BDSM vs S&M (Full Version)

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hathgriven -> BDSM vs S&M (7/19/2012 2:51:48 PM)

First up, I'm new to this site and the forums, so hi :-).

I've never gotten into this scene before because I'm not particularly interested in the majority of BDSM stuff (e.g., role playing, leather, etc., basically anything that isn't solely for a physical feeling, the typical stuff you see when you search for BDSM), but am really only interested in the pain and tying up side of things (serious rope bondage, clamps, really rough sex, cutting, other knife play, ice play, etc.).

Further, I'm best classified as a dom, but I don't feel like that label fits either. I'm looking for a sub who will challenge me and struggle back, and on rare occasion, give her a big head-start on tying me up and let her treat me like I treat her, struggling back to regain my dominance.

I feel like I'm in a small minority among this crowd. Further, I've only met a couple women who have the same desires as me, and they seem to have serious mental health issues that start spilling over into and harming other aspects of life. I finally got into a relationship with one such woman, and it got so bad she recently got arrested for domestic abuse against me after she isolated me from friends and family and emotionally abused me (long story, and I'm not going to go into details).

So, my main question is: are there many other people out there like me? If so, what experiences have you had?

Edit: fixed typo of BDSM - had a brain hiccup when I was writing this and spell-check didn't correct me.




LaTigresse -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 2:53:09 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: hathgriven

First up, I'm new to this site and the forums, so hi :-).

I've never gotten into this scene before because I'm not particularly interested in the majority of BSDM stuff (e.g., role playing, leather, etc., basically anything that isn't solely for a physical feeling, the typical stuff you see when you search for BSDM), but am really only interested in the pain and tying up side of things (serious rope bondage, clamps, really rough sex, cutting, other knife play, ice play, etc.).

Further, I'm best classified as a dom, but I don't feel like that label fits either. I'm looking for a sub who will challenge me and struggle back, and on rare occasion, give her a big head-start on tying me up and let her treat me like I treat her, struggling back to regain my dominance.

I feel like I'm in a small minority among this crowd. Further, I've only met a couple women who have the same desires as me, and they seem to have serious mental health issues that start spilling over into and harming other aspects of life. I finally got into a relationship with one such woman, and it got so bad she recently got arrested for domestic abuse against me after she isolated me from friends and family and emotionally abused me (long story, and I'm not going to go into details).

So, my main question is: are there many other people out there like me? If so, what experiences have you had?


Yes




littlewonder -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 2:56:32 PM)

TONS of them....majority if I'm actually honest with my opinion. I wouldn't label you a Dom though. If I had to give you a label it would just be purely a sadist and/or Top.

Just make sure your profile is completely clear and transparent and you won't have any problems.




LadyPact -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 2:57:39 PM)

For what it's worth, I'm sort of like you.

Let's have a heart to heart, ok?

Now, I am leather folk, but I have a saying for you....

These things happen over time, not over night.

You're not going to throw up a post on the net and find what you are looking for. K?




hathgriven -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 2:58:02 PM)

quote:

If I had to give you a label it would just be purely a sadist and/or Top.


That's helpful, thanks. I wish this site had a little bit more flexibility to let you specify that.




littlewonder -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 2:58:38 PM)

Just make it clear in your profile of what you like and don't like.




JanahX -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 3:04:45 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: hathgriven

First up, I'm new to this site and the forums, so hi :-).


Hi back.

quote:

I've never gotten into this scene before because I'm not particularly interested in the majority of BSDM stuff (e.g., role playing, leather, etc., basically anything that isn't solely for a physical feeling, the typical stuff you see when you search for BSDM), but am really only interested in the pain and tying up side of things (serious rope bondage, clamps, really rough sex, cutting, other knife play, ice play, etc.)

Further, I'm best classified as a dom, but I don't feel like that label fits either. I'm looking for a sub who will challenge me and struggle back, and on rare occasion, give her a big head-start on tying me up and let her treat me like I treat her, struggling back to regain my dominance.


Sounds like switch behaviour to me. I dont understand the struggling to regain your dominance part though - role playing perhaps?

quote:

I feel like I'm in a small minority among this crowd. Further, I've only met a couple women who have the same desires as me, and they seem to have serious mental health issues that start spilling over into and harming other aspects of life. I finally got into a relationship with one such woman, and it got so bad she recently got arrested for domestic abuse against me after she isolated me from friends and family and emotionally abused me (long story, and I'm not going to go into details).

So, my main question is: are there many other people out there like me? If so, what experiences have you had?


Youre not. And yes there are. I try to stay far away from psychos as I possibly can so I cant share experience/war stories with you.




OsideGirl -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 3:11:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: hathgriven

First up, I'm new to this site and the forums, so hi :-).

I've never gotten into this scene before because I'm not particularly interested in the majority of BSDM stuff (e.g., role playing, leather, etc., basically anything that isn't solely for a physical feeling, the typical stuff you see when you search for BSDM), but am really only interested in the pain and tying up side of things (serious rope bondage, clamps, really rough sex, cutting, other knife play, ice play, etc.).



BDSM = Bondage, Discipline, Sado-Masochism which exactly fits what you say you're looking for.

S&M = Sadism and Masochism

D/s = Dominance and submission

You can practice BDSM without engaging in D/s. You can engage in D/s without engaging in BDSM.


I'm with Little Wonder: I'd classify you as a Top.





hathgriven -> RE: BDSM vs S&M (7/19/2012 3:21:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX
Sounds like switch behaviour to me. I dont understand the struggling to regain your dominance part though - role playing perhaps?


Before posting this I'd just finished reading a thread here someone had posted about prejudice against switches. Not to derail the topic completely, but it seems like some people think that if you are even 1% submissive you're a switch, not a dom. If you're in that camp, then yeah, a switch would be a better label.

Is enjoying physical struggle role play? From my perspective, there's not any more depth to the roles than Top and Bottom.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX
I try to stay far away from psychos as I possibly can


In my extraordinarily limited experience, the particular things I'm looking for seems to go hand and hand with some form of mental heath issues. Is that something I need to watch out for (be skeptical until proven otherwise), or have I just had bad luck?




JanahX -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 3:28:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: hathgriven

quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX
Sounds like switch behaviour to me. I dont understand the struggling to regain your dominance part though - role playing perhaps?


Before posting this I'd just finished reading a thread here someone had posted about prejudice against switches. Not to derail the topic completely, but it seems like some people think that if you are even 1% submissive you're a switch, not a dom. If you're in that camp, then yeah, a switch would be a better label.

Is enjoying physical struggle role play? From my perspective, there's not any more depth to the roles than Top and Bottom.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX
I try to stay far away from psychos as I possibly can


In my extraordinarily limited experience, the particular things I'm looking for seems to go hand and hand with some form of mental heath issues. Is that something I need to watch out for (be skeptical until proven otherwise), or have I just had bad luck?


Well unless you are in the mental health field - how are you supposed to know? I just know when someone says something that gives me a weird feeling - I leave. I dont stick around to bother with it. Im not equipped to deal with that kind of thing.




topcat -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 3:32:44 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

BDSM = Bondage, Discipline, Sado-Masochism which exactly fits what you say you're looking for.

S&M = Sadism and Masochism

D/s = Dominance and submission

You can practice BDSM without engaging in D/s. You can engage in D/s without engaging in BDSM.



Just to be a bit Pendantic, for a moment, if I may...

"BDSM" is an umbrella term, invented on AOL sometime around 1996. It's a compacted acronym for Bondage and Discipline/ Dominance and Submission/Sado-Masochism. I dislike it, becuase it covers so much ground, it tends to confuse discussions.

Correctly, Sado-Masochism is SM, not S&M. Once upon a time, calling it S&M was the mark of a neophyte. Pre- internet days, We called all this stuff SM, though correctly, it only refers to the physical, pain related aspects of sexuality. B&D was seen as 'SM Lite', and tended more towards silk scarves and more mild fors of the work, like OTK, DD (there I go again! OTK = Over The Knee, DD= Domestic Discipline)

As to the OP, I'd say that B&D is what you are interested in, which is not so uncommon as all that, and Likely what most in 'the scene' are actually into.




LadyPact -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 3:36:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: topcat


quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

BDSM = Bondage, Discipline, Sado-Masochism which exactly fits what you say you're looking for.

S&M = Sadism and Masochism

D/s = Dominance and submission

You can practice BDSM without engaging in D/s. You can engage in D/s without engaging in BDSM.



Just to be a bit Pendantic, for a moment, if I may...

"BDSM" is an umbrella term, invented on AOL sometime around 1996. It's a compacted acronym for Bondage and Discipline/ Dominance and Submission/Sado-Masochism. I dislike it, becuase it covers so much ground, it tends to confuse discussions.

Correctly, Sado-Masochism is SM, not S&M. Once upon a time, calling it S&M was the mark of a neophyte. Pre- internet days, We called all this stuff SM, though correctly, it only refers to the physical, pain related aspects of sexuality. B&D was seen as 'SM Lite', and tended more towards silk scarves and more mild fors of the work, like OTK, DD (there I go again! OTK = Over The Knee, DD= Domestic Discipline)

As to the OP, I'd say that B&D is what you are interested in, which is not so uncommon as all that, and Likely what most in 'the scene' are actually into.

And I say again, Christ, I am so glad you're back!





topcat -> RE: BDSM vs S&M (7/19/2012 3:37:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: hathgriven

In my extraordinarily limited experience, the particular things I'm looking for seems to go hand and hand with some form of mental heath issues. Is that something I need to watch out for (be skeptical until proven otherwise), or have I just had bad luck?


Well, there is a lot of crazy in the world, and I think more than our fair share gravitates towards these things we do (what ever we will call them).

Just as a lot of abusive putzes present as dominants, many persons looking to abdicate personal responsibility to achieve a higher state of victim-hood present as submissives.




sheisreeds -> RE: BDSM vs S&M (7/19/2012 4:16:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: hathgriven
I've never gotten into this scene before because I'm not particularly interested in the majority of BDSM stuff (e.g., role playing, leather, etc., basically anything that isn't solely for a physical feeling, the typical stuff you see when you search for BDSM), but am really only interested in the pain and tying up side of things (serious rope bondage, clamps, really rough sex, cutting, other knife play, ice play, etc.).


Other than the ropes this is a lot of my partner's and my interests. I classify myself as a sadomasochist first, and then as a switch. The S&M side is far more important to me, and the D/s stuff. You're not the only one on that front.

quote:

Further, I'm best classified as a dom, but I don't feel like that label fits either. I'm looking for a sub who will challenge me and struggle back, and on rare occasion, give her a big head-start on tying me up and let her treat me like I treat her, struggling back to regain my dominance.


So you're into power play and adversarial play. This is a bit more rare. I know a lot of folks who get into it for a specific scene, though not many where this is their preferred mode. My relationship, however, works a lot like this without the rope. We do a lot of physical fighting, both of trying to gain control, and not caring too much when we're losing. However, chances are you would more want a sadomasochist switch partner, versus a submissive.

quote:

I feel like I'm in a small minority among this crowd.


It is really just more specific, and specific in a way that sorts out some of the roles. Truth of the matter is that all BDSM relationships in the end are THIS specific, though the nuances come out after you say you are a dom looking for a sub. I found that clarifying my role and interest helped a lot in explaining what I wanted and what I was looking for.

quote:

Further, I've only met a couple women who have the same desires as me, and they seem to have serious mental health issues that start spilling over into and harming other aspects of life. I finally got into a relationship with one such woman, and it got so bad she recently got arrested for domestic abuse against me after she isolated me from friends and family and emotionally abused me (long story, and I'm not going to go into details).


I'm sorry to hear about your experience, however, I think the "serious mental health" issues folk participate in all roles of the scene and in all walks of human life. Screening folks closely helps.

quote:

So, my main question is: are there many other people out there like me? If so, what experiences have you had?


I'm totally similar to what you describe.

I've had some great scenes with dominants that were ok with me fighting back. I met some interesting switches that like sparring.

I finally found the motherfucker who is as sick and twisted as I am three years ago, and amazingly enough in a vanilla context. There was no talk about BDSM until he almost bit a hole through my jeans the first time we made out.

As I said we love to fight, not wrestle, but fight. We've sometimes used toys in some of our bigger matches. We're really into being absurd so we pick some strange things. My favorite was when we fought with mops, even after the handles split, got some nice gouges out of that. We do knife, play. fire play, cutting and blood play. We know are way around a pile of clamps and clothespins, canes, and carbon fiber wands.

With fire, and blood play we are very quiet and in more of a cooperative meditative mode.

We've met people similar to us along the way.

I've also met a few sadist and masochist parings if that's more how you roll.




graceadieu -> RE: BDSM vs S&M (7/19/2012 4:22:45 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: topcat
quote:

ORIGINAL: hathgriven

In my extraordinarily limited experience, the particular things I'm looking for seems to go hand and hand with some form of mental heath issues. Is that something I need to watch out for (be skeptical until proven otherwise), or have I just had bad luck?


Well, there is a lot of crazy in the world, and I think more than our fair share gravitates towards these things we do (what ever we will call them).

Just as a lot of abusive putzes present as dominants, many persons looking to abdicate personal responsibility to achieve a higher state of victim-hood present as submissives.


Yeah, that's been my anecdotal experience too. I don't know if there's more crazy in the BDSM community, or if people just hide it less. But it definitely seems like there's a sizable minority that engage in this stuff as a way to enable their disfunctionality. (Hell, at least part of why I'm submissive outside the bedroom is because of my really excessive aversion to conflict, so I can't even exempt myself from this.)




OsideGirl -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 4:25:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: topcat


"BDSM" is an umbrella term, invented on AOL sometime around 1996. It's a compacted acronym for Bondage and Discipline/ Dominance and Submission/Sado-Masochism. I dislike it, becuase it covers so much ground, it tends to confuse discussions.


Actually, it was around before 1996, and the D/s part is a bastardization of the original term. It was actually started in 1990 and was coined by Richard Chandler at the University of Maryland.




BitaTruble -> RE: BDSM vs S&M (7/19/2012 4:26:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: hathgriven

but am really only interested in the pain and tying up side of things (serious rope bondage, clamps, really rough sex, cutting, other knife play, ice play, etc.).


Sadomasochism is my main interest with bondage coming in a very close second for the part of me fed by engaging in those sorts of activities. Some fun.. sometimes with a wow factor, sometimes with a cathartic reward from a sound thrashing while on the bottom or being able to hug a giddy top space for a while. Put a label on that, call it switch if you like. It's not inaccurate but all that label does is open up the opportunity for a dialogue because like I said.. it feeds a 'part' of me and through my travels I've discovered that feeding only pieces results in starvation to areas that just shouldn't be starved.

The label is the first step, so just pick one for an opener and go and grow from there. Also, be aware.. just because your label says dominant doesn't mean that any old submissive label is going to match with you. People have to match up and you'd be surprised at how often mislabeled people fit together almost perfectly. [;)]


quote:

Further, I'm best classified as a dom, but I don't feel like that label fits either.


See above.

quote:

I'm looking for a sub who will challenge me and struggle back, and on rare occasion, give her a big head-start on tying me up and let her treat me like I treat her, struggling back to regain my dominance.


Sounds cool. You seem to know, pretty much, what you're looking for and a lot of people don't, so you're already a step ahead and on your way!

quote:

I feel like I'm in a small minority among this crowd.


You're not but it's okay to feel that way. Stick around and I'll bet that feeling goes away PDQ. [;)]

quote:

Further, I've only met a couple women who have the same desires as me, and they seem to have serious mental health issues that start spilling over into and harming other aspects of life. I finally got into a relationship with one such woman, and it got so bad she recently got arrested for domestic abuse against me after she isolated me from friends and family and emotionally abused me (long story, and I'm not going to go into details).


Yeah, that happens. It sucks. That's a hefty tuition for learning a lesson but as long as you learned it, the price paid is worthwhile.

You did learn a lesson right?

quote:

So, my main question is: are there many other people out there like me?


Scads, dude. I would say that your desires are how a significant portion of folks who find BDSM probably started out.. with an itch that needs a scratch, but it only itches in one place. Some folks will scratch that itch for a while.. even a year or two and find it just fades away. Other folks will scratch that itch and discover they start itching in other places and stick around for a bit longer scratching itches and exploring new terrortories (mispelled on purpose cuz I'm punny that way) and find that BDSM can do a whole lot more for them than scratch an itch or two and before you know it, BDSM, D/s, M/s have a significant impact in a variety of ways on a multi-faceted creature such as a human. (That's the way it happened with me.)

quote:

If so, what experiences have you had?


Agony, extacy, surprise, adventure, misadventure [;)] - seriously, 30 years trudging, skipping, jumping and crawling along in my journey - 16 years with the same partner who shares my wicked, evil, demented, blood thirsty, lets get dirty, sweaty and bloody together mentality.. it just works and .. the experiences are countless. A better question.. what memories do you have that really stand out in your mind during your journey. Now that's a fucking question I'd answer.. maybe. [;)]

Stick around.. see what happens.




hathgriven -> RE: BDSM vs S&M (7/19/2012 4:40:08 PM)

sheisreeds and BitaTruble thanks for the posts (and others as well). It gives me hope that I'll find someone that has what I'm looking for if I'm patient enough.

sheisreeds: you sound like an amazing partner, and your partner is lucky. I'd suggest trying sais if you haven't yet (and don't mind a few gouges in your hands sometimes). I've found those a lot of fun to pick up against other ad-hock weapons especially if you've practiced with them. They're good for disarming and will leave some nice marks. And yeah, my experience with blood play has also been better to be meditative.

Thanks for the discussion of the history of nomenclature too. I'm often fascinated by those sorts of things.




kalikshama -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 4:52:22 PM)

quote:

Well unless you are in the mental health field - how are you supposed to know? I just know when someone says something that gives me a weird feeling - I leave. I dont stick around to bother with it. Im not equipped to deal with that kind of thing.


Twice when I had that weird feeling I found through the Clerk of Courts database that they each had two domestic violence convictions. Now I just trust that feeling and don't bother getting confirmation before bailing.




LadyPact -> RE: BSDM vs S&M (7/19/2012 5:19:58 PM)

Some people gave Me hell for this post, but you may like it.

http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=2645488





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