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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 12:02:32 AM   
Edwynn


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You stuff the outside strings of the normal 3 string course with a tuning felt for most of the notes on the piano. You set a temperament in the middle octave. Equal temperament means that there is equal frequency displacement between adjacent notes, logarithmically speaking. You could tune everything to perfect intervals even for thirds or sixths, if you wanted, but you would be stuck in one or two keys. All other keys would be unlistenable.

In equal temperament, the thirds and the sixths take advantage of the fact that human ears or the ear-brain system aren't too picky there. But get a unison or octave or fourth or fifth the slightest out of whack (beyond 3-4 cents), and our ear-brain system will kick and cry loudly.

You go up and down the piano by octaves once the temperament is set, then lastly, you remove one side of the felts at a time and tune the right, then left outer strings to the middle string, that being per each note or key.

Told you it was a bitch, fuck however good your ears are.





< Message edited by Edwynn -- 7/28/2012 12:19:10 AM >

(in reply to MalcolmNathaniel)
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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 12:09:27 AM   
MalcolmNathaniel


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That mostly makes sense to me.

Can you tell me what a "cent" is in this context?

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 12:43:44 AM   
Edwynn


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As you might or might not already know, an octave above a given note is twice the frequency of that fundamental note, an octave below that same note is half the frequency. A 880 is an octave above A 440, and human sense of pitch hears that as an octave higher, likewise as we hear (by way of human sense of pitch) A 220 as being a musical octave lower.

This puts the musical and human sense of pitch in relation to a mathematical base 2 or successive powers of 2 situation.

There are twelve tones to the Western musical scale, as per the keyboard and any other fixed-pitch instrument (such as guitar, where the 12th fret is an octave above the open string).

There are 100 cents between adjacent notes (e.g., as between F# and G), as there are 1,200 cents in an entire octave, being that there are twelve tones to the Western musical octave.

To find the frequency of the A sharp (A#) above A 440, get out the calculator and dig out the 12th root of two, then multiply by 440. That is; 2^1/12*440.

So then, 440 times the twelfth root of two (1.059463 ... that is the "pi" of musical mathematics) comes to- 466.163761, which, being equal temperament, means A sharp and B flat both, which such enharmonic would not be the case in any other than equal temperament.









< Message edited by Edwynn -- 7/28/2012 12:49:49 AM >

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 1:08:07 AM   
Edwynn


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This is long ago, but ...

My first-year music theory instructor's wife was (still is, probably) an excellent piano player and pretty good piano tuner. She did a "perfect tuning" for three different Brahms piano peices in E flat.

The thirds and sixths had no 'warble,' as they do in equal temperament, just all perfect tuned intervals in the scale, in this case.

It sounded quite "dark." But it was fabulous.

It took two weeks of us piano tuning students to get the piano back to where it could retain 'normal' equal temperament. But we were laughing at what she did all the while.


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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 1:20:41 AM   
MalcolmNathaniel


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OK, I ha to read it twice, but I get it now.

BTW: not to brag* but based on a list of tuned frequencies I actually figured out that each not was the 12th root of 2 higher from the note below when I was 16. That was without coaching on the math.

I still can't sight read music or play anything but my own voice. Studied trumpet and guitar for years but still can't eke out more than 'Red River Valley' on either. I can sing pretty well, but only if I have a lot of practice.

* this is totally bragging.

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 2:00:45 AM   
GreedyTop


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

He'll be taking us on a death march for our health, next...



Good times :)

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 5:54:02 AM   
GotSteel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
According to the National Alliance on Mental Illness (which cites a report by the Surgeon General), "One in four adults—approximately 57.7 million Americans— experience a mental health disorder in a given year." So it's not all that surprising that folks here would manifest them as well.

Depending a bit on which numbers you look at, half the mental health disorders are depression with just over a third being minor depression.
http://www.cdc.gov/Features/dsDepression/

Dissociative identity disorder on the other hand is rare, it's not something I would expect to run into.

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
I'd be a bit wary of judging the entire BDSM population based on Collarme posters. I suspect a lot of folks are off getting their kinky groove on, so the self-selected portion who haunt message boards may not be representative.

Agreed, the kinky club events I go to in Boston have a noticeably different subsection of the community.

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 6:21:35 AM   
LookieNoNookie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MalcolmNathaniel


quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie

That was either remarkably uninformed or....you're just an asshole.

It's not that simple, and I suspect you're not an asshole (but, you could be).




Perhaps before assuming malice you should request clarification?

I never said it was an easy thing to deal with. In fact any time you see a bullet list you should assume that there is a lot more complication behind the scenes. It was a highly simplified version of the cycle not the entire process.

Perhaps I should not have use the phrase 'feel better.' I should probably have said, "respond in a more acceptable way to outside stimuli in the presence of localized chemical within the brain structure while suffering a wide range of negative byproducts due to the presence of said chemicals.

That would hardly be relevant to the cycle itself though. That cycle is present in most of the people I have had to deal with in these situations, 2 of whom are very sick. And the sicker they are, the harsher their drugs (and the harsher the side effects. It is no wonder that they want off of them.

As for 'ignorant' - I deal with these issues on a regular basis.

Again, next time request clarification. Since the original question was about people going off their medication, don't you think an overall view of the cycle is important, perhaps even before learning the details of each step?



Sorry, I presumed you meant what you wrote.

I don't tend to write stuff just to hear my own voice.

If that was your intent, perhaps you can put an advance notice on same: "This is simply blather...I don't really mean what I'm about to say",

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 6:25:09 AM   
kalikshama


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quote:

My mom (whom you have attacked) and my dad (whom you have attacked previously, as did numerous others, for attempting to get back some minimal portion of what society has taken from from him all his life)


?

Link(s) please. We can continue via PM if you wish.

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 7:14:29 AM   
JstAnotherSub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
According to the National Alliance on Mental Illness (which cites a report by the Surgeon General), "One in four adults—approximately 57.7 million Americans— experience a mental health disorder in a given year." So it's not all that surprising that folks here would manifest them as well.

Depending a bit on which numbers you look at, half the mental health disorders are depression with just over a third being minor depression.
http://www.cdc.gov/Features/dsDepression/

Dissociative identity disorder on the other hand is rare, it's not something I would expect to run into.

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
I'd be a bit wary of judging the entire BDSM population based on Collarme posters. I suspect a lot of folks are off getting their kinky groove on, so the self-selected portion who haunt message boards may not be representative.

Agreed, the kinky club events I go to in Boston have a noticeably different subsection of the community.

I would have to guess that, at a club event, you don't communicate regarding mental health issues or meds, as much as can be done here, in a place where folks are sitting quietly in their homes.

To me, that is comparing apples and oranges.

I don't think there are more folks here, percentage wise, that take some sort of med for mental health, than, say, there are at the place I work.

It is amazing how, once you quit being ashamed of what you consider to be a weakness, such as depression or panic, things happen. Like, someone saying, "OMG I never would have thought someone as (tough, smart, together, happy, add any adjective here,) as you is taking that. I have been on it for years, and thought I was the only one!".

At which time you look back at them and say "OMG I never would have thought someone as (tough, smart, together, happy, add any adjective here,) as you is taking that. I have been on it for years, and thought I was the only one!".



< Message edited by JstAnotherSub -- 7/28/2012 7:17:02 AM >


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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 7:32:01 AM   
GotSteel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RedEliz
I can see how BDSM could (and does) attract those with a mental illness, but I find the topic to be irrelevant considering we are just like other people without a mental illness.


quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder
Bdsm attacts a lot of the "outsiders" who are on the fringe of society and therefore you're going to have a major number of those who are not exactly sane or normal or part of the society at large. It's kinda one of the reasons why I've never really been interested in attending bdsm stuff or to go certain places where such people hang out.


Could you two explain how that works, why would BDSM attract outsiders or the mentally ill?

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 7:49:18 AM   
kalikshama


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I'd like to see sources/citations in the explanations.

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 8:19:28 AM   
RedEliz


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

Could you two explain how that works, why would BDSM attract outsiders or the mentally ill?


quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

I'd like to see sources/citations in the explanations.


Of course, there isn't a lot of citation to be had on this topic, but I did run across this survey someone did on FL with a relatively small amount of people. (Link) Keep in mind that there's always some error with surveys as well, so this isn't completely solid evidence. Also, in the comments someone linked to an article about a study done on Australian kinksters (Link) that talks about how this stigma that kinksters are damaged is not true... so, there's no real way to solidly claim that those with mental illnesses are attracted to BDSM.

HOWEVER! With my experience, I feel I can at least guess why they would. I feel that BDSM can help someone find purpose in their life beyond the usual "vanilla" reasons such as becoming a parent, helping others in need, making a living for yourself, etc. As someone who has struggled to find my place in the world, exploring my role as a sub has helped my perspective on life tremendously and boosted my confidence. While I don't have all the answers, that's my take on why those with a mental illness might be attracted to the lifestyle.



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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 8:32:17 AM   
kalikshama


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quote:

Of course, there isn't a lot of citation to be had on this topic, but I did run across this survey someone did on FL with a relatively small amount of people. (Link) Keep in mind that there's always some error with surveys as well, so this isn't completely solid evidence.


Online surveys like these are for entertainment only and have no statistical validity.

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 8:38:05 AM   
kalikshama


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The Psychology of S&M

BDSM is a 6-for-4 deal of an acronym: Bondage, Discipline, Dominance, Submission, Sadism and Masochism. It’s sometimes referred to as S&M, B&D, leather, or fetish. As an S&M writer and educator, I get lots of questions about the psychology of S&M. People ask whether it’s a disorder, how psychologists would describe it, etc. I’m an advocate, not a psychologist, but I’ve read up on the history and done my best to keep tabs on current research.

First things first: S&M is not a pathology, and people who practice S&M are not “damaged” in some way. There aren’t many S&M studies, but in 2008, this conclusion was supported by a large and well-designed survey that reached 20,000 people. The survey was done by public health researchers at the University of New South Wales in Australia, and it found that S&Mers “were no more likely [than non-S&Mers] to have been coerced into sexual activity and were not significantly more likely to be unhappy or anxious.” Another recent study found that consensual S&M usually increases intimacy for a couple.

I’d like to note briefly that people have told me about using consensual, intimate, trusting S&M activities in order to work through previous non-consensual, abusive experiences that they’d had. There’s nothing wrong with that. Indeed, the psychologist Peggy Kleinplatz once published a scholarly article called “Learning From Extraordinary Lovers: Lessons From The Edge,” which discusses how therapists can help their clients by studying alternative sexualities. Kleinplatz included a case study of a couple whose S&M experiences helped them process and deal with past abuse.

Still, as the 2008 Australia survey shows us, most people don’t practice S&M because they’ve been abused or because they’re unhappy. People who practice S&M have the same record of unhappiness and abusive history as non-S&M people. Yet S&M was first described as a disorder in 1886, when a doctor named Richard Krafft-Ebing published the manual Psychopathia Sexualis. This landmark tome hauled many sexual practices into the light, then attempted to categorize them. Of course, the doctor’s ideas hewed close to contemporary mainstream ideas of what was acceptable, and so he thought that basically everything was a disorder — including, for example, homosexuality.

It’s interesting to imagine what our mental health paradigm might be if Psychopathia Sexualis had never existed. It had a huge influence on psychiatry. Later, the psychiatric establishment began publishing a text called the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, or DSM. The DSM doesn’t specialize in sexuality, but it includes quite a lot of it. The first edition of the DSM came out in 1952; it’s currently undergoing its fifth revision, and the proposed new language can be found at the DSM-5 website.

Like Psychopathia Sexualis, the original DSM called homosexuality a disorder. This changed in 1973, partly in response to gay activists. But subsequent versions of the DSM are still criticized for many reasons. Our cultural diagnoses of mental illness are shaped by lots of people with very different motives, and truth is hard to find. A 2010 New Yorker article by Louis Menand outlined many critiques of the DSM, such as the allegation that today’s psychiatry “is creating ever more expansive criteria for mental illness that end up labelling as sick people who are just different.” Naturally, doctors have an incentive to do this, since they make money selling treatments for illness, and more illness means more treatment.

S&M is currently in the DSM (heh, you see what I did there?). My understanding, however, is that S&M occupies a strange space within the much-edited manual. S&M is no longer listed as all-disorder-all-the-time, though it once was. But if a person has an urge towards S&M, and that person feels unhappy about it, then it is classified as a disorder. In other words, an S&Mer is labeled “healthy” if she’s happy about S&M, and “unhealthy” if she’s unhappy about it.

Actually, this is basically the spot that homosexuality occupied for a while. And the reason homosexuality was taken out is the same reason S&M should be taken out: because a person who wants a completely consensual type of sexuality, and who is unhappy about it, is probably better off working to change the unhappiness rather than the sexuality. Like homosexuality, S&M is stigmatized and misunderstood. A person who is stigmatized and misunderstood is likely to be unhappy, but that doesn’t mean there’s something wrong with her.

Read more: http://clarissethorn.com/blog/2012/05/07/the-psychology-of-sm/

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 9:53:05 AM   
littlewonder


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: RedEliz
I can see how BDSM could (and does) attract those with a mental illness, but I find the topic to be irrelevant considering we are just like other people without a mental illness.


quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder
Bdsm attacts a lot of the "outsiders" who are on the fringe of society and therefore you're going to have a major number of those who are not exactly sane or normal or part of the society at large. It's kinda one of the reasons why I've never really been interested in attending bdsm stuff or to go certain places where such people hang out.


Could you two explain how that works, why would BDSM attract outsiders or the mentally ill?



Simple....bdsm is on the outside of society..not exactly accepted in the mainstream (but it's getting there quickly) and bdsm is known to basically accept anyone...any shape, size, color, gender, views, fetishes, etc....it's where people go to who feel they don't fit in anywhere else and well...why not get into bdsm? They'll feel as if they belong because everyone belongs....at least that's the thought of many people imo.


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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 10:15:03 AM   
Edwynn


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Thanks for the reminder> you actually only listed some chart that said housing prices were all back to normal (which they most certainly are not), in the midst of others attacking my dad, for taking out a smidgen of equity at 78 yrs. old, as nearly everyone in that situation has done for decades. But then he and others of his ilk were the cause of the worldwide financial crisis, as some would have us believe.

But earlier I had mentioned that my mom had eight kids, and evaluated some of her troubles from that, whereupon your comment was "eight kids?", in somewhat judgmental tone, followed by something along the lines that you had no empathy for her if she was stupid enough to have eight kids.

I can understand that sentiment, but as I had to bring to your awareness, that was the way of Catholics in the '50s and '60s, and that her eight kids, most thankfully, did not follow her in that pursuit. Six kids (grandchildren, to her) from the eight kids tells me that society learns, and moves on.

Others would do well to do likewise.




< Message edited by Edwynn -- 7/28/2012 10:30:03 AM >

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 10:27:08 AM   
GotSteel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub
I would have to guess that, at a club event, you don't communicate regarding mental health issues or meds, as much as can be done here, in a place where folks are sitting quietly in their homes.

To me, that is comparing apples and oranges.

Yeah not so much on the conversations about that, maybe it is just the venue *shrug*.

That wasn't my angle though, sorry for being unreasonably vague. Having noticed that said subset of the community is things like young, thin and attractive more commonly than average, that NELA's fetish ball with something like $20 to go to the flea and another $20 for the dance and a lot of people spending the weekend at the hotel has a noticeably older crowd, et cetera.... I'm immediately accepting of the idea that different venues can draw different subsets of the community.


quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub
I don't think there are more folks here, percentage wise, that take some sort of med for mental health, than, say, there are at the place I work.

It is amazing how, once you quit being ashamed of what you consider to be a weakness, such as depression or panic, things happen. Like, someone saying, "OMG I never would have thought someone as (tough, smart, together, happy, add any adjective here,) as you is taking that. I have been on it for years, and thought I was the only one!".

At which time you look back at them and say "OMG I never would have thought someone as (tough, smart, together, happy, add any adjective here,) as you is taking that. I have been on it for years, and thought I was the only one!".

I think it's laudable that you and others are taking the time to do awareness raising on mental illness, thing is I'm not meaning for the topic to be about people who are taking their meds. The OP is about those who have refused to take their psych meds and I'm pretty confident that isn't too common in a professional environment.

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 10:46:35 AM   
Edwynn


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All good and well that you choose to let the pharma companies determine what level of 'mental instability' requires medication or not. Half of the latest 'disorders du jour' are in fact brought to our awareness by the pharma companies. You didn't know that, did you?

When "they" (pharma, all psychiatrists, the entire public school system, etc.) decided to put my most wonderful and sprightly niece (along with many other kids) on "meds" because her wonderful mind could not abide the mind-numbing drudgery and purposeful social integration and, even as early as second grade, taught to just "do," however nonsensical the concept and homework, and NOT think, that is the modern-day class and concomitant 'teacher,' ... I started investigating things.

Perhaps you should do the same.




< Message edited by Edwynn -- 7/28/2012 10:57:38 AM >

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RE: Mental Illness - 7/28/2012 12:32:27 PM   
Duskypearls


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

I suspect Divine intervention, conferring these superhuman abilities onto you. I do hope that you use them to advantage. This is your path to walk.


Divine or superhuman? I only wish. To this point it's been more of a curse than anything, as it sure does make for a very lonely path. Would that I could find a positive use for it. Any suggestions?

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