many people doing such awful things- and believing in them.
I hear about it all the time online and tv, but would be interesting to check it out in person.

Doesn't the pictures on posters count as harassment or some other legally prosecutable offense?

The whole issue just makes me so angry.

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/22/2012 10:40:49 PM   
SpiritedRadiance


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ShibsStories

That is not to far to check out.
The PP I go to has never had any protests I know of.
A part of me is a bit in denial that there can really be so many people doing such awful things- and believing in them.
I hear about it all the time online and tv, but would be interesting to check it out in person.

Doesn't the pictures on posters count as harassment or some other legally prosecutable offense?

The whole issue just makes me so angry.



No only because they are on the public property and do not step foot on the actual premise..

Any Planned parenthood abortion center has these psychos... Its really terrible to see and experience..

_____________________________

"Theres nothing in life like the feeling of cool leather sliding over your skin, the tears that fill your eyes as you realize someone else thinks you deserve it even if you havent reached that conclusion yet"- Forever to remember 11/5/11

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/23/2012 4:39:07 AM   
farglebargle


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The counter to this is to LOUDLY DENOUNCE anyone who supports this shit as "Sick Perverts Who Use Their Religion To Promote Their Dominance and Submission Lifestyle".

Just point out that there's no difference between them and Goreans should do the trick.


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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/23/2012 6:26:24 AM   
kalikshama


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quote:

I don't understand with the advancement in "technology" how a woman, bent on infanticide could possibly need 24 weeks to find out that she's pregnant and then to decide (since it seems most already have) that abortion is their chosen course of action. There are at-home OTC pregnancy tests that are reliable after ... what ... 72 hours? 120? 168? I just saw a commercial for "plan B", the other night on television. Isn't that good enough or do we really need to wait until that life is capable of feeling pain before we rip its head off with a doctor's noose?


Nice hyperbole. You must have everyone on Hide who has mentioned this before:

88% of all abortions in the United States are obtained within the first 12-13 weeks after the last menstrual period (LMP).

As you have me on hide as well, perhaps someone will be so kind as to quote it.

Perhaps you have IASS on Hide as well:

quote:

According to multiple studies, including one in 2005, scientists generally agree that fetuses can’t feel pain until well into the third trimester after 24 weeks. The 2005 study suggests 28 weeks. Abortions after 24 weeks are already allowed to be limited by states under the 1973 Roe v. Wade decision made by the Supreme Court. But since most abortions occur prior to 24 weeks anyway, Proud really doesn’t have a case.

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/23/2012 6:27:43 AM   
farglebargle


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I thought you needed to have a BIRTH CERTIFICATE and be a CITIZEN before you got any constitutional protections?

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/23/2012 6:40:39 AM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

maybe everyone who has an operation because of their choice, should have to see what happens during "their operations"
Maybe not get pain killers, and be made to see the result of their drunken drives car crash did to the body of a twenty year old. or stay awake while the doctor breaks their leg and resets it with pins and plates. Maybe a man should be made to see what the internal organs of his wife look like after he impregated her
This cupid stunt needs to see what her own lobotomy looked like...




while I am in total agreement with the point you are trying to make. I would have no problems if they started making drunk drivers see what the crash they caused did to whoever was unlucky enough to get in their way.

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/23/2012 6:50:19 AM   
GotSteel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967
I say the father should be able to abort any mother that aborts his child without permission.


Is advocating murder really within the TOS? Anybody?

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RE: Abortion Permission Slips from Men - 3/23/2012 6:54:04 AM   
SpiritedRadiance


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Its okay gotsteel.. its a man advocating a crime against a woman.. that's not illegal women don't have rights.... There are just breeding stock.. they don't have things like feelings or emotions or thoughts...

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