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RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 1:38:21 AM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
quote:

When I was in middle school I had *no one*. I was picked on routinely until someone pushed me too far. A few bruised jaws and a weight-lifting class later -- no one fucked with me anymore.


http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4096444

No problems on my end... you seem to forget what you write.

Oh no...the problem is still on your end. Read that sentence carefully. I stated I was picked on in middle school until I was pushed too far. I never stated the weight-lifting class was in middle school, merely that after it, no one messed with me anymore. In other words, it's what's called making a long story short. I saw no reason to detail an intricate timeline for people who wouldn't read it anyway.

Reading comprehension is your friend, well...apparently not yours, but most people's.


You can state it how you wish, DM. What you wrote implies that you took up weight-lifting classes in middle school. If that is untrue, its not Tazzy's or my fault; Your original post was not made clear enough. If we were to post the original message as a poll, and ask when the person voting thought you took up weight-lifting classes, I believe most would state 'Middle School'. As you give no evidence you took up such a class at any other time in your education. Finally, insulting people for your mistakes is a bit....over the line....

(in reply to DarqueMirror)
Profile   Post #: 101
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 1:54:56 AM   
DarqueMirror


Posts: 1262
Joined: 3/21/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
You can state it how you wish, DM. What you wrote implies that you took up weight-lifting classes in middle school. If that is untrue, its not Tazzy's or my fault; Your original post was not made clear enough. If we were to post the original message as a poll, and ask when the person voting thought you took up weight-lifting classes, I believe most would state 'Middle School'. As you give no evidence you took up such a class at any other time in your education. Finally, insulting people for your mistakes is a bit....over the line....


You know, if that one post existed in a vacuum, with no other subsequent posts or conversation, you *might* have a point. However, as the subsequent posts elaborated on that summary, I'd say things were very clear. It was her mistake to assume that each post existed on its own and that I was "changing my story," when in fact I was just providing additional details.

See claims like hers that I'm "changing my story" is really all she can default to because it's unfathomable to her that my stance on this issue could be what it is if I was been bullied in school and had to stand up for myself. See, simply taking my word that I was bullied doesn't help her position that I am "just stirring things up." So she has to claim that I was never bullied and claim as her "evidence" that I'm "changing my story" based off one post.

So yes, the problem is on her end. I do have the stance I do and I hold that stance after having been bullied and standing up to those bullies. The rest of this is just smokescreen antics at their finest.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 102
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 2:40:58 AM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror
quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
You can state it how you wish, DM. What you wrote implies that you took up weight-lifting classes in middle school. If that is untrue, its not Tazzy's or my fault; Your original post was not made clear enough. If we were to post the original message as a poll, and ask when the person voting thought you took up weight-lifting classes, I believe most would state 'Middle School'. As you give no evidence you took up such a class at any other time in your education. Finally, insulting people for your mistakes is a bit....over the line....

You know, if that one post existed in a vacuum, with no other subsequent posts or conversation, you *might* have a point. However, as the subsequent posts elaborated on that summary, I'd say things were very clear. It was her mistake to assume that each post existed on its own and that I was "changing my story," when in fact I was just providing additional details.

See claims like hers that I'm "changing my story" is really all she can default to because it's unfathomable to her that my stance on this issue could be what it is if I was been bullied in school and had to stand up for myself. See, simply taking my word that I was bullied doesn't help her position that I am "just stirring things up." So she has to claim that I was never bullied and claim as her "evidence" that I'm "changing my story" based off one post.

So yes, the problem is on her end. I do have the stance I do and I hold that stance after having been bullied and standing up to those bullies. The rest of this is just smokescreen antics at their finest.


You failed in three paragraphs to set the record straight. That is about as simple as I can make it. Ever heard of the expression "If your in a hole, stop digging'? I dont know your personal history, so pardon me if I get it wrong in retelling it....

"Ok, what I said was not totally correct, so allow me to set the record straight. I was bullied in middle school. When I was about to venture into high school, I took weight lifting classes in the summer of my freshman year. In those three or four short months I went from being scrawny to decently muscular. Showing alittle muscle made the bully think twice about picking on me in the future."

I was pointing out that you were attacking Tazzy over some 'reading comprehension' when it appeared what you stated would lead me to the same conclusion. Simply stating the record straight would save you alot of headaches. If your not comfortable with posting your life's history, send a private message. Tazzy doesnt bite....much....

< Message edited by joether -- 4/23/2012 2:41:32 AM >

(in reply to DarqueMirror)
Profile   Post #: 103
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 4:21:02 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
Good for you! Not every middle school has one. Not every kid who is bullied can bench press. And not every bully backs down. Blaming the victim for the crimes of the bully is just another form of bullying.


I'm not blaming the victims. I'm blaming those who don't show them how to stand up for themselves and who coddle them by telling them to rat out those mean kids (assuring they only get bullied more for being a snitch).


http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4097017

He didnt clear it up here... where I specifically pointed out his statement...

In fact, his back peddling didnt start until two of his posts later.

And of course I dont bite... much.... only as much as you guys enjoy

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 104
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 4:53:26 AM   
DarqueMirror


Posts: 1262
Joined: 3/21/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
You failed in three paragraphs to set the record straight.


Your failure to grasp a simple concept doesn't equate to my failure to "set the record straight." There's no record to set straight. I've plainly stated what happened. I can't and won't spoon feed the illiterate. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
"Ok, what I said was not totally correct, so allow me to set the record straight. I was bullied in middle school. When I was about to venture into high school, I took weight lifting classes in the summer of my freshman year. In those three or four short months I went from being scrawny to decently muscular. Showing alittle muscle made the bully think twice about picking on me in the future."


Nope.


quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
I was pointing out that you were attacking Tazzy over some 'reading comprehension' when it appeared what you stated would lead me to the same conclusion. Simply stating the record straight would save you alot of headaches. If your not comfortable with posting your life's history, send a private message. Tazzy doesnt bite....much....


I wasn't "attacking" anyone. I was commenting on her lack of reading comprehension...which you seem to share.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 105
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 4:56:13 AM   
DarqueMirror


Posts: 1262
Joined: 3/21/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4097017

He didnt clear it up here... where I specifically pointed out his statement...


I didn't "clear it up there" because there was nothing to "clean up." You didn't mention in that reply that you didn't understand what I meant. You just continued right along with the conversation, suggesting (incorrectly) to those you were addressing that you comprehended what they what was said.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
In fact, his back peddling didnt start until two of his posts later.


God I love the inevitable "back peddling" accusations. They really show who can comprehend and who cannot.

Let me try and help you both out -- Message boards are like a internet "conversation." Suppose the three of us were sitting face-to-face talking and I said my original comment about the bullying and weight-lifting. If you both didn't understand, I'd see a look on your face suggesting that. After you *asked* for more details or clarification, you'd get it. That wouldn't be "back peddling" it would be continuing the conversation and clearing up something you obviously misunderstood.

Again...what I said was perfectly plain english. So, if you got the wrong idea, you should have ASKED for clarification before continuing the conversation as though you knew what you were talking about. To FAIL to ask for clarification is roughly akin to simply smiling and nodding in a face-to-face conversation even though you have no clue what was just said.



< Message edited by DarqueMirror -- 4/23/2012 4:59:13 AM >

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 106
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 5:09:40 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		~yawns

You are still trying. and failing. Have a wonderful day!

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to DarqueMirror)
Profile   Post #: 107
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 8:19:07 AM   
Iamsemisweet


Posts: 3651
Joined: 4/9/2011
From: The Great Northwest, USA
Status: offline 		The other problem with the whole "stand up for yourself" attitude is that it just isn't practical. If you are a 105 lb geek being picked on by the 200 pound football player, how are you going to stand up for yourself, short of taking a weapon to school? Not exactly a positive approach.
Parents and the schools do need to be more actively involved, and there needs to be substantial penalties for parents who take the attitude that their kids' bullying behavior is just kids being kids. Parents need to teach their kids that not only is bullying not OK, witnessing it in silence isn't ok either.
The schools need to intervene, too. A young girl here recently hung herself. When the story was first reported, no one seemed to know her motive. The school provided grief counseling and her schoolmates held a candlelight vigil, the little assholes. Then it came out that this girl was the victim of nonstop, widespread bullying that no one did a thing about. She desperately changed her hair, lost weight, changed the way she dressed, in an attempt to stop the cruelty, until finally, she gave up.
A co worker treating another like that is unproductive and wouldn't be tolerated in a work situation. Why do we put up with it in schools?

_____________________________

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people.
The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

(in reply to Jaquin)
Profile   Post #: 108
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 8:52:00 AM   
DarqueMirror


Posts: 1262
Joined: 3/21/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
You are still trying. and failing. Have a wonderful day!


And you're still illiterate. Have a wonderful day yourself!

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 109
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 8:55:37 AM   
DarqueMirror


Posts: 1262
Joined: 3/21/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

The other problem with the whole "stand up for yourself" attitude is that it just isn't practical. If you are a 105 lb geek being picked on by the 200 pound football player, how are you going to stand up for yourself, short of taking a weapon to school?


As I said before, the act of standing up for yourself doesn't guarantee you won't get hurt or that you'll win and be the hero. It just means you take a stand and show the bully you aren't an easy target. I didn't "win" all the times I stood up for myself. But I made damned sure that the bully felt some pain too.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet
Not exactly a positive approach.


Neither is telling them to run, hide and taddle. Because they do that, and the next day they get bullied just as hard...perhaps in a place the teachers can't see/get to. Then where's the victim going to be?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet
She desperately changed her hair, lost weight, changed the way she dressed, in an attempt to stop the cruelty, until finally, she gave up.


Those last three words are the key in that statement. She. gave. up. She let them win. She tried to appease them, like Churchill to Hitler...and it didn't work.

(in reply to Iamsemisweet)
Profile   Post #: 110
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 9:07:10 AM   
Iamsemisweet


Posts: 3651
Joined: 4/9/2011
From: The Great Northwest, USA
Status: offline 		Whatever DM. As a parent, I was not interested in sending my kid to a place where they were physically injured and tortured by their peers. I think we have more of a responsibility to our kids than that. Bottom line, if I were the 105 weakling, I would opt to take the weapon to school,rather than engage in a quixotic attempt to fight back and cause the bully a little pain, little being the operative word. Your school years sound like they were very sad. I am sorry.
Yes, the poor girl gave up. Guess she should have shot up the fucking lunch room, instead, and taken a few of the little assholes with her.

_____________________________

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people.
The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

(in reply to DarqueMirror)
Profile   Post #: 111
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 10:22:56 AM   
papassion


Posts: 487
Joined: 3/28/2012
Status: offline
Sometimes it takes a threat of a lawsuit to make the school adminstators do their job to protect all students. We had a situation in our school district (Johnstown school district) where a lesbian was giving unwanted advances to another female student. The school officials were informed and did nothing. (the school administrator, at the time, is gay. I don't know if this had anything to do with no action taken by the school) The parents got tired of the "no action" by the school and got a lawyer and went to the police. The (Johnstown) police investigated and the lesbian was charged with assault. Thats how bad it got.

The lame excuse the school administrators gave for their intolerable "ignorning" the situation, was they didn't want to give the impression of being biased against the lesbian student! Can any normal person see how correcting a bully, (gay or straight) would be seen as bias?

These administrators should have been fired en mass for such stupid liberal logic! I had the court case number here somewhere but don't know how the lawsuit went. Anyone who thinks this is bullshit and knows how to find it, can go to our paper, Tribdem.com (The Johnstown Tribune Democrat ) Johnstown, Pennsylvania

(in reply to DarqueMirror)
Profile   Post #: 112
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 10:24:48 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
You are still trying. and failing. Have a wonderful day!


And you're still illiterate. Have a wonderful day yourself!




lol.. you wish I were. Problem is, I am not, and that pisses you off when you are caught in your own web of lies.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to DarqueMirror)
Profile   Post #: 113
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 11:37:53 AM   
subrob1967


Posts: 4591
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline 		FR
You want to end bullying? Simple enough, teach the kids over the internet. They'll never have to leave their house, or get picked on, and just think of the billions we could save by eliminating schools, and way overpaid administrators! One teacher per fifteen students, is your answer.

_____________________________

http://www.extra-life.org/

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 114
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 11:41:53 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

FR
You want to end bullying? Simple enough, teach the kids over the internet. They'll never have to leave their house, or get picked on, and just think of the billions we could save by eliminating schools, and way overpaid administrators! One teacher per fifteen students, is your answer.


I did homeschool my son past the 6th grade. Wasnt because of bullies, he learned to handle them with help of karate.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 115
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 11:56:28 AM   
CastleRock32


Posts: 29
Joined: 10/2/2010
Status: offline 		DM: You say you aren't blaming the victims, but your suggestion for solving the problem is for the victims to change. If the discussion were about rape, and you suggested that to avoid rape, scantily dressed women should wear more modest attire, that would be called blaming the victim. Don't you see how insulting it is to say that the solution is for the peaceful child to learn violence? I'm not saying anti-bullying programs always work, and I'm sure as hell not saying that kids should not be taught (as in, on an ongoing basis, as part of growth) to learn independent problem solving. Adults are around b/c kids don't know everything about being adults. And in this case, the fault is NOT with the victimized kids. It's with the bullies.

You indicated that someone made a better victim by not becoming like their bullies. Your statements indicate that you did in fact turn into a bully yourself. After all, in your mind, becoming like your bullies is what made you less of an "easy target" right?

Your accusation of cowardice towards KIDS who kill themselves due to bullying further shows this. I actually believe you that you were bullied. I simply find your response to it (to become a bully yourself) sad, unfortunately typical, and a demonstration of why OTHER means of handling bullies are desperately needed.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 116
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 1:57:00 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CastleRock32
I'm sure as hell not saying that kids should not be taught (as in, on an ongoing basis, as part of growth) to learn independent problem solving

There have been a few objections to that one raised, often from the right.
The loathsome Jerry Pournelle once observed that if you give a bunch of novices fencing gear and leave them to it, they'll quickly problem solve their way to so many bad habits that they'll never be able to learn to fence worth a damn...

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to CastleRock32)
Profile   Post #: 117
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 3:43:27 PM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
Yes, you did. You said your parents were bullies.


Ohhhhh another illiterate one. Please show me where I said that my parents were bullies. I'd love to see that.

You're right, I read it wrong.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
I am also guessing that is why you decided to start lifting weights so you could defend yourself.


You'd be wrong. I stared lifting weights because it was the only gym class that appealed to me in high school.


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
And now you think all kids should be raised with this approach? Sorry, but to me it's just sad.


What's sad to me is how we're pussifying the country by telling our kids to run and hide from or rat on anyone who "hurts their feelings." Pretty soon, we'll see penalty flags thrown and charges filed in an NFL game for "trash talk."

That's right, teach them that kicking someones ass is the answer to all their problems. That should help



_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to DarqueMirror)
Profile   Post #: 118
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 4:03:59 PM   
angelikaJ


Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline 		DM,

You assert that suicide is the coward's choice.

It isn't.

It happens when the pain someone is in exceeds a person's resources for coping with that pain.


_____________________________

The original home of the caffeinated psychotic hair pixies.
(as deemed by He who owns me)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_3234821/tm.htm

30 fluffy points!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQjuCQd01sg

(in reply to DarqueMirror)
Profile   Post #: 119
RE: Bullying... the results - 4/23/2012 5:18:21 PM   
Kaliko


Posts: 3381
Joined: 9/25/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

FR
You want to end bullying? Simple enough, teach the kids over the internet. They'll never have to leave their house, or get picked on, and just think of the billions we could save by eliminating schools, and way overpaid administrators! One teacher per fifteen students, is your answer.



Cyberbullying.

(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 120
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