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RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 1:50:31 PM   
Ishtarr


Posts: 1130
Joined: 4/30/2008
Status: offline 		Thank you lizi and punisher... that makes a whole lot more sense.

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Ein kleiner Schnitt und du wirst geil
Egal, erlaubt ist, was gefällt

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Tut mir nicht Leid!
Das tut dir gut.
Hör wie es schreit!

(in reply to punisher440)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 2:33:51 PM   
Ullr


Posts: 2
Joined: 8/25/2011
Status: offline 		I am responding to LadyHibiscus, but this is directed more broadly than to just her.

I am curious what difference it makes whether or not Ishtarr's punishments are associated with fear play or any other kind of play. She has essentially described some fairly intense S&M punishments within a consensual non-consent framework. Can that stand or fall on its own merits or lack thereof? Does the motivation of both parties matter? What if it isn't fear-play? What if Ishtarr's torments are for no other reason than being dominated into submitting to these punishments?

The impression I get from this thread (among others) is the BDSM community can accept sadism & masochism but not dominance & submission. Somehow, everything has to have the "-play" suffix or it is condemned. Fear-play is ok. Edge-play is ok. D&s is not ok.

Or more precisely, D&s is not ok unless the s actively wants everything the D is doing... which seems to miss the entire point. Maybe we should reverse the capitalization to d&S? Or maybe it would be ok if those engaging in dominance & submission start calling it D&s-play instead?

Not meaning to be hostile - just curious why the physically focused BD and SM parts of BDSM are accepted when the physiologically focused DS part of BDSM is not.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 2:38:45 PM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		Ullr, I am not a person that engages in punishment dynamics, but to each their own.

My questioning Ishtarr's description is based on why they were engaging in any such extreme scene and calling it 'punishment', and engaging in it *repeatedly*. What misbehaviour would indicate that, and what punishment is working if it's constantly repeated?

Ishtarr answered my question, and as so often happens, it's a matter of semantics.

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[page 23 girl]



(in reply to Ullr)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 4:01:02 PM   
Lucifyre


Posts: 1067
Joined: 3/27/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ullr

I am responding to LadyHibiscus, but this is directed more broadly than to just her.

I am curious what difference it makes whether or not Ishtarr's punishments are associated with fear play or any other kind of play. She has essentially described some fairly intense S&M punishments within a consensual non-consent framework. Can that stand or fall on its own merits or lack thereof? Does the motivation of both parties matter? What if it isn't fear-play? What if Ishtarr's torments are for no other reason than being dominated into submitting to these punishments?

The impression I get from this thread (among others) is the BDSM community can accept sadism & masochism but not dominance & submission. Somehow, everything has to have the "-play" suffix or it is condemned. Fear-play is ok. Edge-play is ok. D&s is not ok.

Or more precisely, D&s is not ok unless the s actively wants everything the D is doing... which seems to miss the entire point. Maybe we should reverse the capitalization to d&S? Or maybe it would be ok if those engaging in dominance & submission start calling it D&s-play instead?

Not meaning to be hostile - just curious why the physically focused BD and SM parts of BDSM are accepted when the physiologically focused DS part of BDSM is not.



hmm...let me try to answer this from my twisted fucked up perspective ;)

Mr and I are a D/s couple. He dominates me, I sumbit to him. You'll note in my sig line I say "I do this because it fucking feels good"
There is much more to that than just the simple physical, in fact some of the physical hurts like hell and when I am going through it I'd probably rather not be.
The thing is, if I didn't want these things to be, they simply wouldn't. I have to give my consent in order for him to do to me the things he does. I live in a country where true slavery is illegal...I like Mr too much to have him do something that might send him to jail ;)Same thing I think in Jeff and Carol's relationship, she consents by continuing and when she decides to no longer to consent, the relationship is over (I don't know if he means the whole thing, or just the D/s they go back to being a married couple...I'll let him splain that one) My relationship would go back to being a normal married couple. I hated it. We had sex maybe twice a month, we were both miserable people. I was way too far into my own head letting everything aorund me just dig in and completely fuck me up. Since I have consented to him having control, it is a freeing feeling for me, even when he has me over his knee and is making me scream begging him to stop....that belongs to Him, he takes it because I want to give it to Him.
So, I give him a blanket consent making it ok with me for him to do to/with me what he feels like it because yes, in fact I DO want these things overall even if sometimes in the moment I don't.

Does that make any sense?

BTW, I know it's semantics but I do want to also say that he and I don't "play". We scene, we session, he punishes, we pleasure eachother, I do what I'm told or what's expected of me. None of it for us is "play". This is our life day in and day out and we want it this way.

Lucifyre

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I do this because it fucking feels good.
I like girls who like girls
The thing about standards is: There are SO many to choose from.

(in reply to Ullr)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 4:59:11 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline
quote:

So has anyone ever run out of their or to the door? Or scream for help and if you did what would happen later, or would
you go back?


I've tried running and getting away from whatever he was beating me with. He tells me to get back where I was. I cringe, I cry and then I go back.

I've never tried running out the door or scream for help. I would see that as disrespectful and I would lose integrity as his slave.

And yeah, I hate pain. I'm not a masochist but I love and adore and cherish Master so I do as I'm told.


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Profile   Post #: 45
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 5:01:55 PM   
Karnikula


Posts: 55
Joined: 7/21/2012
Status: offline 		I have found that punishment in healthy adults (I consider anything with a moral code an adult) serves two different uses:

1) Play in whatever form: From light funishment spankings to hardcore SM - an activity like doing sports.
2) Catharsis, Penance etc. (english > me) for the receiver and/or the giver.

I haven't ever found myself lusting after slapping someones face for sexual pleasure.
I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone that drives me to actual agression towards them (that's reserved for actual or potential rapists and the likes).
I have yet to try wether slapping someone after a harsh disappointment would make me feel better about it. (and I'll defenitely hold back from trying before I find the right person to slap)

Edit: It seems like I wasn't paying attention which Forum this was posted in (I was following someone elses posts! whoops!) I'm neither a slave nor submissive and I haven't even read the OP ... so I hope my post wasn't too far off topic, otherwise please ignore it completely.

< Message edited by Karnikula -- 7/22/2012 5:18:53 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 46
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 5:02:56 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline
quote:

Here's the thing; I have some emotionally unhealthy traits. I tend to worry and mentally beat myself up over perceived failings - both within a relationship and within the rest of my life. I get myself all tense and anxious and sad about things because I struggle to say 'oh well, it happened, lets move on'. I admit, that's not the healthiest way of dealing with things, but hey, it's who I am, and I'm doing my best to keep it under control. It doesn't dominate my life, but it could do if I didn't keep myself in check.

Punishment, the way we do it, actually helps me control these unhealthy tendencies. It's catharsis, it's a clean slate, it's a line drawn under whatever happened. It's a way for him to take that weight from me. I don't have to worry about whether he is unhappy with me because if he is, he lets me know, we fix it, we have a punishment session, and we move on with lots of love and cuddles.


This is us to a T. Together for 6 yrs now and we still do this and I don't see that changing anytime soon. It works for both of us.


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Profile   Post #: 47
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 5:08:37 PM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		I respect that it works for some of you. I know it's not how I do things, and that's good, too.

Thank you for your insights, everyone.

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[page 23 girl]



(in reply to littlewonder)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 6:08:13 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

I haven't ever found myself lusting after slapping someones face for sexual pleasure.
I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone that drives me to actual agression towards them (that's reserved for actual or potential rapists and the likes).
I have yet to try wether slapping someone after a harsh disappointment would make me feel better about it. (and I'll defenitely hold back from trying before I find the right person to slap)

I adore a well timed slap in the face in the middle of a scene - it's very juicy sexually. However, being slapped for punishment would piss me right the fuck off.

quote:

Edit: It seems like I wasn't paying attention which Forum this was posted in (I was following someone elses posts! whoops!) I'm neither a slave nor submissive and I haven't even read the OP ... so I hope my post wasn't too far off topic, otherwise please ignore it completely.

Not to worry, anyone can post anywhere :)

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(in reply to Karnikula)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 6:25:03 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

I have yet to try wether slapping someone after a harsh disappointment would make me feel better about it. (and I'll defenitely hold back from trying before I find the right person to slap)


I thought this was a topic that deserved its own thread: http://www.collarchat.com/m_4181016/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm#4181016

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Profile   Post #: 50
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 10:15:17 PM   
lilmissdefiant


Posts: 666
Joined: 4/17/2008
Status: offline 		Woe is what every Dom feels when they come across me hahahahahaha

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Profile   Post #: 51
RE: punishments - 7/22/2012 11:19:04 PM   
AthenaSurrenders


Posts: 3582
Joined: 3/15/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ullr

I am responding to LadyHibiscus, but this is directed more broadly than to just her.

I am curious what difference it makes whether or not Ishtarr's punishments are associated with fear play or any other kind of play. She has essentially described some fairly intense S&M punishments within a consensual non-consent framework. Can that stand or fall on its own merits or lack thereof? Does the motivation of both parties matter? What if it isn't fear-play? What if Ishtarr's torments are for no other reason than being dominated into submitting to these punishments?

The impression I get from this thread (among others) is the BDSM community can accept sadism & masochism but not dominance & submission. Somehow, everything has to have the "-play" suffix or it is condemned. Fear-play is ok. Edge-play is ok. D&s is not ok.

Or more precisely, D&s is not ok unless the s actively wants everything the D is doing... which seems to miss the entire point. Maybe we should reverse the capitalization to d&S? Or maybe it would be ok if those engaging in dominance & submission start calling it D&s-play instead?

Not meaning to be hostile - just curious why the physically focused BD and SM parts of BDSM are accepted when the physiologically focused DS part of BDSM is not.



I disagree with you on this - I think there's a lot of acceptance of D/s here and a great deal of people who post here put the emphasis very firmly on this side of things over any kind of physical play.

I don't consider our punishment dynamic to be play - on the contrary it's serious work on our relationship dynamic.

Ultimately, in the real world, there is no submission without consent so to some degree yes the sub wants it. Then again there are lots of us who consent to obey even when we don't enjoy the activities or orders - because the enjoyment we get is from the act of submission itself. I often crave those days when he will have me perform/endure something which he knows I fear or dislike because as you point out yourself, submitting to something you love is easy-peasy.

We're not playing at D/s - I dislike that term - it's who we are. I've never had any negative reactions on here to the power exchange side of our relationship even if some people may disagree with the details - like punishment.

quote:

)Same thing I think in Jeff and Carol's relationship, she consents by continuing and when she decides to no longer to consent, the relationship is over (I don't know if he means the whole thing, or just the D/s they go back to being a married couple...I'll let him splain that one)


Pretty certain he just means the D/s would be over - Jeff and Carol are snuggly love muffins that are in it no matter what.

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Being your slave, what should I do but tend
Upon the hours and times of your desire?

(in reply to Ullr)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: punishments - 7/23/2012 4:03:08 AM   
Focus50


Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lilmissdefiant

Woe is what every Dom feels when they come across me hahahahahaha


They say the best defence is a good offense (in post and new pic).

Seem to recall you're from around here, so I'm just thinkin' talk's cheap, girl.... ;)

Focus.

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Your food is for eating, not torturing. <my mum> (Errm, when I was a kid)

(in reply to lilmissdefiant)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: punishments - 7/23/2012 5:06:14 AM   
phoenixmoonn13


Posts: 398
Joined: 6/11/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

I don't punish-I dole out consequences.

And those, why, strangely enough, they tend to be tailored to fit the offense



Pretty much covers us as well also his look if i have disappointed etc is enough. one of the worst is not being given a cuddle while we fall asleep at night. (he hates that one to so luckily it happens only very rarely. but he knows that sometimes a punishment swipe well swipe is a too spft a word with the handle of the fly swatter will give me the release from the feelings i have when i have done something wrong and this is just painful and not pleasure but works

(in reply to Kana)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: punishments - 7/23/2012 6:27:05 AM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline 		Ya, you are both in Newcastle. Keep us posted!

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(in reply to Focus50)
Profile   Post #: 55
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