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I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Done So... - 7/5/2012 8:58:12 PM

PiratesAhoy

Posts: 19
Joined: 3/24/2012
Status: offline

Let me explain the title to the best of my ability.

I feel that being female I should never show weakness against males, EVER! As if I'm letting womankind down because I'd rather serve a Master than I don't know, something that will let all men know that women are equal. It's as if the Feminist (the term I use incredibly loosely), and the submissive in me are having an all out brawl, and apparently my heart has no say in the matter.

I'm sure this has happened to other women (possibly even male subs in another light), so I wanted to see if anyone had any advice, or just a critical comment to make that side shut up.

Do you think (possibly) that I'm insecure with my submissiveness? Because that sounds like the most legit reason to me...but I can't evaluate myself very well. So help of any kind comment (even incredibly critical advice) is welcomed.

Thanks.

Post #: 1

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/5/2012 9:03:17 PM

mari50xx

Posts: 3
Joined: 6/24/2012
Status: offline

I just wonder what makes you think you're submissive?

(in reply to PiratesAhoy)

Post #: 2

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/5/2012 9:10:59 PM

DarkSteven

Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline

It's actually not that hard to have a dichotomy. You can be as feministic to the world at large as you please. Being a submissive means that you submit to your Dom ONLY. Nobody else. Does that make things easier for you?

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to mari50xx)

Post #: 3

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/5/2012 9:18:32 PM

ClassIsInSession

Posts: 305
Joined: 7/26/2010
Status: offline

I think the problem is that most tend to have a one-dimensional view on stereotypes. Examples: All feminists are men-hating closet or not so closet lesbians. Submissives are weak minded sluts. Dominants are either Daddy types or sadists.

None of these are true, certainly not unilaterally so. We are all individuals, and tend to be far more complex than stereotypes allow us to be. I think by far, most experienced submissives tend to be some of the strongest people I've known. It takes a pretty strong person to be able to let go of the controls and allow another human being to take control. Often it requires pushing past the fight or flight responses and other instincts altogether.

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 4

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/5/2012 9:19:48 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
Status: offline

I'm extremely traditional and I have a submissive and subservient personality so for me being his slave is completely normal for me. I can't say I've ever felt like I let "womankind" down. I just simply live my life in an unequal relationship and I'm more than happy for it to be that way. It doesn't matter to me what anyone else thinks about it except him.

Why are you worried about everyone else? Everyone else shouldn't matter. As long as you are both happy then don't worry about it. Shrug off everyone else.

_____________________________

Nothing has changed
Everything has changed

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 5

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/5/2012 9:25:08 PM

poise

Posts: 9509
Joined: 7/3/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PiratesAhoy
I feel that being female I should never show weakness against males, EVER! As if I'm letting womankind down because I'd rather serve a Master than I don't know, something that will let all men know that women are equal.

I relish in being of service to Him, and I do so not because I am weaker, but because I am strong
enough and self aware enough to know this is where I'm happiest, and what makes my spirit thrive.

I have never felt that the weight of all womankind was resting on my shoulders, waiting on the
sidelines to see whatever imagined atrocity to gender equality I was going to do next.
Truth be told, nobody really gives a rats ass what goes on in other peoples relationships.

I wouldn't say you are insecure with your submissiveness, but that you see submissiveness in a less
than desireable light. Which would make me repeat the question. Why do you think you're submissive?

_____________________________

When the path ignites a soul, there’s no remaining in place.

(in reply to PiratesAhoy)

Post #: 6

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/5/2012 9:25:30 PM

PiratesAhoy

Posts: 19
Joined: 3/24/2012
Status: offline

That idea makes all conflicting thoughts go back in order, so it does help. I'm just conflicted because although I have certain ideas (like gender equality) I really cannot say I'm a Feminist. At least not much of one. But my belief that genders should be treated equally are telling me that I'm awful because I'm giving a male power by being submissive...or something along those lines.

My thoughts are all confused at the moment.

But the idea you gave me does help, it actually makes a few things clearer. So thank you!

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 7

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/5/2012 9:28:20 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
Status: offline

Just because you are submissive doesn't mean you have to give over all power. It can mean you both together decide what you will and won't do, what kind of relationship you want. If you want to be equals then decide on equal limits. If you don't want to give up any power then be bedroom roleplay and don't worry about it at all. If you two just want to play and be able to say stop, go, etc...be top and bottom.

You choose what kind of power you want to give up or not give up.

_____________________________

Nothing has changed
Everything has changed

(in reply to PiratesAhoy)

Post #: 8

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/5/2012 9:41:12 PM

LilNympho18

Posts: 1
Joined: 7/4/2012
Status: offline

I think it's very possible to be both a feminist and a submissive (in the bedroom). There's no need to shut up one side or the other, recognizing these thoughts or feelings are important :) You're not letting down the female race! As long as you love and respect yourself, you can do whatever you want!
xxx
B

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 9

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/5/2012 10:01:21 PM

NiceButMeanGirl

Posts: 2756
Joined: 11/4/2011
From: Bellingham, WA U.S.A.
Status: offline

Really, the inner workings of your relationship with your Dom are no one else's beeswax.

As long as you and he are happy, then so be it. To me, feminism is, among other things, about women being able to make their own choices and having it be okay. It's okay to be submissive if that's who you feel you are. In this day and age, you can freely choose that for yourself rather than having it forced on you. And that's a wonderful thing. You can freely choose it and if someone doesn't like it, to hell with them because you making that choice for yourself is not going to affect them anyway.

NBMG

_____________________________

I'm now SweetlySadistic1 on CollarSpace. NBMG is an old profile, please see my new one.

(in reply to LilNympho18)

Post #: 10

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 3:31:28 AM

AthenaSurrenders

Posts: 3582
Joined: 3/15/2012
Status: offline

On behalf of the female race, we forgive you.

You would be letting women down if you tried to tell other women they should all be submissive to their husbands regardless, or shouldn't get an education, or mustn't pursue whatever career they want etc. I assume you are not in the business of telling women they are inferior to men? What you do in your own relationship, as a consenting adult, is up to you.

I will confess I have conflicts in terms of how submissiveness fits with my own independent nature. But womankind are lucky to have me!

_____________________________

Being your slave, what should I do but tend
Upon the hours and times of your desire?

(in reply to NiceButMeanGirl)

Post #: 11

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 4:09:35 AM

ProlificNeeds

Posts: 1061
Joined: 5/19/2007
Status: offline

You are neither weak, nor letting anyone down. You still demand equal pay, equal rights, equal healthcare.....

Submissiveness isn't a weakness, and it actually takes a lot of intelligence, strength, and self-realization to be a good submissive by -choice-.

In my relationships being the sub is not about mindlessly taking orders. It's about being intuitive, caring, sensitive to his needs and wants, as well as finding out about myself and what I truely need to be happy as well. Everyone's dynamic is different, but your dynamic should make you happy, and THAT is what makes it perfectly equal... when both people are happy and their needs served inside a relationship, what could be more equal than that?

(in reply to PiratesAhoy)

Post #: 12

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 5:27:14 AM

Firebirdseeking

Posts: 477
Joined: 9/3/2006
Status: offline

OP: I second what others have said. I had this same conflict early on. A local Dom helped me with this conflict in one long conversation. I do understand that inner conflict. What might be helpful is to realize that 1. you can have personal needs (to be submissive in a relationship) that are different from, say, your 2. professional needs. we all have different parts; the part of me that needs to be in a personal relationship is the part that needs to be submissive to a man who is in charge, and first and foremost, in charge of himself and his life. To be able to lean, and led, and not make all the major decisions in my life like I did when I was on my own, or in my first marriage, is a huge relief, and feels right. As NiceButMeanGirl said, it is a personal thing and no one's business but your own. You can believe in the two sexes having equal opportunity and equal access to opportunity without compromising your own personal needs. Do you have any sub friends? that helps too!

(in reply to ProlificNeeds)

Post #: 13

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 5:59:24 AM

searching4mysir

Posts: 2757
Joined: 6/16/2011
Status: offline

Just because we have different roles (dominant/submissive) doesn't mean we aren't equal. A dominant needs his submissive just as the submissive needs her dominant. They are two sides of the same coin.

(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

Post #: 14

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 7:21:09 AM

kalikshama

Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline

OP - I felt like you do back in 1999 when I first got serious about BDSM. Thankfully, I worked through it quickly :)

For me, part of being a feminist means honoring people of both gender's choices and inclinations, whether it be to have a career, be a stay at home parent, or be Dom, sub, switch, etc.

I went to a munch last night with someone who'd met me at a picnic who had no idea I was submissive after meeting me at a picnic until he'd read it on my profile. I express that part of me privately.

_____________________________

Curious about the "Sluts Vote" avatars? See http://www.collarchat.com/m_4133036/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm#4133036

(in reply to PiratesAhoy)

Post #: 15

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 7:21:32 AM

OsideGirl

Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mari50xx

I just wonder what makes you think you're submissive?

I just wonder why you think she isn't.

OP: It sounds like we're very much alike. I'm an alpha and was very self-dependent when I started on this path. Becoming a submissive isn't like throwing a switch *poof* you're submissive. It takes time and learned behavior. I'll also say that for me, I need to be with someone that I view as more alpha than myself to get into submissive mode. Most "Dominants" would tell you that I'm not submissive. One man would tell you that I'm deeply submissive.

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to mari50xx)

Post #: 16

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 7:23:49 AM

kalikshama

Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline

Plenty of clowns on the meat market side have told me "you're not very submissive." None of the men to whom I've chosen to submit have.

_____________________________

Curious about the "Sluts Vote" avatars? See http://www.collarchat.com/m_4133036/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm#4133036

(in reply to OsideGirl)

Post #: 17

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 9:38:49 AM

JeffBC

Posts: 5799
Joined: 2/12/2012
From: Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PiratesAhoy
I feel that being female I should never show weakness against males, EVER!

I agree. You ARE doing something wrong... very wrong. If you are currently engaged in a war with the opposite gender I'd strongly urge you to avoid building relationships with men and certainly would recommend that you avoid agreeing to obey any male as long as you perceive that there's some sort of gender war. You have split the world into men vs. women. That's your call but if you do so you should honor your own call to arms. The obvious question in my mind is "Do you really wish to be engaged in a gender war... especially if you are heterosexual?"

My advice would be to stop talking about men and women as a group. Stop talking about the genders as if they are at war. Consider what is actually appropriate. If you've found a person... any person of any gender who is really a credible leader then agreeing to follow that person simply makes sense.

How does it affect your thinking to know that I, as the master in my marriage, very much actively serve Carol? I see that as a part of being in a happy, healthy relationship. If nobody in a marriage is supposed to serve the other, then what exactly is the point of marriage? Do you see it as some sort of long-term friends with benefits arrangement?

_____________________________

I'm a lover of "what is", not because I'm a spiritual person, but because it hurts when I argue with reality. -- Bryon Katie
"You're humbly arrogant" -- sunshinemiss
officially a member of the K Crowd

(in reply to PiratesAhoy)

Post #: 18

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 10:21:27 AM

graceadieu

Posts: 1518
Joined: 3/20/2008
From: Maryland
Status: offline

I do understand what you mean. Every now and then I too go "ack, am I just reinforcing old sexist gender norms by having this sort of relationship??".

But I don't think so. Historically (and currently, in many parts of the world), all women were expected to be submissive to their husbands, and often to all men generally. Being in a D/s relationship is different, because it's your choice and your way of embracing your sexuality. As a submissive, you choose who you want to submit to, if anyone, and to what extent, and you can always change your mind. You have agency to negotiate the terms of your relationships or sexual encounters. And you're doing it not because society expects it, but because it's what turns you on. Patriarchal ideas about women's sexuality tell us that women who have their own sexual desires and fulfill them are immoral or slutty. D/s subverts that, because in submitting, you're actually actively engaging with your sexuality.

I hope that helps.

(in reply to PiratesAhoy)

Post #: 19

RE: I Feel That Because I'm A Submissive, That I've Don... - 7/6/2012 12:10:02 PM

PiratesAhoy

Posts: 19
Joined: 3/24/2012
Status: offline

To anyone that has recently posted to this thread I would just like to tell the majority of you "Thank you for all the wonderful advice and criticism. I'm beginning to see a bigger picture in terms of this issue, and without your help I would have probably never found that first step. So again, thank you!"

I'm keeping this thread close to me (aka bookmarked the hell out of it) in case I need to go back and reread it in a time of personal crisis. So thanks!

(in reply to PiratesAhoy)

Post #: 20

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