RE: Witch Hunts (Full Version)

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trippingdaisy -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:04:21 AM)

i haven't been here long enough to truly see that sort of thing, but i've frequented other forums off and on...and it's everywhere.

i have a feeling it's got something to do with the semi-anonymity that people in general have online. It allows them to express opinions, hurtful or not, without any REAL consequences. Therefore, it ends up being some sort of odd catharsis. Strange, but...that's the only thing i can figure.

Occasionally, it could be more personal. One person doesn't like this other person...and instead of working it out privately, or just deciding to remove themselves from the situation and not being any negativity...they end up stirring up trouble, just to cause drama. i've seen WAY too many drama queens/kings in my time, and it all seems to be online.

Most people tend to watch what they say and do when there is a chance of real, face to face consequences.



OedipusRexIt -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:05:10 AM)

I've wandered into a couple by mistake, thinking it was a genuine topic for discussion, not an  "outing" of someone's percevied bad behavior.

Good topic.  Tough, grey area sometimes.  Now if I read the postings and it looks like a witch hunt, I don't get involved by posting.



champagnewishes -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:13:47 AM)

Mercnbeth summed it up quite nicely. 

The only thing i can add is something i pointed out on a thread regarding trust.  Many people live their life with a hidden agenda...they do it well.  It is easy for an unsuspecting person to become a pawn in their agenda and not realize it until they find themselves in the middle of it...and by then, the witch hunt is already in full swing.  



HollyS -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:19:33 AM)

Wow... 

I tend to take a more generous view of most posters.  There are many topics that push people's buttons, for whatever reason.  Often a "What do you think?" post is a way for the poster to hear alternate viewpoints, find out if their opinion is validated, and generally get feedback on something bothering them.  Sure, some are looking for attention, trying to stir the pot, acting on a vendetta or engaging in other childish games, but I think the majority of posters are well-intentioned and genuinely want information.

It seems everyone's got their "I hate it when..." list.  Mine includes people who post single-line responses, post without bothering to check their own facts and name-call in public.  Oh yes, also those who feel any discussion of moral or ethical limits outs those people as prudish aunties.  I expect better answers than "Well, it's not my thing but who am I to judge?" or "It's wrong! It's sick!" as responses to someone asking whether a particular act/attitude should raise a red flag.  

Keep it civil, intelligent and on topic.  Respond with the human being on the other end in mind.  Approach your fellow human beings here with grace and humility, allowing your argument to speak for itself.  And if a flame war is raging, leave the building rather than tossing gas on the pyre or fiddling while the thread burns.

~Holly



mistoferin -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:19:59 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Proprietrix
The person who originally opens such a thread isn’t normally on an escapade to slam the name of someone else.
They are looking for validation of their own beliefs.


I can actually understand starting a thread with a wish that someone will validate your own beliefs. There is a part of us all that seeks validation. I can even understand seeing or hearing of a situation that strikes some emotional chord within yourself and you post a thread to help you sort the topic out within yourself. Some of these threads though, or at least so it seems, really do have a particular individual in mind and seem to be started with the "outing" of their identity and actions as a goal. Once the identity is realized it then becomes open season to ridicule and chastise. Often, by the time that the person being spoken of comes on to explain or defend themselves, the emotion is running at a level that makes it impossible for them to alleviate the situation or provide any real clarity.

I just see it as sad that others ever have to knock someone else down in order to feel better about themselves somehow.



HollyS -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:29:18 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

I can even understand seeing or hearing of a situation that strikes some emotional chord within yourself and you post a thread to help you sort the topic out within yourself. Some of these threads though, or at least so it seems, really do have a particular individual in mind and seem to be started with the "outing" of their identity and actions as a goal.


I know I'm new to the message boards, so if you're referring to some other thread besides "All in the Family" I apologize. I followed that one as long as I could and truly believe that the OP started the thread for the reason you first stated -- she heard of a situation that bothered her and she posted to see what others thought of it while looking for validation of her feelings.  I don't think she was looking to out anyone -- she had a visceral reaction to the situation and wanted to hear the thoughts of others.  I have no problem with that.  My problem lies with most of the responses that were uniformed, only related to anecdotal evidence, personally attacking, snide, rude, hysterical and/or off-topic. 

quote:


I just see it as sad that others ever have to knock someone else down in order to feel better about themselves somehow.


So do I.  And while unfortunately it happens fairly regularly out here, I don't think that's what was going on in this particular case.

~Holly - who resolves to work on her typos



meatcleaver -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:32:50 AM)

Such threads are far more interesting and provoking in a postive way than all the back slapping and 'me too' threads and quite often attract some very interesting posts. Some people have strong opinions and strongly opposing the contents of someones post doesn't mean there is any hate involved, it can just mean a strong opinion opposing a strong opinion.

I've been called all sorts of things the short time while I've been posting on CM, not that it worries me. As mercandbeth pointed out, if you are worried about what someone else says about you online, that is the bigger problem for someone. I read the threads while I work on my computer which I hate doing, I'd rather be out in the workshop working but reading and contributing strongly worded threads helps alleviate the oppression and depression caused by Microsoft.



NINASHARP -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:36:29 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: trippingdaisy

i haven't been here long enough to truly see that sort of thing, but i've frequented other forums off and on...and it's everywhere.

i have a feeling it's got something to do with the semi-anonymity that people in general have online. It allows them to express opinions, hurtful or not, without any REAL consequences. Therefore, it ends up being some sort of odd catharsis. Strange, but...that's the only thing i can figure.

Occasionally, it could be more personal. One person doesn't like this other person...and instead of working it out privately, or just deciding to remove themselves from the situation and not being any negativity...they end up stirring up trouble, just to cause drama. i've seen WAY too many drama queens/kings in my time, and it all seems to be online.

Most people tend to watch what they say and do when there is a chance of real, face to face consequences.



You are right Trippingdaisy and I could not agree more.  On another message board I go to, we call these types AW's, short for attention whores.  Though, it does make it hard to ask a serious question in a new thread and hope to get some advice on a situation while all the other BS is still going on around ones question
Nina



Lordandmaster -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:39:19 AM)

People get caught up in witch-hunts because we don't teach children that they don't have a right to persecute something just because it disgusts them.  We teach children to stand up for what they believe in, to do what they think is right, and all that bullshit--we never seem to teach children about understanding other people with values and opinions we don't agree with.  As long as we're all just going by our personal sense of what's OK and what's disgusting, EVERYONE is going to find SOMETHING that disgusts them, and then start criticizing it--usually with outsize sanctimoniousness.  Few people in that "All in the Family" thread seemed to remember that everything people were saying about that situation (it's wrong, it's creepy, it's against the Bible, no normal sane woman would ever consent to that) are exactly the same things that vanillas say about BDSM.  How ironic.  Instead, everyone seemd to have the sense that, well, if vanillas say that about us, they're just wrong, but if we say that about other people, well, we must be right!

It's not high school.  It's the Crusader mentality, and it's what's driving this country into the dust.



MsIncognito -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:41:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin
I see posts like these as an indicator of character(s)......but not necessarily the character of the person the thread is designed to discuss.


My thoughts exactly. I guess after more than a decade of using online forums I've gotten fairly good at recognizing these types of threads and mostly just avoid them. Mostly.

quote:


My question is, why do we get so caught up in this type of thing?


For the same reason people get caught up in Days Of Our Lives or One Life To Live. The only thing better than a TV soap is a real life soap opera playing out in the lives of people we know.



Padriag -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 11:44:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

My question is, why do we get so caught up in this type of thing?

The answer to that is fairly simple Erin.  People will never become as worked up or passionate about an abstract topic as they will when discussing other people.  We don't personalize abstract topics the way we do about other people, we connect with discussions about other people on a level that is both personal to us and therefore emotional.  Its why gossip, gossip columns, tabloids, etc. will always thrive... its personal.

Simply put... discussing Topic X, will never be as interesting or popular to most people as dicussing What Person X Did... even though both are about the same topic.



mistoferin -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 12:41:56 PM)

Hi Amayos,
I agree with all you have said. This does seem to manifest itself in much larger proportions here online, although I don't think that the internet holds an exclusive on it. Gossip is gossip, whether it be online or within a community, and the results are usually the same.....someone ends up getting hurt. I wish people would realize that just because we are interacting in this medium it does not lessen the impact that it can have on individuals. There ARE real people on the other side of the screen with real feelings, beliefs and emotions. I guess it shouldn't surprise me that this medium, with its ability to limit personal contact and provide a degree of anonymity, seems to be an excellent place for some to act out their vindictive natures without fear of any "real" reprisal.



Wulfchyld -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 12:55:58 PM)

I am sure I will have further comments to make now that I have a new password and can restore my profile that was so graciously deleted for me.



CollaredProperty -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 12:58:18 PM)

Loki,

I was wondering where you disappeared too!

slave susan



marieToo -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 1:09:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wulfchyld

I am sure I will have further comments to make now that I have a new password and can restore my profile that was so graciously deleted for me.


Ive always wondered what this meant. I read it on profiles all the time;  people complaining that their profiles were either stolen or deleted. whats that all about?



amayos -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 1:13:51 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

Hi Amayos,
I agree with all you have said. This does seem to manifest itself in much larger proportions here online, although I don't think that the internet holds an exclusive on it. Gossip is gossip, whether it be online or within a community, and the results are usually the same.....someone ends up getting hurt. I wish people would realize that just because we are interacting in this medium it does not lessen the impact that it can have on individuals. There ARE real people on the other side of the screen with real feelings, beliefs and emotions. I guess it shouldn't surprise me that this medium, with its ability to limit personal contact and provide a degree of anonymity, seems to be an excellent place for some to act out their vindictive natures without fear of any "real" reprisal.


Erin,

Wonderfully stated. The dehumanizing factor is quite a good point. I would add on to that a related lament, which consistently has to do with the subtlety of physical gesture, inference and tonal inflection: all things lost in pixel text, on-line personas and flashy avatars. It forces one to internalize their thoughts about who and what they are dealing with, and without those tangible, real-world details it's all too easy to project or transfer your own negative experiences over the words that push your buttons. I think that margin of human failing accounts for a heap of misinterpretation on-line. It makes perfect enemies out of those who would otherwise get along quite famously if discussing the same matters over cocktails and some smooth jazz. :)



Wulfchyld -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 1:17:39 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

Ive always wondered what this meant. I read it on profiles all the time;  people complaining that their profiles were either stolen or deleted. whats that all about?


I'll take a guess at it. It would have to be someone with a lot of spite and little time plunked away at the keyboard till the profile opened and he or she hit delete.



Vendaval -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 1:23:11 PM)

Well stated and insightful as always, amayos and erin.
No matter how vociferously I may disagree with someone;
I try to always remember that a real live human being,
with all their faults, failings, virtues and quirks, is on
the receiving end of the message.
 
Blessed Be,
 
Vendaval
 
 



Vendaval -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 1:26:18 PM)

Someone willing to waste both their time and yours.
Definately not a honest or honorable act.
 
Vendaval

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wulfchyld
I'll take a guess at it. It would have to be someone with a lot of spite and little time plunked away at the keyboard till the profile opened and he or she hit delete.



champagnewishes -> RE: Witch Hunts (6/6/2006 3:55:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Padriag

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

My question is, why do we get so caught up in this type of thing?

The answer to that is fairly simple Erin.  People will never become as worked up or passionate about an abstract topic as they will when discussing other people.  We don't personalize abstract topics the way we do about other people, we connect with discussions about other people on a level that is both personal to us and therefore emotional.  Its why gossip, gossip columns, tabloids, etc. will always thrive... its personal.

Simply put... discussing Topic X, will never be as interesting or popular to most people as dicussing What Person X Did... even though both are about the same topic.


After all, isn't that what The Enquirer and The Star count on?...and make money reporting about?



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